No offense to your friend, but we're talking about Tebow, a 1st round drafted Heisman winner. An NFL division winning, playoff game winning, starting QB. A starting QB with a winning NFL record. This is not apples to apples.
Now I'm really impressed. No I'm not. But I'm not here to hate on McElroy. I won't be following him from team to team saying that he doesn't deserve a shot, regardless of whether I think Tebow should have gotten a shot first. I won't troll Bama forums... I won't insult McElroy supporters... I won't even say he will never be good even if he has a few bad games. But that's just me. Good luck to McElroy. :beer:
people want tebow to play for their interest in tebow,not the jets. if tebow leaves next year,these people follow him and no longer "care" about the jets. if the jets lose one more game,i really wish they would start him so we can finally be done with the fact that people think he is a qb.
I ignore this argument 999 times out of 1,000, but every six months or so I respond to it. Dude -- understand, there is no path to success that involves Tebow doing well without his team doing well. You cannot hide in this league. When you get out there at the QB position, you are exposed, ripped, and dissected. When people want Tebow to play, they want the team to do well. That's part of it. So dismiss this notion that it's somehow possible to root for him to play, but not at the same time hope that it goes very well, and leads to wins, wins, wins. Because that's the only way it will work -- otherwise, it ends badly, and better to have never done it at all. You surely have to be able to conceptualize that.
Yeah, it's interesting. But I usually try to avoid the conspiracy theories. Usually life is simpler than it seems. If I thought that, I wouldn't want him to play. I think he's got a great arm and can make the deep outs necessary in the NFL. It's one of the things most misunderstood about him by casual fans. But understood -- you think Tebow's problem is he can't make the deep outs necessary in the NFL.
"5. McElroy doesn't have the arm strength or overall athleticism to start in this league. He should settle in as a popular and trusty backup. " That's what all the Tebow haters use when they don't want to discuss stuff. Then you guys say give him a chance. You seem to be writing off McElroy quicker than people wrote off Tebow on here
ive been a Jet fan since the early 80s,i never followed one player out the door. Your gig is that you dont care what team he plays for,the team is just a vessel. The way i see it you people have fandom all backwards. Anyway,we want our team to do well,and pave the way for the future. We don't want to sacrifice our time for the temporary satisfaction of some mobile cult. If the pro coaches thought he was worth a good god damn,he would have been in a long time ago. If Tebow is in Jax next year,whos board are you on? ask yourself that
Well, I'm not a part of some crowd sitting here typing. I don't adopt, endorse, or stand for anybody else. But it's an argument I've seen 1,000 times against Tebow. Are you telling me that every time I've heard someone say that they just don't think Tebow as what it takes to be an NFL quarterback, that I was dealing with an unreasonable or unfair person? Because I've mostly taken them at their word -- if they just don't think Tebow's got it, I wouldn't expect them to even want to give him a shot. So it seems odd -- I think you would consider their point of view sincere and reasonable. Why couldn't I have the same point of view about another player -- in this case, Greg McElroy? There's no real way I can deal with the position "You can't say this about Player X, because other people say it about Tebow, and you disagree with them." There is such a thing as a player with enough limitations that you don't expend valuable time starting him. Many think that is true of Tebow. I think it is true of McElroy. And it's primarily because of arm strength.
It just comes across as very pathetic -- like you're looking for some real friends, and feel like you're going to be left by these people who are not "real fans." Who cares? It's the internet. Why does it even bother you? (Truth told, most of us are NFL fans that have a "real" team, and enjoy the Tebow thing as a second team. Happens all the time). But it really seems kind of needy when you seem concerned about whether fans are "real" and are going to leave you, and like you're in this big happy family of friends. That might be true in real life, at real games, in front of a TV. But on the internet, it's best that you consider it all smack and with a grain of salt -- like you would if Bills fans were posting here.
You could have saved us some time by saying: I'll make my argument for you to consider: 1) I like Tim Tebow and want him to start
The way I see it, you have a very narrow understanding of the word "fan" which does not conform to its actual definition in the dictionary.
I would think as a Jets fan, you'd want Tebow to go in there and light it up while he is a Jets player and take you to the Superbowl. I would think you would want that any player who is on your roster to do well for the Jets. Not trying to cast aspersions, but you are sounding really hypocritical right now.
This straying away from the main point, you wrote Greg off before seeing much if anything from him. It's just as silly saying Tebow has no chance at being a good QB. Neither has had the support or effort from a team trying to make them a starting QB. It's hard to say they can't be before they are given a shot. You could argue they won't be given a fair shot or chance, but that's different from saying they can't. Sure if you took people's word that Tebow will never be a good QB then sure you can throw around that Greg will never be a starter. But I thought I remember you arguing that Tebow can be a starter and will be a good one so you obviously disagree on writing him off. One of the main arguments used is that Tebow has only 16 started game so you have to give him time. If you haven't used that argument, sure write off Greg. But I think I remember you using that argument, it's a valid one. Chances are Greg won't be a decent starter league, but's hard to really say it won't happen. It's hard to predict football. Who would have thought last year when the Jets lost to Denver that Tebow would be a Jet and when Sanchez got pulled it would be Greg McElroy not Tim?
You missed the point completely. It is you Tebowites that come off as pathetic. 99% of NFL fans root for a team. You root for a player - a player on the bench. That is what is pathetic. Type One is right. Most of us have followed the Jets for years or decades through thin and thin (no typo). We don't care if you and your Tebowmaniac friends are gone next year. You all will not be missed. In fact, we will be thrilled. We went through this nonsense with Favre and his cult and to go through it again 4 years later is just unbearable (thanks Woody). We KNOW you'll be gone the minute Tebow changes jerseys. You have nothing in common with us. You are like a person that comes to live in our house for two weeks and doesn't leave. I don't think Tebow will ever start a game for the Jets absent injuries to both Sanchez and McElroy. You see, there is a big problem for a team when Tebow starts. The entire NFL realizes he is not a starting QB, but if Tebow starts and wins a few games down the stretch, which is possible with the Jets schedule, then there will be too much pressure for him to be in the mix next season and the CS, by its actions, wants no part of that. Just like Elway wanted no part of it. Because then there is no future and the Jets will be looking for another starting QB in 2014. Here is my take. If Tebow is hurt, McElroy starts. If Tebow is healthy, Sanchez will likely start. Tebow will not start a game at QB for the Jets this season and will be somewhere else next season and so will you and your cult.
He could have easily lost the #2 to McElroy in the last 3 months. Besides, Sanchez will start this week, guaranteed. Great arm? Tebow has a below average arm. Why do you think he has such a ridiculous windup for every single throw? Why do you think he puts his entire body in to every throw? Because he has to. He has absolutely no ability to zip the ball across the field while getting the ball out quickly. It's a full windup or nothing. Pure speculation. The Jets are going to be stuck with Sanchez's contract no matter what. He has a $60m contract over the next 5 years, and $8m in guarantees next year. The Jets are stuck with either keeping him, or buying out that ridiculous contract, because no one else is going to pay that for him. What a stupid statement. Andy Dalton has one of the worst arms in the league, yet he has crushed it for the past two years. Neither Tom Brady nor Philip Rivers have particularly strong arms, yet they have had amazing careers. Besides, McElroy can get the ball out in a fraction of the time that it takes Tebow to get the ball out. A good arm isn't measured by needing to do a full body windup for a 8 yard out. Tim Tebow hasn't won a single job in this league yet. He was the #2 or #3 in Denver, and only got play time because the coaching staff folded when Kyle Orton played himself out of a job. Now you're assuming that he earned the #2 job in New York, yet you haven't seen a single practice, or how he's performed behind the scenes. Ridiculous assumption. The Jets know exactly what they have in the kid. They've watched him for 6 months in training camp and practice. Despite their current struggles, we are talking about men that are paid millions to design schemes and assess talent. Despite what you may think, every single person on the Jets coaching staff knows infinitely more about football than you do. Plus, his teammates have openly stated that he is absolutely horrible. The coaching staff will do what is best for the New York Jets (and possibly their jobs at this point) whether you like it or not.
+1 TypeOne.....you can't convince TeBow Fans that it's "Backwards" following a Player from Team to Team to Team. I don't hate Tebow fans, I just don't get their passion to follow someone froom one team to the next, different strokes for different folks. I could give a shit about a player once he leaves the Jets, cause I'm a Jet fan. I suspect most Tebow fans followed Tim from Gator Nation and could less about the Broncos, Jets or the next foolish team to sign him next year. I wish Tebow the best of luck on the next team he will join in 2013, if it's in the NFL or Canada, he will need it.
But everybody doesn't get a shot -- I don't, for example. You start with people you think have the best chance to develop, and go from there. That's what Tebow's detractors think -- that they've seen enough to conclude he's not worth further development. I've seen a lot of McElroy -- I wouldn't give him a shot over Tebow. I would give him a shot over Sanchez. Sanchez is probably better than McElroy, but Sanchez has had his shot. So this is not about writing off McElroy forever -- it's about making a decision on who gets the shot Saturday, based on different strengths and weaknesses. They're not the same -- McElroy is more polished probably. But he's got arm strength issues.
