I agree with the criticisms of Abraham. He was a bit of a dog; and something of a me-first player, but watching him get after the quarterback was a thing of beauty.
... case closed ... ... does no good to have a premiere passrusher during the regular season to have him on the bench when it matters ... l_j_r
Exactly. Mangold was a team first guy he would do anything to be out there. Abraham earlier in his career was only worried about himself. Not playing in 2004 will always make me hate him.
Mangold has been dominant the past 4 or 5 seasons. I'll take that guy, Mangold has been nothing short of amazing
Today, I would rather have Mangold, only because Abraham is up there in age and probably has a lot less years left than Mangold will have.. But it's not as big as a slam dunk as it would seem. If I'm looking at the trade the last four years I might take Abraham. Pass rushers are way way more important than centers and Abraham would've been perfect in Rex's D. The Jets might have won a superbowl in 2010 with Abraham coming off the edge and Revis shutting down the opponents top reciever. We might be talking about the 2010 Jets in the same breath as the 00 Ravens. Having said that. It wasn't a bad trade. The Jets HAD to get rid of Abraham at the time he was disgruntled and selecting Mangold was a great choice. He's a great Center and I'm glad he's on the team right now. Had the Jets sent Abraham to ATL and selected a bust with that pick I would've been furious, but as it is it worked out well.
I loved this piece from PFF (9/17/12) after Sunday's game: "Mangold Back to his Best No player has been more dominant at his position league-wide over the past five seasons than Nick Mangold has at center, and once again in this game he proved why he is a class above almost every other center in the league. Taking on the Steelers’ nose tackles one-on-one he convincingly got the upper hand in the run game (+3.4 run block) and was never troubled in the passing game by defensive linemen or linebackers. On the Jets’ first snap of the game Mangold got the better of Casey Hampton and he never let his foot off of the gas against either Hampton or Steve McLendon. If you want to see a run blocker at his best there are few better players in the league to watch than Mangold." I have always been appreciative of the fact that we have the best Center in football, and you could make a strong argument for best overall interior OL as well. Excellent point that was brought up earlier regarding the drop-off (to put it extremely mildly) in play that we experienced last year @ Oak and @ Bal without him. He's simply the best. So yeah, Mangold over Abraham.
Go watch last year's game against Baltimore and tell me. I plan on getting a Mangold Nike Jersey in a bit
There are two ways to look at this question, but on both counts the answer is Mangold, I think quite clearly so. One is a straight up and down comparison of the two. Not only is Mangold the better and more consistent player, including missing very little time due to injury. But I disagree that a pass rusher is a more important position than center. Center first of all is important on both passing and running plays, and Mangold excels in both. He also is the signal caller and the leader of the OL. You can try and develop a pass rush from other positions and with other schemes if you don't have a John Abraham at his position. But if you have mediocrity at center, it's a real problem. The second way to look at it is to look at the current Jet roster. Doing so might suggest what the Jets really have needed on D is a premier pass rusher. But without Mangold this offense is not even Division I college level. Easy question.
Not to mention the comparison of the players as people/teammates. I don't put all that much stock into intangibles as some others, especially in the media do, but it is a pretty stark comparison when one player is the consummate teammate, professional, leader, teacher, etc, and the other one is the picture perfect definition of a bitch.
While Goodwin is servicable, he is no Mangold. Remember Goodwin was a borderline player and really has developed since then. Still not even close between the two right now. Mangold hands down
Mangold definately - a centre like him anchors our line and hopefully will do so for many years to come!
BB I disagree with you on your 1st point... The center position is not a more important position than a pass rusher. Not even close. The center position is only the signal caller and leader of the OL, for the Jets currently, because they have such a good player in Nick Mangold playing it. It's not like that around the league though, most teams don't put that on their center. A lot of teams get by just fine with mediocre or even weak centers. In fact a lot of teams will build their team around the center position and then just plug someone in because you can hide mediocrity at that position. Having a great center like Mangold is awesome, but the center position itself is less important than both Tackle and Guard postions. That's why even truly once-in-a-generation talents at the center position like Mangold don't get any higher than the bottom of the first round. A premier pass rusher gives your team such an advantage and are priceless. Abraham had his failings but was close to being a premier pass rusher. I think if Rex Ryan was the coach at the time there's no way he would have let Abraham go. Having said all this, once again, I don't think it was a bad deal because Mangold is great and at the time they were kind of behind the 8 ball and had to trade Abraham, I just don't think it was a slam dunk or anything. For example, I don't think Atlanta would've preferred to have Mangold over Abraham.
