Hmmm, last I checked, if you have a CHOICE between gunning the ball and lobbing the ball, then you have to make a DECISION as to which way you want to throw it. That puts this into the realm of decision making. That is, unless you want to claim that he meant to lob it, but that it just accidentally came out like a bullet. You're too easy cupcake. Run along and leave the discussions to the grown ups.
A really bad throw is a really bad throw. It doesn't matter how Tebow *should* have thrown it. The facts are that he hit a defender right in the numbers on the 37 yard line when his intended receiver was on the 27, and would actually have been over the 25 by the time the ball arrived if it had been thrown well. It's going to be a long year watching this and then coming on here to deal with the Johny-boy fans of Tebow who aren't concerned with reality, just with how their hero will do some day when he magically becomes better than he is.
Actually, when you get into evaluations and analysis, you need to look at everything. It's like Tebow's interception against Cincy. The pass itself was fine from a mechanics standpoint. The problem was the decision of where to throw it. Identifying this tells you what needs to be worked on. Mark Sanchez's pick 6 is a little harder to figure out. Did the ball go where he wanted it to go ? If so, then it was a bad decision as far as targeting goes. On the other hand, maybe he knew exactly where he wanted to throw he, but his aim was off. That's a different fix entirely. Same with the pass that Phaytal posted the screen cap of. What do you have to fix ? If he was trying to loop it over, but instead, threw a bullet, then you need to fix the mechanics of the throw. If he thought he could squeeze it in there, then you have to fix the decision making. In all the cases, sure, they were all "bad throws", but the question is, what was bad about them ? What caused them ? What do you have to address to keep it from happening again ?
That's your response? That's a really sad response. The decision was good, it was just a terrible throw. The decision was good, any other QB makes the decision to throw that. If a better "decision" for him is to tuck and run because his arm can't make that throw, it doesn't change the fact that A) His accuracy is poor. B.) It was a terrible throw. Btw, I obviously haven't followed Tebow as close as you - but if his accuracy has actually "improved" as you say, than that is flat out scary because he was fuckin terrible this preseason. I would seriously have to question my favorite teams F.O. even more if this is an actual improvement.
I think you misunderstood what I said. There were at least 2 decisions made on that throw. First, whether to throw it or to tuck and run. Once he decided to throw it, the question then is, throw it over the top ? Or fire in a bullet ? IF he chose "fire in a bullet", then it was a bad decision. IF he chose "throw it over the top", then it was bad mechanics as the ball went straight in. I'm doing much the same thing that QB coaches and OCs do rather routinely. They don't just yell and holler and say "bad throw". They come over and ask "what did you see?" "Where were you trying to throw ?" "Why did you make that decision?"
BTW, to all of you, it's a rather forgone conclusion that "it was a bad throw". Haven't said anything to the contrary. I'm looking at it in more detail. Was it the throw itself (mechanics), or the decision making (bullet or over the top) ?
It was a terrible throw made while Tebow was running to his right with his left arm and with the intent of hitting a receiver who was to his left. That's just not going to work most of the time. It's not just the throw, the receiver had somebody on him and had people both inside and outside waiting to jump the route if Tebow hadn't throw a bullet. The guy who actually made the interception was the least likely of the 4 defenders to get the ball. It took a really bad throw for him to make the interception. If Tebow doesn't throw a perfect hard strike to the receiver the odds are really good one of the other guys comes down with that ball. The only throw Tebow should have been thinking about making on that play was to the receiver on the sideline in front of him and he should have been making that throw high so that only the receiver had a chance of getting it.
Again, I'm not arguing that it wasn't a bad play. Simple question. Did the ball go where Tebow meant for it to go, along the path that he meant for it to travel ? If it did, then it was a bad decision on Tebow's part, not a bad "throw". By "throw", I'm talking about the physical mechanics of the pass. If it didn't. If the ball was off target from where Tebow wanted it to go, or if it traveled a different path (bullet instead of over the top), then the decision might have been fine, but the execution of it, the mechanics of the pass itself was the problem. It quite possibly could even have been both. That the pass was off target from where he wanted it to go, and how he wanted it to fly, AND it could have been a bad decision as well.
I'm seriously in awe of your excuse making. Even if the guy that made the pick wasn't there, that pass is still behind, and at the shoelaces of his receiver, and likely picked by the other defender jumping the route. It was a terrible throw. He was 4/14 against 3rd stringers, and you say hes getting better. He threw a ridiculous pick (should have been 2 picks), and you say his accuracy is improving. He overthrows a 6 yard swing pass by 8 yards, and you say he is becoming more consistent. Get real dude. Your boy sucks.
Dude, you just don't get it do you ? I haven't made an excuse for that play. Overall, it was bad and the interception is completely on Tebow. What I'm doing is trying to access what actually went wrong. What was the mistake or error. That's ANALYSIS and it doesn't surprise me a bit that you don't understand it. It's in depth problem solving. It's delving into the details of a situation to determine what actually went wrong, so that you can focus and figure out what needs to be addressed to fix it. Like I said, when they go back over this play, the coaching staff will want to know what Tebow saw. They will want to know what his thought process was. They will want to know who he was throwing to. How he meant for the ball to travel, straight or over the top. When they get this information, they will determine whether it was a problem of mechanics, ie. ball didn't travel where and how he wanted, or that it was a problem with his decision making. That he thought he could squeeze the ball between the defenders, when he should have laid it over the top. Or even that he chose the wrong receiver to throw to.
I love it that you are telling me, and everyone else questioning Tebow's skills, that we have no idea how to analyze a football player. I've been watching and playing football for longer than Tim Tebow has been alive. I'm guessing that you started following football when the Swamp's feel good story started making headlines. You entertain me. :lol:
Oooh, longer than Tebow has been alive ? He was born in 1987 and I started playing football in 1975. Was watching football before then. So no, I didn't just come along after Tebow came to Florida. And yeah, I am telling you that you have no clue as to how to analyze a football player. You just sit there and say "bad pass" without a clue as to the different components and things that you really need to look at. You know, WHY was it a bad pass ? Was it the mechanics ? Was it the decision making ? Was it poor vision ? Was it poor timing ? Was it an accuracy problem ? Nope, you just see/say "bad pass" and roll along your merry and deluded way.
But he has magic and intangibles. In seriousness he does not suck he just sucks as a Qb. As a wildcat type player or a runner he just might be the component that put the jets over the top. Unlike Denver the Jets have a good young Qb on the rise and on the verge of breaking out not a jag like Orton. They also have a conventional backup in Mccelroy. Don't listen to the media don't listen to the Tebow freaks listen and watch the games. You don't put your starting or backup Qb on special teams you put your gadget player there and that what Tebow will be a very good gadget player. The Jets have played this preseason very close to the vest it may back fire but I think it is very smart. Why give the Bills any film whatsoever on the new offense? I think Sanchez looked pretty good this preseason although it was pretty obvious the jets where evaluating the run game this preseason. I do think the jets will be a run first team this season but do not be surprised to see them chuck it around more than most are expecting.
We need to stop analyzing every pass each qb throws especially the back-up that isn't really expected to throw much. It's exhausting and a waste of time. People need to quit trolling. Especially fans of other teams that are here for that reason only.
Because it was all those things that is what makes it a bad pass. Favre and Marino mad up for poor decision making with rocket arm and quick release. Pennington made up for weak arm with pin point accuracy and anticipation of the route. Tebow as a thrower has 1. bad feet (hard to fix at this stage) 2. Slow and awkward release (hard to fix at this stage) 3. Reading and learning defenses did not have to do this college (takes time does not seem to have progressed) 4. Bad pocket presence (not sure you learn this) You have one of these issues you will struggle in the NFL have all of them impossible to become a good passer in this league. His proponents say but he can the run the new NFL. They have been saying that since the NFL started yet runners never last or win in the NFL. I will say this again and again and again a run first Qb has never won a Superbowl never. There have been several successful Qbs that have made the transition. Randall, Gannon, Young, Mcnabb and as I suspect Cam will make the transition also. As other young Qbs are working on breaking down film, reading defenses, learning the playbook Tebow is working on his mechanics throwing motion and technique. There is no catching up in the Nfl
1. Bad feet are not hard to fix. 2. he's already made major improvements in his mechanic and I believe that he will continue to progress. 3. He's reading defenses better this year and actually going through progressions. (*NOTE: I said that he was better, not that he's all pro at it. Yes, it will take time and experience.) To your last point, sure, you can catch up in the NFL, it might just take another year. It is why Tebow was seen as a 3-4 year project, as opposed to a 2-3 year project like most other QBs. As foryour point about "running qbs" not winning SBs, in my view, it's a product of the system. Every year, there are 31 QBs that don't win the SB. Most of them are "traditional pocket passers". Some of the greatest "traditional pocket passers" to ever play the game didn't win a SB. The league has largely stayed away from running QBs. Those that have come into the league have been forced to accede to conventional wisdom and become pocket passers. I think that this will change. While QBs will still need to be good passers, they will be used in the running game more and more. Funny thing is that things change in the NFL. Before Mike Ditka came along, Tight Ends were really seen as offensive weapons, especially not in the passing game. Today ? Teams are scrambling to find great TEs who can catch and be a threat.
I score that one as the "bad throw" type. Need to loft it to the endzone, not fire a head-high rifle bullet.
