It wasn't? I remember it way differently than that. http://walterfootball.com/draft2005.php http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/TSX/2005 http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft05/news/story?page=2005mock Even when a mock had him at 1, they called it a "surprise": http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/2005draft/2005-04-22-mock-draft-bell_x.htm
What does having getting banned have anything to do with this? That was a heated exchange in the BS forum amongst a number of posters, two of which have since been permabanned. And your concept of "slipping" is infantile. Two franchise QBs "slipped" last year for a whole host of reasons. One of the greatest QBs of in the game today was once thought of as the first pick and he "slid" to 24. It's a red herring argument. As is the silly throw away line "well, he's not Andrew Luck" as if that's the standard for taking a QB high in the first round. I get it, you hate the player. I love the player. We're all just guessing. _
Aaron Rodgers was absolutely thought of at one time as the first pick and his "slide" to 24 was legendary. _
Oh no I get it. You LOVE the player, just not at 6. Or not if we can garner a kings ransom from Philly. That's a cop out. _
That wasn't your original point. "Franchise QBs don't slip like that in a draft where there are only two QBs worth a first round pick." All three mocks you posted had Aaron Rodgers ranked the number 5 player at worst. When you are widely considered a top 5 prospect than you are a franchise player. If you are a QB in the top 5 rankings, you are considered a future franchise QB. Your example kind of helped me prove my point. Aaron Rodgers was looked at as a franchise QB, he slipped to later in the round, he became a franchise QB. I consider it very similar to Winston/Mariota. I don't think Maritoa falls that far, because there are many needy teams for a QB. You cant point to three articles that have Rodgers as a top 5 prospect and in the same breath say he wasn't looked at a franchise QB.
Suggesting Rodgers wasn't a top top player that slid massively is just someone being intentionally obtuse to back up a flawed point that they were severely wrong about. Rodgers "slide" was legendary. _
It's a cop out to want multiple extra first and second round picks for a guy that hasn't played in a pro system his entire football career? You make no sense. Just say "I want you to have the same opinion as me" and we can move on.
I was refuting your point of "There's a reason up until the draft it wasn't super obvious who was going to go 1." Beyond that, the entire point I've been trying to make from the first post in which I wasted time trying to talk to JStokes is that you can't go ahead and label a guy a franchise QB before the draft when you're trying to defend your point of not wanting to trade the pick for multiple picks. It's pure conjecture.
I actually (i) don't give a shit about your opinion and (ii) am happy your opinion doesn't jive with mine. Makes me feel all the better about it. Quarterback is the only thing that matters. No amount of DTs or WRs or CBs or OTs or DEs or OLBs or SSs or TEs is as important as finding that QB. But you should root for a trade back if that's what you want. _
But it does... I don't wanna rile you up, you might get your panties in a bunch and say something to get you banned. But yes, my opinion on Mariota is the same as yours, you just think it's a "cop out" to want more picks for a guy that has as much of a chance as fizzling out as he does becoming a franchise QB. This is dumb.
I can label him however I want. We're not going to know for years. By the same token, we don't know whether ANY of those extra picks will garner us anything. There are no Randy Moss's or John Hannahs or Ray Lewis's or Warren Sapps or LT's or Ronnie Lotts or Walter Payton's or "sure things" at any other position in this draft. _
No our opinions do not jive. There is no amount of compensation, no number of multiple draft picks, I'd trade for the rights to Mariota. None. _
Back to the trade at hand. This is obviously from the perspective of "the Jets don't think Mariota is a franchise QB" 20 is pretty far down in the draft. While you can still get a blue chipper at that point, the odds aren't as high as when you're picking 6, obviously. If I'm the Jets and Chip does call offering a bunch of picks, the first thing I do is make sure I get enough picks to move up from 20. I want to get enough picks that I can move up to 10-12, while retaining next years 1st and maybe a later round pick. That way we're picking at 12, still might be able to land Cooper/White/Fowler/Beasley. Have an extra first next year, and an extra late round pick somewhere as well.
No, I'm not an Idzik fan. Nagle is just not smart. I thought that he should have been kept on to see through his financial plan, but you won't find me defending the guy's drafting like he suggests.
One problem with that strategy is that you're just giving up the compensation you so dearly fought over to give up Mariota. If it's going to take a kings ransom to move from 20 to 6, it's still going to take a queens ransom to move from 20 to 10 or 12. You're going to have to give up a nice chunk of what you got from Chip. And now the compensation doesn't seem so lofty. _
So wait, you believe his drafts were shit (showing a massive lack of football personnel knowledge) but you wanted to keep him on because of his "financial plan"? This is football, not estate planning dude. Wow. _
