You know what doesn't make sense is this: How can a player who needs to work on his pass blocking technique, holds a lot even against lesser competition be considered a very good pass blocker? I've heard of someone "having the potential" to become a very good pass blocker because of certain traits (i.e., long arms, good feet and hand punch) but never just being deemed one just because of those traits. Traits that Iupati has in folds by the way. So is Gholston a very good pass rusher because he is fast and stronger than an ox but has to work on his technique? What would happens if Iupati does not learn those techniques? Is that when we can say he not very good at it yet?
I got to say that you 2 ruined this thread. Your both rewording the same argument over and over. I say end it now whats been said is said and from here one out let's stick to the original nature of this post.
Yeah, you did get to say that...and it makes no difference at all. I contributed enough to this thread with all of my posts about Everson Griffen. The poster that I was debating with has no clue what kind of prospect Mike Iupati is. He kept using Mike Mayock quotes and stuff from the Senior Bowl practices as his evidence and that's garbage around here. I really respect Mayock, but legler was really misinterpreting his words. I've seen Idaho's offense have a suprisingly good running attack for the past few years in the WAC. Iupati was the most important player on the Vandals' offense. Not too often you see a guard play such an important role at the college level.
I agree. I've watched the Senior Bowl more than once, and Iupati was holding like a mother f***er on a good chunk of plays. He also got owned by Alualu in practice drills. That, to me, says he needs a lot of work once he gets into the NFL, and thus makes him a bit of a project. Now, that doesn't make him a bad prospect, but people shouldn't think he's going to come in and play like a starter from day one. He'd have to have one hell of a TC for that to happen. While I generally enjoy this forum quite a bit, there does seem to be this theme where when one of the more mainstay posters states an opinion on a player, it quickly goes viral, and the herd just follows suit (see Jerry Hughes). legler82's posts make perfect sense to me, but it seems some are getting overly sensitive of any kind of Iupati criticisms, which is stupid. This is a discussion forum.
1. Jerry Hughes doesn't fit into our scheme. 2. The Senior Bowl is one game against top tier competition. I've seen him play numerous times against Fresno and Boise. He stood out in every game - mainly because the announcers were always talking about him.
I don't watch the WAC conference so I don't know but how do those defense's rank? Was there anyone dominant in them that he went up against for comparison?
Agreed. I apologize for my part in taking this thread of course. Some people see, hear and read what they want to. But being that I'm "retarded", it takes me a while to figure it out.
Boise State's defense can hang with anybody. Fresno's defense used to be very strong, but we've taken a step back for the past two or three seasons. Hawaii's defense usually has some talented front seven players, but their secondary is always suspect. Out of all the teams in the conference, LaTech probably has the best size on the defensive line - they're in a completely different region, so they have a better shot at landing the guys that just don't quite make the cut at LSU. Usually with mid-major conferences, you'll see very undersized defensive lines. Boise doesn't have the biggest defenders, but they play so fast. When Iupati was matched up against one of the best defensive lineman in the WAC (Louisiana Tech's D'Anthony Smith), he looked great.
I'm sure you've done this 100 times on here, but can you tell me why you don't think Jerry Hughes fits our scheme? Physically, he's not much different that many successful 3-4 OLB. He's a great pash rusher.
A little unconventional for a 34 OLB when you talk about the Bill Parcells tree 34. However, the Steelers love these type of guys. Not sure where Rex fits in, maybe somewhere in the middle. Seems like he always had bigger guys in Baltimore. Agree though, if you are knocking Hughes for his size you have to feel the same about Graham. Hughes is actually 1/2 inch taller although Graham is heavier. 26 1/2 sacks and eight forced fumbles over the last two years is impressive. I guess I will be flogged over liking Hughes since conventional wisdom on this board hates him and they don't like when you disagree. Remember, these were all the jokers that had us taking Jarron Gilbert at #17 last year.
It's not the size, it's how they play. Hughes is a great pass rusher but the worry is that he will get pushed around in the running game and become a liability and an incomplete player. Graham has shown proficiency both against the run and at rushing the passer. He is a more complete player. That is why Graham is consistently rated higher than Hughes and why most expect Graham to be gone by 20 while Hughes is projected as a late first-round pick. It's not their numbers, it's their game.
Was just doing some light reading of prospects I'm starting to like Hughes more then Kindle. I didn't know Kindle had so many injuries in his early years at Texas that scares me off a little. Plus the car accident last summer that gave him a concussion. I'd say Graham then Hughes if we went OLB 1st round.
by late round pick do you mean top of the 2nd round? I agree Graham is more complete and deserves to be ranked higher. Hughes is not a bad consolation prize though at #29 or in the thirties. I'd prefer to go in another direction though as RR has shown he can find LBs late or even undrafted. I'd like us to go safety (not Mays) or DL. Would obviously love for Odrick to fall but that's unlikely.
There's a thread that I created a while back called "The Anti-Jerry Hughes thread"... I'll just sum it up: I think Hughes has the abilities to be a very good player in the 4-3. He doesn't fit into Rex Ryan's 34 scheme. That's why I don't want him on the Jets. It has nothing to do with how good or bad he is...he just doesn't fit into this scheme. Ryan likes bigger, more powerful OLBs that have a wide variety of pass rushing moves. Hughes has a great first step and very good quickness, but he won't be able to beat guys in the NFL with that speed. I think he'll be overpowered by most NFL linemen and he'll be a liability against the run. Brandon Graham and Everson Griffen are both better run defenders with more pass rushing moves.
WW85 You were right and I was wrong. If Iupati is there at 29 you had it right ... the Jets should and most likely will take him. In fact I tweaked my final mock draft and now have Iupati projected to the Jets, because I always agreed with the premise of your original post that Iupati can conceivably fall to the Jets based on his position and team needs. We went over that in detail already and I agree the premise makes sense. However initially I doubted the Jets would take him because they're so ready to make a Super Bowl run this year, but in light of Mike Lombardi's rumor about the Jets possibly cutting ties with Alan Faneca, even if the rumor is false, it forced me to reconsider Iupati and I now see why we most likely take him if he's there. Just wanted to tell you that because I respectfully disagreed with you at the outset.
