"You and others may be assessing him as a backup QB, but I don't believe the Jets are for one second. I think they still see him as possibly Rodgers' successor and a potential FQB." i believe you are 100% correct. Their long term plan must be Rodgers for however long, than ZW. Of course, ZW could bust tremendously the rest of the year. If so, they have a first round draft pick to get a QB if they desire. But suppose ZW continues to develop and becomes a middle of the pack QB at years end. They can keep him. They know what they have. The real issue is paying him, GW,Sauce and a host of other young talented players. The cap, despite workarounds, does have a huge effect on keeping talent. So, performance aside (and assuming his level is adequate at least), its actually the salary demand of ZW when contract renewal comes that might decide if he stays or goes.
Again, that's YOUR opinion, not necessarily that of the Jets. If he continues to improve, I think he WILL be the Jets future starter at QB. I think the Jets believe in him as much as I do. As far as other players failing, the team always shares some blame for a player failing. That said, I never claimed that the team failed Hackenberg, Morgan or Sanchez. I never wanted either Hackenberg or Sanchez. Is Morgan the backup QB that JD drafted? If so, I never wanted him either. I had never even heard of him before the Jets drafted him. Mims may never have developed into a quality player because of his own shortcomings, but he did make a fairly decent contribution his rookie season. He didn't have all the problems dropping the ball. With Mims not being a great route runner, it was stupid for JD to hire a HC who was going to run the WCO which would have made Mims not a good fit and a wasted draft pick. The same is true of drafting Zack. The WCO is at the total opposite end of the spectrum from the offense Zach played in at BYU, and expecting a rookie QB who was used to playinjg in a freewheeling, gunslinging kind of offense, where he threw a lot of off platform throws, to come in and master the WCO, have to change his footwork, and change his style/approach to playing QB 180 degrees and expecting him to start day one was also stupid. JD has admitted that he and the team failed Zach. We have developed those other players because we have a better defensive CS than we did offensive CS, and because playing those other positions are not nearly as difficult as playing QB. Now that Zach is finally getting good coaching from Rodgers, Hackett and Downing, he is learning, improving and showing his talent. He is starting to feel comfortable in the WCO and to understand what is expected of him in this scheme. It would have been so much easier, better for him, the team and the fanbase if JD had hired a HC who would have picked an OC who was a good teacher and who would have utilized a scheme built around Zach's strengths and plays that he used to run at BYU. A number of NFL teams have done that with their rookie QBs and they have almost immediate success. He also would have hired an experienced QB Coach and not had a rookie OC who had never called plays and who had no clue how to teach/develop a rookie QB and a rookie QB Coach, and no quality veteran that could start while Zach sat and learned. If JD had been writing a book on how to destroy a rookie QB, he couldn't have done a better job or come up with more ways to screw Zach than he did.
the jets are locked into his contract at this point. the real way the jets feel will be after his contract is up. this offseason they need to decide if they are picking up his 5th year option. If not then he seems to be the backup to rodgers in 2024 and then we move on. the jets also spoke highly of becton for years but didn't pick up his option. actions speak louder then words and saleh isn't a guy to publicly call out a player on his team. as far as the others go, maybe not you, but many were clamoring for hackenberg saying we ruined him and he is great and we aren't playing him and blah blah. then we traded him and he got cut before playing a game and was out of the NFL. I know you were saying it with mims how the coaches hated him and misused him etc etc then he got traded and couldn't make a roster and was released. he's currently on the steelers PS who are weak at WR badly. they have johnson and pickens. CA3 is a decent WR3 and nothing else on that roster that would even make our team. and he still isn't on the active roster.
yeah but sacks aren't everything. huff only has 3.5 sacks on the season (which ties his career high already) but we can all see he's playing better then those sack numbers suggest.
Yes, salary will play a part. Thankfully, they won't have to give him a new contract until next offseason or at some point during the year, so that won't affect their being able to pay Huff or Becton this offseason. Of course if Zach develops the rest of the season and looks like a FQB, or at least like a very good starting QB, then they will have to make a decision whether to go with the 5th year of his contract, and that would cause issues. It will be interesting to see what happens. If he continues to develop as I think he will, then the Jets are going to have to make some tough decisions. If they can't afford to go with the 5th year of his contract, they may be able to negotiate with him on a cheaper, but incentive-laden contract. At that point, he might be willing to accept it if he's happy here, but he might say he wants to test the market. If he hits FA, they could lose him, or it could cost them a lot more to keep him. I hope that something can be worked out. I'm certain that many here will disagree with me, but I think AR getting injured and Zach having to play this year could be a blessing in disguise. It gives Zach a chance to develop and show the Jets and the rest of the NFL how he can play, and it gives the Jets a chance to evaluate him since he has learned and progressed, and if they determine that they want to keep him they can begin figuring out a way to do that, whereas if he had ridden the pine this season and never played, then almost certainly they wouldn't have picked up the 5th year of his rookie contract. Now they still could or could negotiate to keep him once Rodgers retires. I think Rodgers will only play next year and then he will retire. I think working so hard to get back on the field this season will take a toll on him. If he comes back next season and leads the Jets to the SB victory, and he sees that Zach has developed into a capable, consistent, quality QB, he could ride off into the sunset a winner and with the satisfaction that he helped develop Zach and helped the Jets (or some other team). Rodgers may have no interest in becoming a QB Coach or OC or HC or even running a QB Coaching Company like John Beck, but I think he would be great at it and he could help a lot of QBs develop.
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The Jets may decide that they want to keep him, but can't afford the 5th year of his rookie deal. If so, they may try to negotiate an incentive-laden contract with Zach, or they may just let him walk. I think it will all depend upon whether he continues to improve, gets more and more consistent, and starts having some big games. If so, I think they will see him as their QB of the futre and try to keep him. If he does continue to develop and shows that he is a quality starter, he may be grateful to the Jets and to Rodgers, but he may decide that he doesn't want to sit on the bench for another year or two now that he has proven his worth. If he does prove that he can be a consistent quality starter, they'd be dumb not to try to keep him. I can't imagine anyone every clamoring for Hack. He wasn't that good at PSU and showed absolutely nothing here. Of course, if we had had a qualty QB Coach and OC, and a quality veteran that he could have sat behind and learned from for a year or two, he might have developed, but in his case, I think probably not. With regards to Mims, he either doesn't love football and didn't work that hard to improve, or maybe he's not all that bright. Based on Saleh's and MLF's comments, it did seem that they were mishandling him. I think part of his problem is that he lost confidence, because when he finally got chances to play, he couldn't hold onto the ball. It could be that Saleh just used the excuse of Mims not knowing all 3 WR positions, because his route running was poor, he had trouble getting open, and he wasn't working that hard and/or was having trouble learning the offense. As we know, Saleh doesn't openly criticize his players and he makes some strange comments at times. It also could be that if they had a better coaching staff that was more positive, a different scheme that wasn't so complex, found a package of plays that he could execute well, and spent more time working with him, that he might have developed as Zach is now. Mims had no shot with the Lions even as depleted as their WR corps was. He didn't get there in time to learn their system/scheme, so he was behind the 8 ball. The same thing goes with the Steelers. He didn't know the scheme, had no chemistry with the QB, so how is he supposed to make any kind of impact. He might eventually get activate, and we'll see then, but regardless, I don't care about Mims that much any more. He has shown that he just doesn't have what it takes to be a good route runner or was not willing to put in the work to get there, and he was just likely a bad pick, but keeps getting opportunities because of his size and speed.
IDK look at the giants with danny dimes. he looked like a decent game manager at best on an awful offense and they gave him 40mil a year and he's been awful since. he got paid based on minor improvement but still being a below average QB. that contract is going to burn them badly. zach will be here in 2024 for sure becuase it's fully guarenteed (unless we can swing a trade) but if they feel he is a good backup (which he has been) they will keep him. I just don't see paying him the 5th year option. we cna't pay him 20mil in 2025 and rodgers if he decided to play another year which we don't know. He's coming back for 2024 for sure, he's already said as much. 2025 though everything is up in the air. and people were clamoring for hack and james morgan. the main reason being is the feeling that "he can't be worse then our starter" the reality is, they sure can be. it's always been a saying the most popular player in NY is the backup QB.
I’d be curious how that would work with Zach. If he shows enough improvement, does he sign an incentive laden deal? Both sides have stuck it out with each other, so they’re maybe something where he’s willing to stick it out til Aaron is done in order to get his shot. The jets really have given him ample opportunity to play/win the job. Does he reciprocate down the line?
Well, I think the Giants are nuts. I would never pay $40 million a year for any kind of game manager, even a great one. I despise QBs and offenses like that. Jones wishes he had the talent that Zach has. Zack is on an arc to become a well above average QB. Yes, Zach will be here in 2024 as the backup, but if Rodgers goes down again with injury, or if he tries to come back too early this season, and winds up getting re-injured, he may just go ahead and retire. Either way, I don't think he'll play in 2025. I don't think the Jets will pay Zach the 5th year option even if they wanted to. They couldn't afford it. I think the only way they do that is if he lights it up the end of this season, gets them into the playoffs and leads them to win a playoff game or two. Then they'll know that they have to keep him. Even then, however, I think they'd try to negotiate a new contract for 2025 that would be cheaper, but incentive laden and would have escalators for the number of games he started, reaching certain easily obtained targets, etc., and then the contract would go up in value in the succeeding years. I could be wrong, but I don't think the Jets will count on AR past next season if they are really happy with where Zach is and confident in his ability to be a FQB going forward. I suppose that if he does play at a very high level the rest of the season and proves his worth, and AR indicates that he wants to play in 2025 and possibly longer, the Jets might look to trade him during the offseason. If he has played at a really high level the rest of this season, they could probably get a nice package of picks or picks and a player in return, that could enable them to draft AR's successor, but if Zach has played that well, I'd hope that the Jets would just keep him.
That's the million $ question. He likes AR, and in a sense owes the Jets for sticking with him, but would his competitive nature and desire to keep starting or his desire to make more money win out? Similarly, if Zach were to develop and light it up the rest of this season, since AR and Zach are friends, would AR want to continue to play and result in Zach either having to ride the bench or go elsewhere? It will be interesting to see if that happens.
ZW contract issues are a moot point if he fails to show he can be the leader for quite a number of years. But, if his performance is such the Jets think he is that kind of guy, how do they not keep him? He will cost what he will cost. Otherwise its back to square 1 on a QB search. I don't see that happening. As has been pointed out, the silver lining in the black cloud of Rodgers injury is ZW chance to show off. 10 more games and maybe more if they go to the post. And if they go to the post I don't see them pulling ZW for AR unless there is an injury. The "danger" in this scenario is AR plays in 2024, ZW sits, he shows what he shows in practice, he looks good and they resign. Then he never gets any better, the best of Zach is 2023, and he regresses. Its a really small sample size on which to base a hugely expensive and important contract. I've made all kinds of large and important financial decisions in my life, most of which turned out successfully, but i did have lots of sleepless nights. Good luck to JD, I would not want that job.
their thought was he is better then it seems but doesn't have much help around him. and he was able to use his legs to move the offense. You can look at the numbers and go well he was over 67% completions and had a 3:1TD/INT ratio and had 7 rushing TDs and cut his fumbles down to 6 and did pass for over 3k yards and had very little help. All those numbers suggest a solid QB but he's just really bad when you watch him play. they paid him like a top QB but it's odd because there is a payscale for elite QBs (45mil+) and above average QBs (35-44mil) but not really a pay scale lately for decent starter.
Zach made enough strides this year, where I think at very least he will be getting a second contract. This was unthinkable a year ago, when he was in Josh Rosen territory and worse than PS guys. He is also just 24 years old and who knows, may improve form here. I just wish we had some protection for him and a little better WR room, where guys can get a little separation. I really think the offense could be middle of the pack, instead of 30th in yards and 26th in points, and Zach could prove himself. He is not yet at the level where he can elevate some of the scrubs we have at OLine and WR, but he is I think getting to the level where if they are competent, he can do well also as a starting QB.
Can you name the other quarterbacks on Wilson’s “arc” that have become “well above average QB’s?” I mean is he going to be on a NFL roster? Maybe. What sort of second contract do you think a team is doling out?
If by a second contract, you mean a team signing him to be a backup for a backup's salary, then sure. But anything more than that is a hell no.
