With the 10th pick..

Discussion in 'Draft' started by KY Jets Fan, Jan 7, 2024.

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Who do you pick if all these are still available at Pick#10

  1. Rome Odunze (WR)

    30.2%
  2. Brock Bowers (TE)

    17.5%
  3. Fashanu or another OL

    41.3%
  4. I rather trade down if these are my choices

    11.1%
  1. abyzmul

    abyzmul R.J. MacReady, 21018 Funniest Member Award Winner

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    At this point it's Bowers or one of the WRs, I think Douglas will take a player that provides immediate production.

    Just no defense.
     
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  2. LAJet

    LAJet Well-Known Member

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    The dilemma in my view is centered around our long term need for a LT. From that perspective if the right guy is there for the long term we must strike. But for immediate contribution in year one, having a stud WR along Williams and Wilson, or a new no kidding threat at TE trumps the backup OL roll. Keep Becton one more year and is even less of an immediate concern. So, it boils down to do we build for the future, or do we give AR another weapon starting on game one. IMO two different paths and two different outcomes. in any event, as long as we strenghten the offense, I would be happy with either.
     
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  3. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias Well-Known Member

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    If they take defense our fan base is going flip out. We are stacked on defense. We need OL or WR. TE I think we are fine at, especially when Rodgers doesn't throw to them as much. I wouldn't mind Bowers but it's more of a luxury pick imo.
     
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  4. NJJets

    NJJets Well-Known Member

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    Dude, Bill Belicheck has dumped countless players because they didn’t understand the playbook. You may think Gronk is a big dumb pollock but he’s not at all, especially when it comes to football. You’re being ridiculous when people are asking valid questions like-

    Is he actually a TE or is he a HB/Big Slot?

    Can he block and be an every down TE, or is it pretty obvious he’s in for passing plays?

    If he has to play multiple positions, does he understand and execute all route and blocking concepts at each position? Is his football IQ high enough to do so?

    FFS man these are completely valid questions when talking about drafting a TE at 10. They’re especially valid when the answer to everything seems to be “he’s not a TE, he’s a special talent”.
     
  5. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    If you've read my posts over the past years you'll know that I AM very upset that Douglas hasn't solved this problem and has put us in this position, but that's the sad reality: he has put us in this position, and we do need an OT who can come in and play decently for at least 5-6 games more than likely. Unless you're making the argument that Bowers is so good, and will form a great connection with Rogers right off the bat, that it will negate the need to have a competent back up OT for some number of games this year.

    Are you saying that Bowers is better than GW? Because as good - great really - as GW has been, he didn't transform this team or prevent the usual flame out. No, it was a failure of the OL - AGAIN! - that was the biggest reason.

    "You've got to walk before you can run", and in the NFL this means you've got to block before you can do anything else. The Jets haven't proven they can block yet.
     
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  6. REVISion

    REVISion Well-Known Member

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    Who cares? Why get caught up in these questions when he's clearly a proven, versatile offensive weapon? He's been producing at a high level in by far the hardest conference in college football since he was a freshman. He had 900 receiving yards and 13 TDs as a freshman at Georgia.

    I've watched him play quite a bit at this point. He can run the ball. He can take screens to the house. He's effective over the middle and down the field. He has amazing hands, probably the best hands of any WR or TE in the draft.

    Could he have done all of these different things so well vs. such good competition if he didn't have a high football IQ?

    The level to which people are overthinking with Bowers is wild at this point.

    Seriously, just go watch him play. There's a real chance he's the best offensive skill position player in this draft. At worst he's top 2-3. Let's not overthink this.
     
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  7. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    There are several problems with what I bolded:

    First, it's not like I'm saying he should take a OT at #10 who will be a career backup. If that were the case, of course it would be stupid to waste a #10 on such a player. But in fact, the assumption is that you can get an OT at #10 who could not only fill in this season when it's almost certain that one or both OT will miss time, but who can become the OT of the future. And a good OT, specifically a LT, is like gold and much more valuable than any other position than QB when you factor in expected longevity of their career.

    Second, you're assuming that Bowers will come in Day 1 and be the starter over two other decent veterans who already know this offense (such as it is). That's highly unlikely if not impossible, so Bowers isn't really assured of "Starting every game".

    Third, you're dismissing the value of insurance. The reason you buy insurance is that you hope you never need it, but you understand that if you ever do you'll be happy you have it, and also that you'd be likely screwed without it.

    Finally, the odds of the Jets experiencing basically "zero" performance from their two current TEs, is nil, while the odds of them experiencing "zero" from one of their OTs is pretty high. IOW: The Jets can weather not having Bowers, but they can't weather not having a decent OT.
     
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  8. NJJets

    NJJets Well-Known Member

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    I care, because the last time I was told “seriously just go watch him play” was Zach Wilson. He looked great enough in college too.

    A TE who’s had over 50% of his college receptions be from behind the LoS is a classic case of a guy who excels due to his athleticism. As far as watching him, I’ve seen a decent amount of his games given the program he plays for, and I’ve watch all of his highlight videos as nauseum. His athleticism jumps out at you, but nothing that really shows his intelligence. It seems UGA’s prevailing gameplan with him was “here take the ball and go use your athleticism”. That shit does not work in the NFL. There is massive reason for concern with Bowers, he’s a classic boom or bust profile.
     
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  9. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    With regards to the OT position and the draft, it's not one or the other, it's both as a backup for this season and as a future starter. Why can't you see that? You're a knowledgeable poster.

    Why should we be upset the Jets haven't signed another OT? Who are they gonna sign? Bakhtiari? He's made of glass and is less likely to be healthy than Smith is. Charles Leno, Jr.? No other team is rushing out to sign him or Bakhtiari. Besides, where are the Jets going to get the money to pay either? I don't know where they got the money to pay Davis. The last I saw of where they were in terms of the cap, they didn't even have enough to pay their draft picks, and the options are limited for getting cap space and not wrecking future caps.
     
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  10. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    ROFLOL There have been plenty of good arguments posted here why drafting an OT is more important than adding Bowers. You just don't want to hear them or can't because your mind is closed and you're sold on Bowers. Just admit that.

    The Jets have had injury issues for the last 3-5 years on the OL and at OT, and overall their OL play has been awful. It's not an over reaction at all to say that OT needs to be the pick in the first round when we don't have a single quality young OT on the roster, and more than likely will need two new starting OTs next year. You act as if OTs just grow on trees and that the Jets will be able to draft two starting caliber OTs in next year's draft, or miraculously somehow Carter Warren or Mitchell will develop in quality starters. The Jets are sure not going to have cap space next year to go out and sign two quality OT starters, if there are even any available in FA next season. You have a completely cavalier attitude regarding the OL, and Rodgers' health. Hopefully, JD doesn't have the same attitude, or this season is going down the tubes and the Jets will be looking at starting over next season with a new GM and new CS.

    Further, you're completely ignoring the fact of Hackett's incompetence and to assume that he will re-design his offense to take advantage of what Bowers brings to the table is delusional imo.
     
    #1210 NCJetsfan, Apr 12, 2024
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2024
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  11. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    The Jets drafted another TE not too long ago where 50-60% of his collegiate receptions were within 1-2 yards of the LOS or behind the LOS and he didn't exactly pan out, but I guess the guys who want Bowers have completely forgotten about Jace Amaro. To be clear, I'm not saying that Amaro is in the same time zone as Bowers in terms of talent and potential. Still, that should be a concern. Things aren't going to be as loose and free in the NFL as they were in college.

    I don't doubt that Bowers can become a great TE in the NFL with the right team. The Jets aren't it, however due to Hackett being the OC and the OL issues this team has.
     
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  12. Trainer

    Trainer Well-Known Member

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    Gronk admitted post retirement that he never studied the playbook. He said he didn't need to because Brady knew the whole thing and would just tell him what route to run in the huddle.
     
  13. Trainer

    Trainer Well-Known Member

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    Conklin - league average
    Ruckert -16 catches all season
    Yeboah - special teamer
    Kuntz - practice squad
    Combined they have seven touchdowns over their entire careers. That includes Conklin's four seasons with Kirk Cousins.
    My definition of 'loaded' is a little different than yours.
    All that aside, Bowers and Conklin would both be starting. Bowers would not take snaps from Conklin.
    This is the "All in" season, Douglas is highly likely to take an offensive weapon at 10 above all else because if the Jets don't make the playoffs he's not back next year.
     
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  14. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    Ok this is just ridiculous. Brock Bowers an academic all American is being questioned for his smarts in comparison to Rob Gronkowski
     
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  15. Jets79

    Jets79 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah…to me the argument isn’t about is Bowers smart enough, or even if he’s going to prove to be a very good NFL TE honestly. Are there some questions? Sure, as with every prospect there are questions. Guys who are the most athletic guy in college and succeed because of that sometimes don’t have the same level of success in the NFL because EVERYONE in the NFL is a great athlete…so they can’t “out-athlete” the other guy in the NFL. So I think there are questions, however valid they may be.

    I’m not saying Bowers won’t be a good NFL TE. Honestly I haven’t watched enough college ball to say. But from what I have seen and what I read, I’m assuming he’ll be very good. He’s played for a powerhouse team in the best conference, so the competition level is tops.

    All that being said, the argument isn’t really (at least to me) about IF Bowers will be a good TE or not. I’ll grant that he will be.

    To me, the question is one of relative value. I think an LT is more valuable than a TE in 99% of the cases….maybe the one or two exceptions are guys like Kelce or Kittle. Maybe Bowers will be in that neighborhood.

    However, the relative value of an OT, and more specifically an LT, is such that I’d go tackle over TE all day long. This argument about drafting a backup player with the 10th to me holds no water. Firstly, we NEED a long term answer at OT, at both spots. And on top of that, it’s almost a guarantee that at least one of our starting tackles will miss a few games. History has shown that. So the need is Long Term as well as This Year.

    Go OT in a draft that’s supposedly strong at the position.
     
  16. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    Beat me to it. One of only a small handful from the entire SEC.

    Draft season never fails to give rise to kooky-talk.
     
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  17. tomdeb

    tomdeb Well-Known Member

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    Say what? Bowers and Conklin BOTH starting? First I've heard that anybody asserted that. Permanent two-tight end offense?
    Bowers would not take snaps from Conklin? Why would the jets draft him then if it is a "shared" TE position as you assert.
    Again, not saying you are wrong, but I have not heard any of that.
    In an "all in" season as you assert, it is even more crucial to get on that OL in round 1. If either of our tackles go down, we are screwed !
    If we take Bowers and Bowers goes down, we are still okay.
    If we take Bowers and have a major injury w our injury prone LT, we are screwed.
    THEN, we will wish we had fortified the OL.
    Douglas has already wasted 1st round picks on Becton, Zach, and McDonald.
    Yeah, he'll likely add to his first round busts and draft a TE we don't need who can't block a LB.
     
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  18. chandler

    chandler Well-Known Member

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    if the prime criteria is OL depth isn't the wiser choice FA or trade a mid round pick for a known commodity

    There are plenty of first round OL (even highly picked) who struggled mightily in year 1.

    ANd regarding the argument about Bowers being more athletic and that might not translate to the pros, the same is true for OL. All of a sudden all the D line is huge and fast with more technique.

    The best you can do is play the board. BPA, maximize value. Move up or down to exploit what you see as opportunities.

    Plugging holes is FA and trades
     
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  19. Kronoking

    Kronoking Well-Known Member

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    That's because your entire outlook take is built on the foundation of a bubble logic. Which to thrive basically needs to ignore any real grounded in reality projection on what this offense and it's weekly gameplans will probably end up looking like with an aging out of the league Rodgers and a completely incompetent OC at it's helm.

    I'd argue strongly that the outcome and how well we adjust on the OL to those at least 5 games Tyron is likely going to miss in 2024 will have a greater impact in the W-L column then the minimal amount of production Hackett is going to squeeze out of year 1 TE prospect. In fact and with the an even slightly optimistic projection outlook on Mike Williams I'd happily take the under there on Bowers managing to match either Conklin's 2023 61 catches or 621 yards in this upcoming 2024 offense.

    This isn't Miami. The opportunity for more in a VERY run heavy offense, with limited creativity potential, just isn't going to be there.
     
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  20. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    So we’ll spend our first round pick (and cap money you’re so concerned about) on a backup likely to pay maybe a quarter of the season? And that’s the argument?
     
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