Zach Wilson (MERGED) - All new Zach threads will be merged here after a day

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by BudJet, Oct 9, 2022.

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  1. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for posting this video. I agree with all except point #2. IMO Zach had no chance on that play. He took the snap, went back a step or two and the rusher was upon him. It was pure instinct to try to turn and get away. The rusher was on Zach's blind side. The announcers said that Carter should have adjusted his route to pick the rusher up. In a situation like that, he had no time to throw the ball away. I'm sure that Zach thought he could get away from the rusher and try to make something out of the play. I don't think he really had time to think "I should just fall to the ground and take the 5-yard loss." He was running for his life.

    Tim Jenkins, who IMO is one of the best evaluators of QB play didn't claim that this was a bad play by Zach. He said that the throw that was at Moore's feet was a bad play by Zach. He said that Zach needed to step into the throw and use his hips more. I disagree with him as well. For starters, the Jets' OL was pushed, back in Zach's lap. There was nowhere for him to take a step forward without risking injury to himself or his OL. Secondly, Moore could (should) have caught that ball anyway, and he could have come back for the ball rather than waiting for it to get to him. I believe that if the intended receiver had been G. Wilson, he would have come back a step for that pass and attacked the ball rather than passively waiting.



    Here's another good video analysis of Zach's play this past Sunday by Vitor Paiva: https://jetsxfactor.com/author/vitor-paiva/
     
  2. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    With regards to Zach and long passes and taking the "safe play," I think it's worthwhile to mention at this point that Saleh and LaFleur have been coaching Zach to take the safe play. I hope he doens't get his fearlessness, ability to extend plays, and create coached out of him. He is much more than a game manager. Hopefully, he's decided to just be satisfied with baby steps right now. Do what it takes for the team to win, and as the OL gets healthy and gels, and the offense becomes more efficient and effective, he will take more chances downfield.
     
  3. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

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    I've noticed a few times where our young receivers don't come back to the ball when Zach is flushed out of the pocket or under duress.

    Maybe they got used to Flacco the statue back there...
     
  4. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Excellent point, and I think you're right. I don't know whether some receivers do this naturally or if they have to be coached to do it, but I've noticed that Garrett Wilson tends to do it, but none of the others do. I think they ALL need to be coached to do that regardless of who is at QB. When the QB is under duress, they need to come back towards him unless he gestures for them to take off downfield like Zach did with Davis last year.
     
    #64 NCJetsfan, Oct 12, 2022
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2022
  5. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah... it could also be a (slight) flaw in the system LaFleur runs.
    Receivers are taught to run tight routes and hit a spot on time...
     
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  6. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    It definitely could be a flaw, something that MLF and/or the WR coaches haven't thought about. I would be surprised if that is the case however. Not all routes may be timing routes, but even if they are, that concept is for an ideal world where the QB has a clean pocket and time to step into the throws. As we know, that doesn't always happen. In fact, I'd think that it doesn't happen maybe something like 30-40% of the time. All receivers should be taught that when the QB is under duress, to adjust, to come back for the ball, to attack the ball, not passively stand and wait for it. That's one of the things I love about Garrett Wilson. I was so wrong about him, but am so thankful the Jets have him. He attacks the ball aggressively and snatches it out of the air. he comes back for passes. The rest need to follow suit.
     
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  7. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    This is one of the things I love about your posts in that you are not afraid to admit you are wrong. I recall pre-draft you were a big Burks guy and I said something pro-Wilson in that I felt he was a guy who could beat man coverage which was something the Jets lacked dearly in 2021. You didn't buy it and let me know about it, but a month later you did and changed your stance on Wilson and Burks. Not many people can admit when they are wrong and change. The bottom line is none of us our experts and none have perfect knowledge. We are all wrong quite a bit. None of us are perfect. I feel like I am wrong a lot more than I am right. But the ability to admit mistakes and move on is an admirable and rare quality in our society. Something I know I need to do better. That being said it is great to see you back posting NC and even better to see you posting and seeing the Jets improving every game and winning. It has been a long 12 years. Hopefully this winning thing will become a lot more common.
     
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  8. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, Noam.

    You are right that none of us are perfect and none of us are experts. Therefore, it is silly imo to try and pretend like we are and never admit when we are wrong, especially when we can be wrong as much as when we are right. Also, honesty and integrity are more important to me than being "right." If one cannot admit that one is wrong, then one is living a lie, and one has to constantly remember what one said and keep one's guard up. That's too much trouble, as well as it is no way to live imo. Finally, I'm a Jets fan. I'd rather be wrong and the team make the right move, than be right, and the team struggle.
     
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  9. joe

    joe Well-Known Member

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    Whatever Sam Darnold's shortcomings may be, the idea of him making a 'business decision' (let alone in a "million years" smh) is patently false let alone unfair to the guy.

     
  10. KY Jets Fan

    KY Jets Fan Moderator
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    I agree to an extent but I still think the sack taken by Zach was a "bad play".

    I'm not going to crucify him for it because I want my QB to think that he can make something out of nothing on any given play so I understand why he did what he did. I think that with time, he'll learn when to take the L on certain plays and when he can try to pull a rabbit out of the hat.

    Same with the throw to Elijah. It's really hard to step into a throw when you've got 2-3 300lbs dudes in your lap.

    The great thing about this entire conversation is that the "bad plays" we're discussing aren't back breaking turnovers or some of the really boneheaded mistakes we saw him make early on last year. They're things that you sort of expect out of a young QB who is learning how to play QB at the NFL level. After seeing a lot of breakdowns and the All-22 of the Miami game, I get the feeling that Zach is finally getting comfortable in this offense. He seems much more confident in his reads which is resulting in quicker decisions. He's still got a ways to go but I'm very optimistic about where he currently is and what he can ultimately become.
     
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  11. KY Jets Fan

    KY Jets Fan Moderator
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    Here's another Zach film breakdown by Luke Grant:

     
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  12. mezzavo

    mezzavo Well-Known Member

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    What you talkin' bout Willis?? I AM practically PERFECT in every way!!! Wait...maybe that's Mary Poppins!o_Oo_O

    I have been wrong about quite a few things with this iteration of the Jets. Saleh, Wilson, Quinnen... Hardest on Douglas. I'm happy to admit I was wrong and look forward to the progress of the team!
     
  13. KY Jets Fan

    KY Jets Fan Moderator
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    Woof...please nobody go back and look at my WR rankings going into the draft.

    Pretty sure I had GW as my 4th-5th best WR :oops:

    C'est la vie. Happy he's a Jet now!!
     
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  14. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    Welcome back. I have always loved your posts and insight found that I have learned a lot from reading your posts. Quite happy to see you back. These last 12 years have been rough on all Jet fans and we all have dealt with it in different ways. Hopefully, this is not a mirage and we are indeed on our way back to being relevant. Nice to see good Jet fans returning.
     
  15. cval

    cval Well-Known Member

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    I would like to see the kid play this year. Gase to Ruhl is not good for any QB. Geno is also proving that it takes more than 2 years for most to become a good QB.
     
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  16. Lon Chaney

    Lon Chaney Well-Known Member

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    Passing TDs in the NFC East after week 5

    Jones 3
    Rush 4
    Hurts 4
    Wentz 10

    Just for reference
     
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  17. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    Some things I have noticed watching tape is Wilson's mechanics have improved significantly in two areas. His drop is much calmer and he is not bouncing on the back foot and he is doing better with his left foot and using his hips to power and align his throws. Where he seems to struggle is on throws to his right with that left foot. His play fakes are much much better. His use of eyes to freeze safeties and LBs is really really good. He is far from a finished product but it definitely appears he did work in the off-season. But, pretty much all his problems begin with confidence and being comfortable. A better test will be when he is hit with more adversity and let's see then how his mechanics and poise hold out. But, the early data looks encouraging. I love the confidence he is playing with. One can really project and be excited where he and this offense will be when things start clicking.
     
  18. cval

    cval Well-Known Member

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    He still needs to work on getting through his progression quicker but that is part of growing as a QB and vets still struggle with this. It also helps when you are throwing to Garrett Wilson, Elijah Moore and Cory Davis. I think the emergence of Garrett Wilson has helped Cory a lot. He seems to perform much better when it is not all on him.

    When the fourth quarter rolls around and those D-linemen are tired and Zach can step-up and throw on time to that talented group of receivers it is not a fluke the offense is good in the fourth quarter.
     
  19. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    Having G. Wilson being able to beat Man, having Conklin as a viable option over the middle and Hall and Carter out of the backfield really helps everyone. Once this offense starts clicking and making teams pay for stacking the box it will become a very dangerous offense. Then throw in a few Berrios end arounds and there will be some really upset DL. Everything is there for success they just need lots of reps together.
     
  20. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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