The Ukrainian situation

Discussion in 'BS Forum' started by typeOnegative13NY, Feb 14, 2022.

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  1. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Putin's gone to great expense to spin this as a Western problem. It's no surprise that people rabbit-holed down his hole can't come to grips with the reality here.

    This is about Putin vs the post-Cold War Order. Nothing more and nothing less. He's done some truly brutal things in his day but this tops the list.

    Note to all Americans and Western citizens in general: if you're with Putin on this you are against America and the West. You're not for liberty or freedom or any of the other bullshit that has been poured into your rabbit-hole. You're for heavy top-down brutal authoritarianism and ultimately if you actually win that same thing will eat you alive.

    There is only room for a few at the top of an authoritarian pyramid and you have no way of getting there from anywhere else on the pyramid. The few at the top will do whatever they can to stay there and your life means nothing to them at all.

    One death is a tragedy but you will be one of millions and just a statistic.
     
  2. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

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    I said nothing of the sort.

    Understanding and discussing the U.S. involvement in Ukraine governance is not an endorsement of the cruel and brutal actions of the "dictator of the country next door".

    I would love to see the downfall of Vladimir Putin and his evil rule. If this war accelerates that end, it will be at a price
    paid by the Ukrainian people.

    I don't think their bloodshed is a necessary sacrifice. There were other options available.
     
  3. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Ukraine turned down the option of permanent neutrality and the option of promising to never join NATO. That was their choice.

    That was one of the primary catalysts of Putin's invasion.

    NATO refused to rollback membership to pre-1991 levels.

    That was another of the catalysts.

    Neither of those catalysts was a reasonable or justified casus belli for an invasion of another sovereign country.

    The choice of the invasion was made by Putin and it is with him and him alone that ultimate responsibility for the invasion lies.
     
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  4. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

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    What theories?

    There's nothing "pro-Russian" in pointing out Washington's involvement in Ukraine's path.
    To ignore it is just naive... and stupidly jingoistic.

    But hey.... the U.S. has such a fabulous history of nation building.

    We're the NY Jets of democracy... :confused:
     
  5. SOXXX2

    SOXXX2 Well-Known Member

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    Bingo!!! 100% agree
     
  6. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    At least Soxx has balls enough to admit what he’s doing

    and ^^ look he agrees with your pro-Russian takes
     
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  7. JackBower

    JackBower Well-Known Member

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    I think Ukraine made their own choices, if you think they made their alliances and their interest in becoming apart of Europe is from a US shadow government. Ok then.

    I think you are combining what the US wanted to happen with Ukraine joining NATO/EU alliances and some Oceans 11 magic and manipulation that the US convinced them too.

    I'm also not saying on the slightest you are rooting for Putin, just that the intense blaming of the US is at a 10 when it should be like a 4. Ukraine didn't form their alliances on the dictator next door, and said dictator started the first war on Europe in decades.
     
    #987 JackBower, Mar 5, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2022
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  8. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    they tried the alternative- they experienced famine and genocide for decades under Russian rule.

    Acad should open a fucking history book
     
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  9. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

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    Acad must be thrilled!
     
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  10. JackBower

    JackBower Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  11. SOXXX2

    SOXXX2 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure why there is a push to create a narrative that Ukraine is holding its own.....

    [​IMG]

     
  12. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    And what is putin if not that?
     
  13. Dierking

    Dierking Well-Known Member

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    Might save them some effort to compile a list of countries that aren’t imposing sanctions.
     
  14. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    You are justifying it and defending it.
     
  15. SOXXX2

    SOXXX2 Well-Known Member

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    Im not defending Putin.

    Both sides are bad.

    At the end of the day, the people who provoked this and started this war wont be the ones losing life over it. The citizens of both countries are going to be suffering over this, and for the most part it had nothing to do with them.

    Also people outside of those countries will suffer as well, mostly financially. Especially if this triggers a financial crisis = loss of life

     
  16. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    You kind of are
     
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  17. typeOnegative13NY

    typeOnegative13NY Well-Known Member

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    What about the Ukrainian side is bad, related to being invaded by Russia?
     
  18. SOXXX2

    SOXXX2 Well-Known Member

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    Im not defending Putin.

    Im blaming both sides. Both sides could have handled this better, but actions and decisions from the past few decades has lead to this.

    But guess what? Putin will be fine, the politicians of NATO countries will be fine.

    You wanna know who wont be though? People in Ukraine, Russia, and potentially the entire world pending the amount of damage this may trigger financially. The US was already staring down a financial crisis, this may just trigger it.
     
  19. papapump

    papapump Well-Known Member

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    Both sides??? Are you a freaking Commie dude? If you feel this way, move to Russia. You won’t be missed.
     
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  20. SOXXX2

    SOXXX2 Well-Known Member

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    Its funny that someone who is a statist like yourself would try and call me a commie when I am anti-statist.

    You are much closer to being a commie, because you are the pro-state person.
     
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