Who would you take at 4?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by KY Jets Fan, Feb 24, 2022.

?

Who ya taking TGG??

  1. Ikem Ekwonu

    7 vote(s)
    12.5%
  2. Kayvon Thibodeaux

    45 vote(s)
    80.4%
  3. Other (comment who below)

    4 vote(s)
    7.1%
  1. Red Menace

    Red Menace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2008
    Messages:
    8,879
    Likes Received:
    7,795

    It has nothing to do with emotional picks, it has everything to do with scheme and what player fits the scheme better. Saleh wants a fierce pass rush that can create problems without compromising big plays behind the secondary.

    If KT is available as the OP asked, I wouldn’t hesitate to draft him. With regards to the the money, it should not be a consideration if KT can be the Jets version of Joey Bosa.

    Hopefully Lawson can stay healthy for two seasons and Jets get something out of him for the amount of money they are paying him, but to this point in his football career he has not fulfilled any of his potential and I wouldn’t go into next season relying on him only if Jets have a chance at KT.
     
  2. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    33,236
    Likes Received:
    26,639
    Not for nothing, but JD had to focus on 1st things first - getting a QB and fixing the trenches. The offense isn't exactly overflowing with playmakers, either. He's added Mims and Moore and Carter. We had Maye, and he added Hall, Echols, MC II, and Huff to help solidify the D.

    I believe that this year and next he will start adding playmakers.
     
    NYJetsO12 likes this.
  3. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    33,236
    Likes Received:
    26,639
    Yes it does. Just because the Jets don't take Hamilton, doesn't mean that they can't or won't take a S in the 2nd or 3rd round. Safeties don't have to be taken in the 1st round and usually aren't. Besides, the D still needs to take a back seat to the offense. When you draft a QB, you need to build around him. JD has finished with that yet. Stud defensive playmakers can wait.
     
  4. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    33,236
    Likes Received:
    26,639
    I agree that money shouldn't be a problem if the Jets draft KT. They're not paying Lawson THAT much, and if they draft a stud Edge, then Lawson will probably be gone by the time the Edge they draft is due for a 2nd contract.

    I totally disagree with you that "to this point in his football career he (Lawson) has not fulfilled any of his potential." Red that's an absurd comment. You're better than that. You don't get all the QB pressures and hits that he has gotten if you haven't been playing at a very high level and haven't fulfilled any of his potential. They shouldn't rely on him because he's coming off an achilles injury, and those usually take over a year from which to recover, and because JFM is better at DT than he is at Edge, and Huff isn't a starting caliber Edge.
     
    Red Menace likes this.
  5. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    22,308
    Likes Received:
    22,069
    good post. Thibodeux is a no-brainer selection for the Jets
     
  6. boozer32

    boozer32 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    5,489
    Likes Received:
    3,719
    I just don't think Kayvon is that type of guy. If he were anywhere near as good as Jets fans are hyping him he would go higher and definitely before Hutchinson and Karlaftis. I just think this is a position the Jets have no luck at. But if he is the pick maybe the Jets get lucky. I'm not expecting Lawson back till at least the 4th game.
     
    Red Menace likes this.
  7. WilsonJetsFan

    WilsonJetsFan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    322
    Likes Received:
    856
    A lot of people are saying this, but it doesn't make sense to me. We already have a great edge in Lawson, and we would be using a #4 pick just in case our already-on-the-roster great edge goes down.
    But we do not have a great safety on the roster. Or a great tight end or right guard. Using a #4 pick on someone who can be there in case of an injury seems questionable to me when we have other huge holes with no significant talent already filling the spot. I would love for this roster to be so stacked in every position that we should use a #4 pick improving our depth, but we're a long way from that place IMHO.

    I would prefer to use the pick on a C or RG, and I would be fine with a safety. Using the #4 pick on a position where we've already got a very good talent is questionable in my book.
     
  8. Red Menace

    Red Menace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2008
    Messages:
    8,879
    Likes Received:
    7,795

    I can get on board with your points about the injury taking longer to heal than expected, and JFM being played out of position, however I stand by my point with regards to Lawson not fulfilling his potential.


    He was injured in Cincinnati as well and Bengals moved on from him giving Hendrickson a much bigger contract than Lawson received from Jets.

    There is a pattern to Lawsons career up to this point, and it’s not one that inspires a lot of confidence, especially if I’m the GM that’s counting on him being a big time player for Jets.

    Stats like hurries and pressure on the QB are ok but I don’t put as much stake in them as sacks, if Lawson was that big of piece to Bengals defense they would not have let him go. They did better without him on defense, that is very revealing to me.

    I hope he comes back healthy and has two monster years and earns that money. I have my doubts about him though and what he can be for Jets.
     
    westiedog1 and ColoradoContrails like this.
  9. boozer32

    boozer32 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    5,489
    Likes Received:
    3,719
    Exactly the same argument I have against drafting Thibodeaux. We got huge money tied up in the position with Lawson and JFM. I do not think there is a guard worthy of the #4 or #10 pick unless its Ekwonu. It will be interesting to see which direction Douglas goes in. But one thing is for certain he needs to get this team improving and not 2 or 3 years from now but this year. So free agency will tell us what direction he is going. The draft will hopefully bring it together.
     
  10. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    33,236
    Likes Received:
    26,639
    It makes total sense. Allow me to explain. First, Lawson is coming of a torn Achilles. Those can take over a year from which to fully recover. Even then, some athletes are never the same. They don't have quite the same burst or speed. Hopefully, Lawson will be back to full strength and at least be close to his original level. Second, in order to have a great pass rush, one needs two very good Edges. It's too easy to double just one if you don't have to worry about the other Edge or if you don't have a dominant interior rusher. Third, Huff is a good situational and designated rusher, but he's not yet a starting caliber Edge and may never be. Fourth, JFM is better at DT than Edge. Fifth, this defensive scheme is predicated on having a very strong DL and pass rush, and stud DBs are less needed in this scheme than in other schemes. As a result, sixth, we don't need a stud or great S. We can sign a S in FA and/or we can draft a S in the 2nd or 3rd round. This is a very good draft class for safeties.

    There are no TEs worth of a top 10 pick. The best is McBride and he may not even go in the 1st round at all. Safeties usually are drafted in the 2nd - 4th rounds. OGs shouldn't be taken in the top 10. The Jets could re-sign LDT and call it a day at RG, or they could sign someone in FA, or draft Zion Johnson if he's there in the 2nd round. They could also take Ekwonu if KT doesn't fall to them, play him at RG this year, then move him to either RT or LT next year, then draft an Edge in the 2nd round.

    So whether we take KT at #4 or Ekwonu, we wouldn't be using the #4 pick on depth. KT would start opposite Lawson if Lawson is healthy, but if Lawson isn't healthy to begin the season then KT would definitely be needed to start. As I said earlier, if they take Ekwonu he would either be starting at RG or RT. It all depends upon what happens with Becton. Hopefully, Becton comes back in great shape and has an All Pro level season, but if he doesn't come back in shape and/or doesn't play well, Fant could win the LT spot and Becton might not be good enough at RT. He didn't play particularly well at RT at Louisville. In that scenario, Ekwonu would be starting at RT.
     
  11. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    33,236
    Likes Received:
    26,639
    We'll just have to agree to disagree then. Sacks are an overrated stat. They're flashy and fans love them, but NFL teams value pressures and hits as much, if not more than sacks. A sack can occasionally be a strip sack and result in a TO. Pressures and hits can get a QB off his rhythm, make him rush his throws and cause a lot more incompletions and interceptions. I believe that he was allowed to walk in FA because of his injury history, not because of his level of play.
     
    Yankjetfan likes this.
  12. MoWilkBeast

    MoWilkBeast Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2013
    Messages:
    2,022
    Likes Received:
    3,314
    If one of the top 2 edges is there then that surely is the pick. The problem comes if they aren't, and there's a reasonable chance that is the case. Personally I'd look to trade but be prepared to take the player I think could be the biggest talent in the NFL and the most likely to become that generational player the Jets need. That is Hamilton hands down as far as I'm concerned. Talent and position of need (which safety clearly is) is more of a consideration than positional value, especially when it is likely that the alternative at least starts their NFL career as guard. Edge, WR, TE, IOL still all need to be addresses but the Jets have a lot of picks and some areas can be improved in FA.
     
    Ralebird likes this.
  13. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    22,308
    Likes Received:
    22,069
    "Sacks are overrated"

    wow

    drive killing plays that move the opponent backwards and result in their QB on the ground is overrated, who knew? :D:D
     
    Ralebird likes this.
  14. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    22,308
    Likes Received:
    22,069
    That's a good point, pass rushers & offensive linemen tend to be taken earlier than the mock draft nerds predict. But the Jets have the 4th pick and there are at least 4 good pass rushers at the top
     
  15. HackettStillSux

    HackettStillSux Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2003
    Messages:
    10,361
    Likes Received:
    1,913
    I'm Fine with either of them I DON'T want Hamilton!!!
     
  16. KY Jets Fan

    KY Jets Fan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2013
    Messages:
    4,593
    Likes Received:
    8,272
    Just to update the thread, poll results as of today (3/3/22):

    Ekwonu: 2 votes (4.8%)
    Thibodeaux: 38 votes (90.5%)
    Other: 2 votes (4.8%)
     
  17. KY Jets Fan

    KY Jets Fan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2013
    Messages:
    4,593
    Likes Received:
    8,272
    I disagree with this. I would absolutely not be drafting KT as an insurance policy for Lawson or for "depth". I would be drafting KT to pair him with Lawson at EDGE for the next few years.

    Just imagine having a DL of Lawson, Q, JFM, and KT for pass-rushing situations. On paper, that looks like the best pass rush we've had in a very, very long time.
     
    LAJet and GasedAndConfused like this.
  18. KY Jets Fan

    KY Jets Fan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2013
    Messages:
    4,593
    Likes Received:
    8,272
    Did you read the OP?

    I clearly articulated my reasoning for making the poll the way that I did.

    If you'd like to see who TGG would pick out of the top 5 prospects, you should create a thread and ask their opinion! :D
     
  19. Jojo

    Jojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2021
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    254

    I agree HUFF is not starting calibre at edge. More situational.
     
    NCJetsfan likes this.
  20. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    12,311
    Likes Received:
    7,416
    I was in and out of the car yesterday and I caught the tail end of a conversation about Thibodeaux on NFL Network discussing his being "eccentric" and a possible problem in the locker room. I Googled around a bit but didn't find anything. Does anyone know what this is about?
     

Share This Page