I read through this entire post trying to find something to argue about, but I agree on all points, including Fuller, Dennard and especially Reed. Great post.
Thanks, appreciate it. I think we have the roster for a very, very solid defense this year. I think the two main factors that will dictate the ceiling of our defense is Milliner continuing to develop and Patterson staying healthy. Personally I think both will probably be ok, but I am certainly not blind to the realistic possibility that either or both of those factors can go badly for us.
Couldn't agree more. I'm not the hugest fan of Rex at times, but if nothing else he's good for a pretty fearsome defense every year. It's nice to be really good at at least something on a consistent basis.
Personally I like what Rex has brought to the table for most of his tenure here, and I love his defensive schemes. I don't care what head coaches are "supposed" to do, if him calling the defense is part of what makes it so good, I'm all for it. I like that he is very involved with actually coaching the players as well, since his charisma and inspirational ability is part of what makes his players good. I think finding a good corresponding offensive coordinator was key, and I hope we have found that in Marty. I like that Marty has had a lot of proven success as an offensive coordinator, and some experience as a head coach. Since Rex seems to give him a pretty free reign over the offense, he it seems to me he functions almost as an "offensive head coach" more than just an offensive coordinator. As long as the two coaches are in tune there's not reason that can't work. I think we got pretty lucky that Reid got fired from Philly, and thus Marty was free for us to grab. The Jets offensive coordinator position probably offered him more freedom as an offensive coach than any other non-head coaching job.
Not suggesting Ryan should go, as he is a very good D coach, but I doubt the roster would be in for a huge setback moving to a 4-3. I think the talent drafted on D the last few years would do well and maybe thrive in a 4-3. Coples in particular would have a natural position, and the other DL standouts wouldn't be affected really. In fact the DE's could be utilized in the pass rush more. Obviously it would be a setback if they got a bad D coach, but I don't think the players they drafted are 3-4 specific.
They aren't 3-4 specific because Rex Ryan doesn't run a purely 3-4 defense. The whole idea that you can only have one or the other is just goofy. Coples has great potential in the position he is in for a couple reasons: 1. He plays weak side OLB, also called rush OLB. The OLB on the weak side is responsible for rushing the passer, as is the weak side DE in a 4-3. The whole idea that a weak side OLB has much of a role in coverage is just wrong, so people using that as an argument against him playing OLB don't know what they're talking about. Weak side OLB's generally only cover passes to the flats, which Coples can do. Since many rush OLB's struggle vs the run, offensive coordinators sometimes scheme runs to attack this. Coples however, is excellent vs the run and thus reduces this defensive weakness. 2. Rush OLB's in 3-4 defenses often play with their hand in the dirt, especially on passing downs. This is mainly because it gives the player a benefit of a coiled explosive release off the line like a sprinter. Sprinters get a more powerful, quicker start when they do this, and it's why that technique was developed in the first place. Using this to try and differentiate between a 4-3 DE and 3-4 OLB is meaningless, because it is simply a technique to help improve speed off the line. Coples has unique athleticism for a man of his size, and I know that phrase is thrown around a lot but Coples truly makes you double-take when you see the way he can move. This is often lost when you see it from far away or on TV, but I promise your jaw will drop if you watch him in a workout up close and personal. Our 3 defensive linemen are perfectly suited to a 3-4. The 3-4 is dependent on having a true nose tackle anchoring the defense (0-Technique), and he has to be a very hefty man. The idea is that he can cover two gaps, specifically both of the A-gaps which are the gaps on either side of the center. A run play generally relies on the offensive line being able to move the defensive linemen away from the point of attack, generating a hole. A nose tackle is so big that generally he cannot be moved by just the center, and can get off a single block in either direction to wrap up a runner going through the a gap. This is what is meant by the nose tackle demanding double teams-- That if a team wants to run up the middle they have to use a second offensive lineman to generate enough force to physically move the nose tackle away from the point of attack. Hand technique and athleticism are important for a successful NT as well, and Snacks exhibits all of these characteristics. He is 6'4" and 350+ pounds, and no one can argue he doesn't have good technique. A defensive end in a 3-4 generally plays the 5-Technique, another player who is generally responsible for two gaps. Historically, a player who can do this has to be big and have good power, so that he cannot be moved off the point of attack by a lone offensive lineman. The 5-Technique lines up over the outside shoulder of the tackle and is responsible for the B and C gaps. The reason for the shoulder alignment is that angle gives you the best leverage to keep from being sealed off on the outside as a runner shoots through the C gap. You need to be big enough and powerful enough that you cannot be moved by the tackle, and if an offense wants to run through one of your gaps they usually need to double team you with another lineman or TE. Mo is an excellent 5-Technique, but he has become transcendent because he also possesses uncommon quickness for a man his size. He is much more of a pass rushing force than traditional 5-Technique, and he and Watt represent a new breed athleticism at that position. Mo also gives tremendous versatility to our defense, because he has technical mastery over most defensive line positions. Although he truly excels at the 5 technique, an offensive line cannot know where he is going to line up until he actually does it. Watt is even more freakishly athletic, but very few players can move like Mo that are 6'4" 315, and even less can move all around the line. Sheldon is a slightly different player, and he is a little smaller at 6'2" 294. He is very, very quick, and thus before the draft many called him a 3-Technique guy. 3-Techniques line up over the outside shoulder of a guard and are only responsible for the B gap on their side. They are generally quicker but smaller, and can be moved from the point of attack by one lineman (generally) so they are not relied on as heavily against the run. They instead use their quickness to get into the backfield and this is often apparent on passing downs as they get to the QB more. This does not mean Sheldon cannot be a successful End in the 3-4, because he is so disruptive and fast that linemen have a really hard time getting a good block on him. He is not the type to hold his point and then discard the block, he just outright beats the lineman from the snap and is in the backfield so fast he forces the runner to redirect, or makes the tackle if they've already been redirected by Mo and Snacks doing their job well. That is why you see Sheldon running down plays from behind so often, and his rare speed helps him do this. Now what's interesting is that because Mo can play any position, and Sheldon can excel as a 3-Technique, and Coples can play 3-Technique or 6-Technique (4-3 DE) all we have to do is a minor substitution for a 4-3 look. Not only that, but teams aren't even sure where our guys will line up. It's why Drew Brees was so confused when we played the Saints; This kind of versatility across the entire defensive front is pretty much unheard of in the NFL. Calvin Pace is a great strong side OLB, because he is so smart he always knows how to read a play and make the right choice. He knows how to watch the gaps, knows his responsibility, and knows how to use angles to get to runners avoiding our dominant D-Line. He is not the most jaw dropping athlete anymore, but he always knows where to be.
I honestly believe that a rookie who wants to win DROY almost has to be a Pro Bowler or alternate. Kiko Alonso was taken up the alley last year when it came to post season awards. He should have at least been an alternate in the Pro Bowl and was already the PFWA Defensive Rookie of the Year when Richardson won it. I just don't see it happening to Pryor unless he makes the Pro Bowl.
At the positikn that he plays, it will be really hard. He would probably need around 8 picks, at least a couple returned for TD, around 5 sacks and a lot of crushing highlight hits If he can get those kind of numbers then we'll know he's going to be something special
I don't think it as long as you think. Yes history says it mostly front 7 who gets it, but with this being a passing league now I think his chances get better. Also with all the passing teams we will be playing this season. With all those good/great we will be facing he could also look like a bust.
....I don't know about a repeat DROY, but fwiw, I wouldn't be surprised if Calvin Pryor injures Danny Amendola just looking at him.
It's been called a passing league for 10 years and not a single dback has won it during that time. Probably because it's only called a passing league because the rules are stacked in favor of QBs and receivers. It's likely going to be much harder now for any dback to win DROY than it was in years past.
maximus! dude you're the best poster on here, always with the educating shit. The creation of this versatile defense is what should make Jets fans appreciate what Rex brings to the table.
A defensive back winning DROY is a nearly impossible task. The adjustment for a D-Lineman or Linebacker really isn't all that different especially when it comes to the running game. Many of the plays that they have seen in college are going to be very similar to what they are seeing in the NFL. On top of that they are much more worried about 1 on 1 matchups. DB is a different story though. NFL passing plays are much more complex and receivers need alot less space to make plays. The only way Pryor wins Rookie of the Year is if he becomes a pro-bowl level Safety almost immediately AND guys like Clowney and Mack don't post huge numbers. Personally I think Clowney wins it, and not just because of him. If he was on any other team I would lean towards Mack just because his tackle numbers will be huge but with Watt on the same line, teams are going to have to play him 1 on 1. Clowney in college 1 on 1 was a freaking monster. Double teamed he was a quitter and considered his job done by just eating blockers.
You're right. I don't see any dback...just one dbag: Ndamukong Suh. Over the past twenty five years or so, the Jets have had their share of DROY's: Jets - 4 Panthers, Broncos, Texans, 49'ers, Ravens, Bears and Chiefs - 2 Lions, Steelers, Titans, Raiders, Cardinals, Dolphins and Patriots - 1 2013 NFL Sheldon Richardson New York Jets 2012 NFL Luke Kuechly Carolina Panthers 2011 NFL Von Miller Denver Broncos 2010 NFL Ndamukong Suh Detroit Lions 2009 NFL Brian Cushing Houston Texans 2008 NFL Jerod Mayo New England Patriots 2007 NFL Patrick Willis San Francisco 49ers 2006 NFL DeMeco Ryans Houston Texans 2005 NFL Shawne Merriman San Diego Chargers 2004 NFL Jonathan Vilma New York Jets 2003 NFL Terrell Suggs Baltimore Ravens 2002 NFL Julius Peppers Carolina Panthers 2001 NFL Kendrell Bell Pittsburgh Steelers 2000 NFL Brian Urlacher Chicago Bears 1999 NFL Jevon Kearse Tennessee Titans 1998 NFL Charles Woodson Oakland Raiders 1997 NFL Peter Boulware Baltimore Ravens 1996 NFL Simeon Rice Arizona Cardinals 1995 NFL Hugh Douglas New York Jets 1994 NFL Tim Bowens Miami Dolphins 1993 NFL Dana Stubblefield San Francisco 49ers 1992 NFL Dale Carter Kansas City Chiefs 1991 NFL Mike Croel Denver Broncos 1990 NFL Mark Carrier Chicago Bears 1989 NFL Derrick Thomas Kansas City Chiefs 1988 NFL Erik McMillan New York Jets
There is more to the Jets than the Dline, although i do believe even the Dline would be affected. for instance, if Mo Wilk was just playing 4-3 DE every snap, would his skills be fully maximized to the extent he earns over 10M per year? Personally i think his versatility is part of what makes him so valuable. Also would we have much need to keep our talented NT's? maybe, maybe not. depends on the D coach. As a Pats fan, you haven't endured a regime change this century. Every position on both sides of the ball come into question, and potentially even the identity and vision for the team. Maybe they'll prefer zone blocking, and there is a lot of turnover on Olineman. Good chance we wouldn't run the WCO. Geno would be working on a new O, and maybe the coach would like to spend a first rounder on his own QB. Would we employ more Cover 2? Do we have the LB's and secondary to match the vision of the new D coordinator? There is only so many first round picks to go around. Unless we found coaches doing very similar things to today, there would be a lot of roster turnover, some wasted recent draft picks, and yes, another multiyear 'rebuild' process. no thanks!
Very good post Max, and i agree with the vast majority of it. Your last sentence though, 'Landry cannot replicate the unique skill set that Allen provides', i don't think I'm onboard with. When Reed joined the team, Landry shifted to his more natural SS position, and Allen hit the bench. Reed wasn't playing every snap either. When Reed took snaps off, Landry kicked back to FS, and Allen came on. So Landry never missed a snap. That type of versatility, coupled with his experience in Rex's D, is why i believe Landry will be starting game 1 this year. I don't see Rex trotting out 4 guys in the secondary with no experience in his D. I believe he will use Landry's experience to ease in Pryor, to help with calling the defense for the secondary, and to use them interchangeably until Pryor is ready to shoulder the load. Allen i do believe is our SS of the future. And that future may very well happen this season, depending on his progress and how quickly Pryor adapts to single high S and calling the D. I just don't think it will be for opening day, for the reasons stated above. Even if not starting day 1 though, i do expect Rex to find ways to get Allen on the field.
