Twins, Yankees discussing Santana trade

Both Crisp and Cabrera suck.

I'd take Lester over Kennedy. Sorry, left with high K ability don't come around often.

Masterson and Horne are similar prospects except Masterson is younger, better at getting groundballs, and has no injury history that I can rememebr.

And I'd take Lowrie over Tabata anyday. Lowrie is almost a lock to be a decent hitter/player at worse. Tabata is a 19 year who who just had wrist surgery.

 

The rest of the baseball world would disagree with you. Hughes is only slightly above a "push" with Buckholz, and the only benefits of Melky over Coco are age and salary. Offensive numbers for both are comparable, and Coco is MILES ahead of Melky in defense.

 

On my way to school this morning, I was reading the Daily News and there was a little section where emails were sent in by NYDailynews.com memebers giving their opinions on the whole Santana deal and what the Yankees should do.

When I read a certain email, I was convinced it was the stupidest thing I've ever read, sports related.

I was in awe when I read it. How can someone say that and think they will have people agreeing with them? Sure, it's true they haven't won any Cy Youngs, but I mean seriously! Joba pitched only, what, 24 total innings in the reg. season? And Hughes was collectively out for 3 months, and came into the season mid-way.

What an opinion that was, eh'? hmy:

 

Where???????

 

No, I think most people would make the Buchholz-Hughes comparison first. Pretty similar pitchers; but, more importantly, their clubs seem to value them similarly.

 

I know. It's a head-scratcher to me how he became so untouchable in such a short period of time - particular when, Hank's grand pronouncements notwithstanding, we really don't yet know where his arm fits best. I still think its a 50/50 shot that he lands back in the bullpen. It wasn't 12 months ago when Papelbon was being counted as a 3rd or 4th starter. The Red Sox certainly had more of a need for a stable closer than the Yankees do, but what if Joba has a rough couple of months in the rotation? It will be interesting to see what the NEW "Joba Rules" will be.

 

Did you see him pitch?

Other than the bug game, which I throw out, his stuff is unreal... and he performed down the stretch to help lock up the Wild Card & he performed against the heart of Bostons line up, save Lowell...

The kid is a legit heir apparent to Rivera & in the mean time can start or be the stop gap to get to Mo the Yankees have been so desperately lacking... IMO he's absolutely untouchable

 

23 encouraging innings, for sure. Handled correctly, also. I think the picture of Joba gets skewed, though, because he was handled. A lightning arm, but none of us know what four-plus innings of pitching against major league hitters will look like. A second or third run through the order means that he'll have to be a different pitcher than he was for 1-2 innings under "Joba Rules." So, with that uncertainty, I just don't get where "untouchable" comes in, when a name like "Santana" is on the other end of the equation. I wouldn't be quick to move him either. I'd probably label him untouchable, also. But Johan Santana is a fo-sho 20-game winner in pinstripes.

 

He certainly was impressive and maybe the most impresive of the 3 but that being said he pitched under 30 innings so you don't know how he will handle pitching a full season. I'm sure he'll be fine but look at the way Dice K and Okajima broke down towards the end of the year. I understand you can't compare Nippon baseball and MLB but it's inevitable that young guys break down in August and September.

 

Two big problems.
1. Lester > Kennedy
2. Horne hasn't been offered in the package

 

this is what we have to go with for kennedy with stats, split at A,AA,AAA, MLB buts its a full season regardless:

13-3, 1.88 ERA, 170 IP, 180 K's

kennedy performed on the same level at all of the minor leagues and MLB. the transistion didnt phase him at all. Lester however had an average season at best and puts up far worse numbers in Boston then he does in the minors. look it up if you dont beleive me. Kennedy throws 2-3 MPH less than lester, but his offspeed pitches and control are what make him. Kennedy graded out to average before the season but has had a breakout year and now grades above/slighly above average. he won milb pitcher of the year. i dont see how this info doesnt prove that kennedy is a much better prospect than lester.

i will give you the toss-up in talent between melky and coco, but melky is much younger and much less expensive. so in other words much more valuable.

on to lowrie. last year he didnt place in the top 100 prospects on BaseballAmerica, and didnt event make the red sox top ten prospects list. However, jose tabata was 27th on the top 100 list and 2nd on the yank's list behind phil hughes. he is 19 years old and has a huge ceiling. jed lowrie had a decent year this year but he didnt "hit for power" and doesnt project to. Tabata is a 5 tool player that is projected to develop into a manny ramirez type slugger, yet he can steal bases, field, and has a cannon. His power stats were down this year due to a recurring wrist injury, but he has still hit for average during this time. I dont see how there is any question that Tabata is a much better prospect than lowrie. i think you are taking lowries past season vrs. tabatas past season as your judgement, but overall tabata is more valuable.


unless i am blinded by my love for yanks prospects, i think it is obvious that we are offering a much better package, with player with higher value and higher ceiling

 

1) how is lester better. ANYBODY please prove to me that he is better. he has been average at best and his performance in the minors doesnt hold a candle to ian kennedy. im sorry i just dont see it.

2) since all we have to go on are rumors and newspaper musings, and no one knows for sure what is being offered you cant say that alan horne hasnt been offered. i have read several article that had the kennedy, tabata, melky, horne proposal, so i think its definitly possible.

but thats besides the point since the yankees have other pitching prospects that are of equal value to horne.

 

i dont think that anybody remembers that joba was a starter before he was brought up to the yankees. he went 9-2 with a 2.45 ERA and 135 K's.

so i dont get where this concern about him starting comes from especially since he will be throwing 2 additional pitches, a plus change and a plus curve. not to mention the change makes his fastball even dealier.

 

Nobody is mistaking Joba's credentials. All I'm noting - and correctly so - is that there's a substantial difference between starting in the minors vs. majors. Mixing pitches, going through the lineup three and four times, and doing it against top quality hitters, is a WORLD away from throwing a couple power innings on healthy rest, with the best closer in history behind you.

And, yes, Lester is better than Kennedy. It's not really close.