Would You Want Any 2022 Coaching Candidates over Robert Saleh or any Rookie QB Over Zach Wilson?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by The Dark Knight, Jan 11, 2022.

  1. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

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    I've watched a lot of Fields. At this point I think they are both about equal. I will say that I am a bit shocked that Wilson proved to be more durable than Fields. Wilson also ran for more TD's, which is shocking.
     
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  2. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    No, not at all. Fields has amazing athletic gifts but he is an extremely raw prospect who really should have never seen the field in 2021. I thought he made some impressive plays this year with his arm and his legs. But, he has a lot of work to do on learning a pro offense and avoiding hits

    One of the biggest red flags for Fields in college was how poorly he did under pressure taking sacks at twice the rate of guys who were good under pressure like Wilson and Jones and also running from the pocket at a ridiculously high rate. We can see this did not translate well into the pros with a high sack rate, a crazy amount of fumbles with 12 in limited play, lots of really hard hits where he was not aware of the defender, and as most people expected a lot of time on the injured list. But, from all accounts he is a really smart kid, hard worker, lots of charisma with very high character. Give him a few years to get comfortable, overhaul his mechanics, learn to understand defenses, while not overwhelming him and he could be a bigtime top 10 QB. Will he get that time to develop and learn slowly? Chicago, has a really good defense and could support a young QB but the new coaches need to buy in and be patient. I hope the kid succeeds as he sounds like a really good kid who was put in a bad spot this year.
     
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  3. cval

    cval Well-Known Member

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    The grass is always greener on the other side. I would take any of them then bitch why we did not take the other one.
     
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  4. jcass10

    jcass10 Well-Known Member

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    Saleh hasn't showed me enough to think he isn't anything more than replacement level. Thats not to say he cant improve, but I dont think he's overachieved or underachieved this year. He's just kind of there.

    Zach is probably a better prospect than anyone coming out this year. That doesn't mean he is going to end up a better player, but I dont know these guys well enough to make that trade. I do like Pickett though, so if he's better I wouldnt be overly surprised.
     
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  5. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    I'm just saying there's a very real chance this team goes 4-13 or something like that again next year, in which case it will be clear that the Douglas-Saleh-Wilson trio is terrible.
     
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  6. ouchy

    ouchy Well-Known Member

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    Here is an honest question for the Wilson believers. Would you trade Zach for Davis Mills straight up. Or do you feel Zach has a brighter future than Mills?
     
  7. cval

    cval Well-Known Member

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    There is also a real chance we win 8+ plus games next season and are fighting for a playoff spot. In which case it will be clear the Trio is pretty good.
     
  8. K'OB

    K'OB 2021 TGG Fantasy Football Champ

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    I'll guess the answer is no.

    I did watch something the other day that said that if Mills had stayed in college and came out this year he would likely go top 5 if not #1.
     
    #28 K'OB, Jan 11, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2022
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  9. K'OB

    K'OB 2021 TGG Fantasy Football Champ

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    Did he really?

    I didn't realise that tbh, I used to watch a lot more of the highlights but with the Jets being so shit it knocked all the fun out of seeing other teams doing smart plays lol
     
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  10. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    We'll have to agree to disagree on this one, because that saying makes zero sense to me. What good is a great defense, if the OL sucks and the QB has no weapons around him? He may get more opportunities, but without blocking, a running attack or anyone who can get open or catch the ball, he won't develop or succeed. You make it sound like the OL and weapons are only marginally important and nothing could be further from the truth.
     
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  11. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    I do not know enough about Mills to say. But, I will say Wilson has everything one should want in a QB. His ability to read defenses and process pre and post snap is as good as you can find in a prospect. The off platform plays are sexy but what is really exciting was watching him execute the offense so efficiently in weeks 15 to 17. His ability to read and get the ball out on time is what makes him special. Against TB the accuracy of his throws into tight windows was spectacular but I do not think that is something any qb can do consistently but what was better washis average time holding the ball of 2.38 seconds. Presnap read, moving and holding safeties with his eyes and bam the ball is out. That is what makes me excited. If he can continue to do that he will be very very good. His question marks are mental. Can he keep his confidence and perform under adversity and pressure? I do not know and I will not say he will be great but he certainly is playing well at a very high level with no supporting cast and is should give us optimism.
     
  12. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, if that happens, then it will definitely not age well. :D I don't think that will happen though. Also, if it does happen, I may have to officially give up on the team. They are my last hope!

    No one is trading Wilson for Mills. Definitely not Wilson believers. Making any sudden move like that after one season would be ridiculous, even in a hypothetical. Mills did impress me though. I should have added him but only listed 1st Round QB's.

    Mac is a nice fit for New England, but I don't think he would do that well in most situations. Especially not with the Jets. I'm starting to think @ouchy is not a Wilson fan! I'd definitely take him over Jones. Mac will be a solid NFL QB though, which is why he went in the 1st Round too.
     
  13. ouchy

    ouchy Well-Known Member

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    Its not a question of being a fan of Wilson as much as its just being tired of the same old script. If we use a top 5 pick on a QB I want them to look like Barrow, or Herbert, or Murray did in year 1 and leave little doubt they are the FQB for years. When we use a pick as valuable as Zachs pick was, its not too much to ask that they look like a winner after a season. It just never happens for us. Instead we replace the worst rated starter in the league for the new worst rated starter.

    The "he looked better the last few games" is the exact same script as Darnold's rookie year. Calls for "lets see his jump in year two", etc. I've seen this plotline before and I just wish we could have the winner plotline for once. I mean it was probably the most valuable trade value pick we've ever had. Cant we get the good stuff from it?

    If anything the Zach pick makes me not a fan of JD. I don't mind Wilson. I just wanted to see more from him and now I'm in pure show me mode. Sam used up the last of my QB homering.
     
  14. ouchy

    ouchy Well-Known Member

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    Honest question. If Wilson went to NE, do you think he'd have done as well as Jones did?
     
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  15. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    The simple answer is yes by a large margin. But instead lets just switch out two games from each qbs schedule. Let Wilson play 2 games against our defense while playing for NE and not against NE and switch the same for Jones and then their stats will be about equal in terms of TD/Int ratio for the season.

    I thought Sam Darnold had the worst QB situation ever but that was year 2 and 3. What Wilson had for support this year was epically bad. According to PFF he played the hardest defensive schedule of any QB in the NFL, he had the worst defense in the league, he played with OL that could not block, he played most of the year with his skill players hurt or just coming off injuries and he likely had more drops by his receivers than anyone. Hard to find a rookie QB ever put in a worse situation.
     
    #35 Noam, Jan 11, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2022
  16. JetsUK

    JetsUK Well-Known Member

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    Yes - I think he would have done as well if not better - the NE team is very well coached and has a lot of quality starters - none of those are present with the Jets.

    I haven't looked at any of the 2022 candidates but the issue with this team is far more one of talent than coaching - no-one is winning with this team - in terms of the 2022 rookie QBs, I haven't seen any that look anything special - 2023 on the other hand is a very different kettle of fish and if we end up with a top 3 pick in 2022 (which is very possible) then I wouldn't be that surprised to see them take another QB (and so destroy another career)
     
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  17. Footballgod214

    Footballgod214 Well-Known Member

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    After 1 season, it's pretty clear JD walked away from the 49ers trade down offer of 3 1st and a 2nd for the privilege of swapping out one bad QB for another.

    Again, this is after just one season. If we had kept Sam our record would be about the same as it was with Zack, but if we DID keep Sam, JD would have a MEGA bank account in future draft picks. Now that MEGA bank account belongs to the Fish who drafted one pick after we did.

    Look, Zack HAS to turn into a true FQB to justify the cost to the team of drafting him that high. Just being 'better than Sam' isn't even close enough. He has to be light years better than Sam. He has to be Sam Darnold plus 3 1st round draft picks better just to break even.

    If I was Joe Douglas, I'd be super concerned about his crowning jewel's future development. Joe's career will go no further than Zacks.
     
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  18. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    How can anyone honestly think that Wilson did a good job at reading defenses pre-snap? Part of the reason we were wrecked by the blitz all year is because we had a young quarterback that struggled to help his guys figure out who was coming and who wasn’t. And when it did come and there was an unblocked man, he had no idea which leads to a lot of sacks.

    Watch some veteran quarterbacks this weekend and how they operate if they fuck the protection up. They immediately know it and know where the ball has to go.

    Not to say it can’t be a learned skill and usually gets better, but some of this stuff is just ridiculous with the optimism OR you’re not assessing proper blame for these offensive failures.
     
  19. CotcheryFan

    CotcheryFan 2018 ROTY Poster Award Winner

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    We would've gotten three 1st rounders for the 2nd pick?
     
  20. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    No, I wouldn't. Zach has a brighter future. I'm not saying that Mills isn't good, but I think Zach performed well in the most intense media market there is. I stand by my assessment from last year before the draft: Zach is the best QB in the class.
     
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