Vinny was mobile, go back and watch tapes from 1998. Awesome but they also almost had the greatest choke in SB history blowing a 14 pt lead only to be rescued by Brady AGAIN. Weis w/o Brady- ONE playoff win as an OC in Weis w/ Brady- 3 SB titles Brady was only 16-0 and led NE to another SB(where the D once again choked) w/o Weis but it's all Charlie.:rofl:
Vinny could move and he didn't lose that, but he wasn't mobile. Awesome that they put up or put NE in position for 17 points. They don't win SB XXXVI w/o the defense The offense choked in SB XLII only puttin up FOURTEEN points. They were terrible in the AFCCG as well luckily getting bailed out by the defense. Brady is 5-5 in the postseason w/o Weis and 9-0 w/ Weis. In Weis' first season back as an OC in the NFL he turned a QB around from 16 TDs and 16 INTs to 27 TDs and 7 INTs. The offense went from averaging 18.4 ppg to averaging 22.9 ppg. All w/ a mediocre QB (who went 10-6 in NE after Brady went down w/ an injury) and mediocre receivers. Brady has ZERO SB Titles w/o Weis. Who cares about one regular season. Manning easily could have had an undefeated season last year and everyone on here KNOWS that you would downplay it.
Also, and a lot of people forget this, Belichek had been named head coach before Parcells agreed to come here. When Parcells took the offer, Belichek was bumped to D coordinator. I don't think he ever forgave the Jets for that.
Correct. He was twice named the HC of the NYJ, and never coached a single practice, much less a game. But the first time, he was just a placeholder. The Jets wanted to hire Parcells, but they would owe the Pats compensation for a lateral move. So they gave Parcells a job running the football operations, while Belichick was named HC. I think they both knew that this was just until Parcells could contractually become the HC.
Vinny lost mobility after the achilles injury, he was not the same player. NE doesn't even make the playoffs w/o Brady let alone get to or win a SB. The O did choke BUT w/ the game on the line they gave their "great" D a 4 point lead late and the D choked AGAIN. Awesome, how did that work out in the playoffs for old Charlie? yep, that medicore QB won 6 LESS games than Brady did the year befoe w/ a MUCH easier sched. How did NE do in their playoff game that year? Weis as an OC is 1-2 in playoff games w/o Brady. Did Manning have an undefeated reg season last year? did he face a similar sched and thrash opponents like NE '07? and if they were undefeated he still THREW AWAY THE SUPER BOWL!
He knew that was going to happen, that was the plan all along so he couldn't have been mad at the Jets for doing that.
^He may have known, but that doesn't mean he liked it. I still think that it is some of the reason for his almost neurotic hatred of the Jets franchise.
Vinny's game was never based on being mobile. And he wasn't a mobile QB. He had one great year and that was w/ Weis as the OC and was terrible afterwards w/ Henning. Anyone that thinks it's because of his achilles injury is trying too hard. Vinny struggled because he did not have Charlie Weis and Bill Parcells. NE's defense held teams to 17 points or less 11 times in 2001 and all 3 games in the postseason. They don't get to or win the SB w/o that defense. That mediocre QB won TEN games in the Patriots system. He showed what he can do w/o that system last year throwing 16 INTs and leading the Chiefs to only 4 wins. Weis turned around a terrible Chiefs team and offense in one year of being there. Brady has ZERO Championships w/o Weis. Anyone who has a clue KNOWS that Manning would have had an undefeated season if he played it out.
Who forced BB to take the HC job as a placeholder the first time???? I don't recall BB refusing to take that job. I don't recall BB not cashing those very generous paychecks from the Jets. He took the job knowing the situation and he happily cashed every paycheck from the Jets. The notion that he is angry about something is assinine. He is one of the luckiest and wealthiest HCs of all time - if he is angry its on himm and he should go see a shrink.
It wasn't based on mobility but losing what mobility he had was huge. You think the difference btw Vinny 1998 and Vinny 2000 was not having Charlie Weis? Seriously? That's great but they held us to 10 pts in Bledsoe's last start, how did that go for them? 10 game agaisnt a creampuff schedule w/ takent around him that won 16 the year before. He was in that sysatem for years, they had confidence he could play or he would have been gone. How did that great O Charlie turned around look in their HOME playoff game? They beat ONE playoff bound team all year and that team was 7-9. Against Indy they scored 9 and against Baltimore they scored 7. Those were the only 2 other playoff teams they faced all year. Weis has zero championships as an OC and has been fired as a HC w/o Brady. We don't know that, we were down only 5 pts midway through the 3rd. We likely would have lost but that's not a guarantee. They played 3 playoff teams not including the Jets in 2009 and won 2 of them by 2 or fewer points. In 2007 NE played 6 playoff bound teams and beat them by an average of 20 PPG. Regardless of that Manning threw away the Super Bowl.
He signed the deal so if he didn't like it he had the opportunity to decline the offer. He also didn't have to take a million dollar bonus to stay as DC in 1999 even though no one wanted him to be a HC anyway.
No it wasn’t huge. He still rolled out just fine in 2000 and 2001. His game was not based on mobility and he didn’t lose any anyway. It sure makes it easier to win when your team doesn’t give up points. A mediocre QB who hadn’t started a game since H.S. still was able to have success in the system. It’s not like their 2007 schedule was that difficult either. The division had a team that almost went winless, a 4 win team (2 of those wins came against a 1 win team) and a 7 win team who had 4 of those 7 wins against a 1 win team and a 4 win team. Then they beat a terrible Redskins team who only made it to the playoffs due to the emotional high they were on after the loss of their teammate, a Ravens team who LOST to a 1 win team a terrible Browns team and a terrible Bengals team. They beat a Cowboys team who were embarrassed at home in the playoffs. Yeah, that’s a tough schedule :rolleyeys: They were a 4 win team the year before and were TERRIBLE on offense. We weren’t beating Indy in that game. And Brady played terribly in SB XLII
I'm so sick af all this Bill Belichick Genius bullshit. The guy is a good coach, and I think he deserves to be in the Coach of the Year discussion this year, but I wish the media would stop washing this guy's balls already. The fact is he's never done a damn thing without Tom Brady, and he had Brady riding the bench until he was forced to play him. ONE playoff win, when Brady wasn't his QB. What exactly makes him better than alot of other coaches in this league? And btw ... without the most ludicrous call in the history of sports, you can take one SB off his resume. Just as an example ... what makes him better than Coughlin? Tom's won a Superbowl without the luxury of a great QB, and beat the great Belichick head to head. What makes him better than Mike Tomlin? Or even Lovie Smith who got to the SB with Rex Grossman at QB!!??? Let's see genius do that. Is he better than Andy Reid? Jeff Fisher? These guys are all good coaches, and all just as good as Belichick IMHO. They just weren't able to ride the coattails of one of the top 5 QB's in history. I don't care about "what if" ... I'm hapy with the coach we have.
Belichick is well known as a fan of the rock band Bon Jovi, who visited Patriots training camp on August 14, 2006.[28] Their 2002 song "Bounce" is dedicated to Belichick.[29] ......gayest thing ive ever heard
I'm not talking about rolling out, I'm talking about his elusiveness in the pocket. he was clearly not the same guy physically in 2000 as he was in 1998. It is, it's also very easy to lose games when your D blows big leads in big games all the time. In 2007 they faced 6 playoff bound teams, that's alot esepcially considering none were in their division. So the excuse for the redskins is they made it b/c Sean Taylor died. Do you read this stuff beofre you hit "submit reply"? Dallas was 13-3 in 2007 and they lost by 4 pts in the div rd- I wouldn't call that an embarrassment The browns were 10-6- how were they terrible? They were terrible on offense in the biggest game of their season too so what really changed? Maybe not but we'll never know. I bet most people thought we'd never beat SD trailing 7-3 midway through the3rd in the div rd but they played that game out and we won. Brady wasn't good, terrible is a stretch but he didn't throw away the SB like Manning did. He did give his overrated D a 4 pt lead w/ 2 1/2 to play against a mediocre offense.
Just stop. Vinny was never mobile and had the same escapability after the injury as he did prior. His mobility or lack thereof did not contribute to his downtrend after the 1998 season. It's a lead that the DEFENSE gave them. 17 points all off of turnovers that the DEFENSE caused. The Redskins were 5-6 prior to Taylor's death and went 4-1 on their way to a 9-7 record after Taylor died. Yeah, there was no connection there. They played inspired football after Taylor died and it got them into the playoffs. Yeah, the Browns were 10-6. The record of the teams they beat was a whopping 55-105 .344. Woah....:rofl: Brady played terrible against the same defense a year ago. We weren't beating Indy in that game. Brady was terrible in SB XLII. Actually he's been very bad in several playoff games since Weis has left. 9-0 w/ Weis and 5-5 w/o Weis.
I really wonder what games you watch? Should I send you my '98 tapes so you can remember what he was like? It amazes me how wrong someone could be in every discussion about QBs especially for a guy who knows football like you. Great, the D gave them the lead so that gives them the right to blow a lead- one that would have been historical if they lost? What happened in 2005 when no one was killed? They were 5-6 in 2005 and ended up 10-6. maybe Gibbs had his teams playing better late in seasons? What so the record of their opponents means something now but you can credit Charlie weis for KC's O putting up good #s against bad teams? How does that work exactly? Cleveland beat Seattle who would go on to win 10 games and make the playoffs, KC's only win over a playoff bound team was also Seattle but 7-9 Seattle. Against what defense? We will never know if we would have beaten Indy that day so Peyton's best record was 14-2 not 16-0 and AGAIN he would up throwing away the super Bowl so it is irrelevant. Terrible yet he gave his team a 4 pt lead in the final minutes vs. Manning throwing the game ending pick for a TD in his SB loss. How many playoff/bowl games has 'ole Charlie won w/o Tom Brady?
I don’t need your tapes. Vinny was never a mobile QB and what little mobility he had he did not lose in 2000 or 2001. They don’t win SB XXXVI w/o the defense. Period. The Redskins won on emotion in 2007. That has nothing to do w/ 2005 Cleveland was not a good team in 2007. They were just better than the terrible teams they played. The RAVENS defense. We weren’t beating the Colts last year if Peyton stays in the game. Brady played terrible is SB XLII. Just like he did last year against the Ravens and just like he did this year against the Jets. Not to mention his terrible game in the 2007 AFCCG. All w/o Weis. Brady in the postseason w/ Weis – 9-0 11 TDs 3 INTs Brady in the postseason w/o Weis – 5-5 19 TDs 13 INTs
You are confusing mobility w/ being a running QB, he los his legs. Still had a great arm but he didn't have the same movement he had before the injury. They don't get to the playoffs w/o Tom Brady. Period. You always have an excuse:rofl: You could say that about KC then too, right? so the job wasn't really that impressive, right? We will never know if we would have beaten Indy, we do know he choked again and threw away the Super Bowl. Brady played terrible throwing no INTs and leading his team to an 80 yd drive to take a 4 pt lead late but Manning played well leading his team to 17 pts and throwing the game ending INT for TD? You just can't make this stuff up. Weis in postseason w/ Brady(as OC): 3 playoff apps in 4 years, 3 SBs, 9-0 record Weis in postseason w/o Brady(as OC): 2 playoff apps in 5 years, 1-1 record
No I'm not. Vinny could move in the pocket just fine post injury, and the injury had NOTHING, ZERO, NADA to do with his trend back to pre-Weis/Parcells Vinny. Henning was given some credit for Vinny's play in 1998 but the majority of it went to Parcells and Weis. They don't win SB XXXVI w/o the DEFENSE who put them in position for 17 points. What excuses? Everyone knows the Redskins went on that run in 2007 playing on emotion after the death of Taylor. The Browns were a mediocre team in 2007 who were better than their inferior opponents. We would not have won in Indy last year if they kept Peyton in the game. Brady played terrible. His job was to put up points. He averaged OVER 30 PPG in '07 but only put up FOURTEEN! He played terrible. Yes, you can't make this stuff up. Brady in the postseason w/ Weis – 9-0 11 TDs 3 INTs Brady in the postseason w/o Weis – 5-5 19 TDs 13 INTs Why the increase in losses and INTs w/o Weis? hmmm
