Would You Want Any 2022 Coaching Candidates over Robert Saleh or any Rookie QB Over Zach Wilson?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by The Dark Knight, Jan 11, 2022.

  1. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    I'd take an established veteran #2 who has started in the past over Zach Wilson in a heartbeat for 2022.

    I'd look to draft a QB in the middle rounds this year if the talent was there and then focus on the 2023 and 2024 drafts with an eye on a QB but not up high.
     
  2. IDFjet

    IDFjet Well-Known Member

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    This is a good question--Mills doesn't have the pedigree and could turn into a 1-hit wonder like Minshew. That's the risk.
     
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  3. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Well-Known Member

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    Why? I expect a big jump from Zach Wilson in 2022. A jump so big that it makes the struggles in 2021 worth it. The Jets expect something similar. You'd rather have Andy Dalton or Ryan Fitzpatrick? Doesn't make sense.
     
  4. Cman65

    Cman65 The Dark Admin, 2018 BEST Darksider Poster

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    I just think of what might have been if we had hired Mike McCarthy instead of Gase..
     
  5. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

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    Is it all that playoff success that has you dreaming?
     
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  6. Jedi mind tricks

    Jedi mind tricks Well-Known Member

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    You think so?? Imagine having 2 top 10 picks in draft stacked with QB talent. The options would be endless
     
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  7. Cman65

    Cman65 The Dark Admin, 2018 BEST Darksider Poster

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    I think we would have at least stopped being a punchline. "He's coaching to where Football is headed".. Fckn pencil neck twerp set this franchise back years...
     
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  8. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

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    I don't fire them because I am informed enough to understand that Rome did not get built in a day and there were situations that arose that were not conducive to a quick turnaround. At the same time I do not endorse the job that they did and put them on notice that the performance was not acceptable. Patting everybody on the back when they have just shit in their own beds is not how to hold anyone responsible. But losing thirteen games is apparently fine with you because you defend giving them a high grade. For what it's worth, I took a stand on all of the "grading" topics opened here and will defend how I got to them without any reference to what other people are doing other than the ones mentioned in the thread titles.
     
  9. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

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  10. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    90% of rookie QB's that had the season Zach just did are worthless sinks of a team's energy and just prolong the misery.

    I don't get excited over 10% shots any more.

    The point about getting a proven vet to play QB for us in 2022 is that it would let LaFleur and company install the offense. It would be easy to move on from that guy when a real QB prospect emerges.
     
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  11. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    Garappolo could be available and he has a familiarity with LaFleur & Saleh. That’s a no brainer
     
  12. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    16 games played once in his career.

    Real talent but like an egg back there.
     
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  13. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Well-Known Member

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    When a QB is in a tough situation, he tends to not play great. Trevor Lawrence and Zach Wilson were in tough situations this year. I expect both to be much better in 2022. Mac Jones was in a good situation. He played pretty good. Sometimes football is not rocket science. I get why fans are worried, nothing is a sure thing and he struggled this year, but I feel good about Zach Wilson.

    The Jets are trying to build a Super Bowl contender. They have avoided the short cuts to just be a mediocre team, like signing a veteran QB to start, to go all in on this rebuild. I respect it. Hopefully it works.

    Teams only have so much patience in the NFL though. If Wilson does struggle like you are worried about, the Jets will adjust their plan pretty quick. I don't think they will have to though. :)
     
    #73 The Dark Knight, Jan 14, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2022
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  14. CotcheryFan

    CotcheryFan 2018 ROTY Poster Award Winner

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    I miss that show. The Late Show version of him just isn't the same.
     
  15. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    I do not have confidence that the Jets will adjust on the fly to problems next season. It's too easy for them to say that Zach is young and just having momentary problems adjusting to the NFL.

    The vast majority of QB's that have the level of problems that Zach had this year have them because they're not good enough to play in the NFL.

    The Jets are trying to sell the notion that no Int's in the last 5 games represents progress. What the last 5 games actually look like is this:

    142 attempts for 72 completions for 795 yards with 3 TD's and no Int's.

    Over a 16 game season that turns into the following line:

    454 attempts for 230 completions, a 50.6 completion percentage, for 2,544 yards and 5.6 yards per attempt for 10 TD's and zero Int's.

    However it is worse than that because Zach also took 19 sacks in those 5 games for -159 yards. Zach's average yards per dropback over the last 5 games where he was throwing no picks was just over 5 yards.

    So we're being sold the "big improvement" line when in fact the end of the season was no better than the beginning, it was just bad in a different way.
     
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  16. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    Made that argument myself while it was happening and it got people really upset on here. Throwing the football a lot less, and throwing balls straight into the ground is not really improvement at the standard of an NFL QB, even if it means less interceptions. Moving the chains would be improvement
     
  17. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, but you are forgetting what I said in other posts: Zach Wilson started to progress and improve while the rest of his offense got worse. He lost Corey Davis, Elijah Moore, Jamison Crowder and even Braxton Berrios all during that 5 game stretch you talked about. He lost all of his running backs at one point or another. He had no TE's (all year). Lost his starting center, left tackle, AVT for a game, etc. The whole offense was moving around the final 5 games. He was the only constant really. That was impressive to see a rookie handle it all. So you can't just say his stats are similar to the beginning of the year or not that good overall, because it is more complicated than that.

    Side note: The no interceptions the final 5 games actually is really impressive. You'd think one of the WR's would mess up a route or communication would be off on a play or two or Zach would make a mistake. That is actually amazing he did not throw any.

    Another problem with your argument is you expect the same results in 2022. That is not the case. The team will be better. Zach will be better. They are called rookie growing pains for a reason. Again, I get why fans are worried or don't believe and want the team to actually show them before they get excited, but I think you can see where Zach and the team are headed.
     
  18. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that Brad used to make reasonable arguments.
     
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  19. NoodleArm

    NoodleArm Well-Known Member

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    I've got no problem with the Zach Wilson pick based on talent. His tape does pop, and his physical attributes are right up there with the best QB talent in the 2021 and 2022 draft classes. Sure, he's raw, but there's no more risk with him than say Ridder or Corral. And, while reasonable minds can disagree, I'm of the opinion that it's too late for him to be benched.

    Saleh is a different story. Rarely do coaches w/o a QB background, or prior HC experience, succeed with young rosters, much less with a young rookie QB. It would have been more prudent to go with Jim Harbaugh. Or, if any of the following could pass psychological evaluation, O'Brien, Pederson, or (gasp) McDaniels. (Psych, definitely important for the last one.) I'd still take Bienemy or Daboll over Saleh; of the '22 class, Nagy, or Flores over Saleh.

    Any would have handled the grooming and QB transition better than Saleh did. It was not fair to start Wilson week one, and it wasn't fair to start him so soon after his injury. Wilson wasn't ready and, ultimately, it should not be talent, but readiness that determines when rookies play. The coaching is so bad that I'm unsure that any of us have accurate reads on Wilson. For a long portion of the season, the kid we saw in a Jets uni looked completely different than the one who wore a BYU uni last year. That is largely on Saleh.

    Wouldn't be surprised to see a big jump from Wilson. But that would largely be because the grooming and coaching will/should be less atrocious in 2022.
     
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  20. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    It's hard to make the claim that Gase set us back years when the guy before him went 5-11 three years in a row and the guy after him just had the season Saleh had.

    The Jets have been in lockstep taking steps back over the last decade. It is what best defines the franchise over that period.

    If I was to define why the Jets are where they are right now I would put Douglas #1 on the hit parade and Maccagnan hot on his tail. I'd put Bowles #3 on the list for failing to develop an offense aside from the potluck special in 2015. I'd put Gase and Saleh equally on the list after that for general ineptitude and failing to get even an average effort out of the talent they were given, which was not much.
     
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