Completely disagree. 1. We need DL too. Dixon is the only guy on the PS who stood out last year. I know they let the NT dress once, but I still have no idea who he is so that doesn't bode well. We also got ripped in that game on the ground in the first half...t'was the Steelers game. 2. Reed is valued at 30 by who? I think you're making a big reach with that statement. Reed's been a fun story and he's the kind of guy you root for during draft season, but the hype is just hype. 3. I read the other day that the Ravens were looking at Ballard in the first at 26...I've read nothing about Reed in the first but by the fans. 4. Reed didn't even hold his ground in a fan article based on the facts about his college career. His 10 yard dash was great, and congrats to him. Ballard is 20 pounds heavier ran a slightly slower 40 and a slightly slower 10...again...20 pounds heavier. 5. Reed's frame is maxed out. Ballard can hold more than 283 pounds moving forward. 6. The bench press has nothing to do with functional strength. It's personally one of my least favorite exercises. I've also heard Ferentz, the Iowa coach, isn't a fan of the bench press too. 15 is a crappy number no doubt, but I'm not really worried about that.
A) Heres one link saying about the Ravens working out Reed saying he has entered first round consideration http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Ravens-working-out-Brooks-Reed-Ricky-Elmore-today.html B) On ESPN, the Pats may consider him in the first http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4694389/mock-thoughts-castonzo-reed
Great, great, great post JetsLookingforDWare. I personally would rank Ryan Kerrigan #1 but he should be long gone by the time the JETS pick but I wouldn't be surprised if they trade up, just not for him. The problem is the JETS play a 3-4 system and they shouldn't draft a guy that has played in a 4-3 system his whole career and expect him to easily transition to the 3-4, example Vernon Gholston. Akeem Ayers has played in the 3-4 system so he shouldn't have a problem. Justin Houston to me has the highest ceiling of all four players, slightly ahead of Kerrigan, in my opinion because he played in the SEC, he's battle tested, and he has transitioned from playing in a 4-3 system his sophomore year to a 3-4 system his junior year, and his numbers stand out tremendously to cement that fact. Brooks Reed is getting a lot of attention but his own fellow teammate Ricky Elmore is a better prospect and is going to be drafted higher than him in next year's draft. At the end of the day, the JETS are going to draft a player that has the ability, speed, strength, and intelligence to make the team better and Justin Houston is that guy.
The thing with that is, very few run a 3-4 in College. Then narrow that group down to the teams who run it effectively, the talent pool becomes even smaller. You have to draft from 4-3 teams, there is no way around it. And Vernon Gholston isn't a great example considering he played the "Leo" position at tOSU, akin to the Rush OLB in a 3-4. Elmore is in this years draft and will not be picked until 2-3 rounds after Reed. They have similar playing styles, but Reed physically blows him out of the water. You successfully described someone, but it's not Justin Houston...
What part of he's going to be in this years draft do you not understand? http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=78819&draftyear=2011&genpos=DE
^ Thank you. That takes care of points 2 and 3. I'll address the other points... 1) Yeah there are good DL prospects that will last till round 3 or 4, like your boy Ellis. If Ballard goes over Reed, then someone missed out on value or they are set with their pass rush. 4) haha... You dismiss Reed's WR-esque 10 yard split and then laud Ballard 40. Ballard's a fucking DL. His 40 doesn't matter. His 10 does. You are wrong. 5) I don't need Reed to get bigger. I just need his game to improve further so he can dominate in the NFL. Same with every prospect in the draft. 6) I was using measurables, since you're a measurables guy. Measurables guys are employed by the Oakland Raiders.
Um, Ballard threw up a 1.65 10 yard split 20 pounds heavier. You sir, are wrong. That's not RB good, which I guess means something moving forward, but a 283 pounder who threw up a sub-4.8 with that kind of 10 yard split is having a good workout. You just blew that off. You are wrong. I am not a measurable guy. I'm somewhat of a measurables guy. I just find them useful, and like anything else you can take info from them. That said, I am a nerd, I have alot of time, and I see alot of these guys play football. The measurables are just another stat to look at. Reed is not a bad football player, but he's unrefined and a little stiff. If you've seen Ballard play, you'd know that for a very large man he moves his feet like he weighs 200 pounds. Props on the guy with the links, and good luck to Reed there. I just have trouble believing that a 5th year 24 year old senior who's hype kind of came out of nowhere...some of it partially based on the fact that because he played DE, might play LB, and has long blonde hair...kind of like the best pass rusher on the latest SB winner...is suddenly our best option at 30. It's not like he's the last DE/OLB prospect in the draft either...if the situational pass rusher thing is such a big deal then why not an experienced college pass rusher like Cliff Matthews or Steven Friday... When did Reed become the hot pick at 30 here? It kinda happened at JI for a little bit too, but is in it's later phases of hype.
Casman02, thanks for catching my error, as well as NDMick. I'm only human. I meant to say that Brooks Reed is getting a lot of hype for his hair and combine results but Elmore is the better player on the field and yeah, he's in this year's draft. Scouts will hype a guy up but the player still has to perform on the field. The Combine can elevate and/or hurt a guy's stock but the game tape and stats don't lie. Plus the conference these players play in and the caliber of there opponents has to be considered. And NDMick, great analysis on the 40 time. The first ten yards is all that matters for players playing close to the line of scrimmage.
Not ideal, but better than nothing when you haven't had the opportunity to see some players in action before, and much better than just reading what someone else says about them.
We'll see who makes the better pro. IMO college stats don't mean that much. They're just an indication, a part of the puzzle, not the whole picture. Some players put up great stats in college then bust or are only mediocre in the NFL. Some kids are late bloomers, or don't do that well in college because of the system they're in, or because they don't respond to the style or personality of their position coach, yet when they get to the NFL and get some good coaching, they seemingly come out of nowhere. It happens every year. You can't coach speed and physical talent, and speed is what the Jets need at OLBer.
You didn't say a thing about Ballard's 10 yard split. You focused on the 40. And Clayborn, his teammate, ran a 1.61. So I guess I'm gunna want him over Ballard. You said in another thread you're a measurables guy. I've seen Ballard play, he can kick ass, but there are other times I've seen him do nothing. Kinda like Clayborn this year. Those two Iowa prospects are intriguing but neither are safe picks. They both have strong red flags against them. And I will not say Reed is a safer pick, but his stock is higher for a reason. The Senior Bowl happened. Reed was already an intriguing prospect, and then the coaches got a hold of him and his stock has risen since. This isn't an armchair scout phenomenon. This does come from the people who matter and has trickled down to us, the mere fans. Reed translates to the NFL. That's what people see. That's why he can go higher, unlike Matthews or Friday or the more productive Elmore.
Here's me quoting me: Also, I'd probably take Clayborne over the Almighty Reed too. Only reason I wouldn't is because of the shoulder thing. 1. I said in that threat that I'm somwhat of a measurables guys. Like numbers in baseball, or certain people, they're just another tool. It's really not a hard concept to grasp I don't think. 2. I've seen Reed do nothing. I highly doubt you saw him play or even heard of him until maaybe some highlights before Senior Bowl week or something. 3. You say Reed's stock is higher. You are wrong. You want him to be higher so you've made it true in your head. There is a massive different. Even if you think it's higher because of the words you've read, that's hype, not his actual draft stock. What did Brooks Reed do at the Senior Bowl? I watched him have a good week too. What'd he do that made him a first rounder? You do realize that Ballard had a really good week at the Senior Bowl week too, right? This IS an armchair scout phenomenon, I have 0 doubts about that. Reed probably does translate to the NFL...I've said over and over again that I like him quite a bit...he just translates best as a mid-second to third rounder. I COULD have him as high as the top 40, but no, I don't think he's so special. You are wrong. You want to be right though, which is always good to see. Brooks Reed is overrated. Plain and simple. I have no inclination to take him when there's so many quality DL guys to take who are similar or straight up better athletes. You keep blowing him for his 10 yard split...they're RB delicious and all that I understand...I'll take the 283 pounder from a bigger, better program who was like .07 seconds slower if we're going by measurables. The guy who isn't 24 years, isn't a 5th year senior, and was still very productive for a high end college coach at a much better than Arizona program...who didn't just show up at the Senior Bowl and suddenly become everyone's favorite Clay Matthews imitator.
Christian Ballard >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Brooks Reed Brooks Reed = Jarron Gilbert of 2011. Instead of jumping out of a pool it's good straight line speed and long, flowing, blonde locks.
Ok, I agree with most of your points about Brooks Reed. I personally think he is getting a ton of hype as well, and shouldn't be in the first. But.. Then, you want to say Ballard is better then Brooks Reed. Not a chance man.. Your whole argument is being based off of measurables and combine numbers. That isn't something that should be compared between the two, at least, not to determine who the better player is. Ballard is very soft, isn't very physical, and display's that VG mentality on the field. That is a HUGE red flag, as we all know. Reed may not be a very athletic kid, compared to others, but he is a motor that wont stop. He loves football, and he can get after the QB with that mean streak in him. Reed plays the game the way you should, he mans up, and loves contact. He also has great instincts. That alone for me.. Reed > Ballard
Whoa whoa whoa...Ballard makes as much or more sense than Reed at 30. That is mostly what I'm saying...that and this board is really enjoying d-riding the everloving shit out of Reed. Loving football and having a motor are not real reasons to draft a guy 30th overall. Also, he won't have great instincts when he's put into NY to play in a top 5 professional level defense at a whole different position. This isn't rocket science and common sense is telling me that Brooks Reed is not a better choice than Christian Ballard. On the Ballard being soft thing...I can understand that as someone who also saw his youtube highlights...unfortunately, like with Akeem Ayers, youtube highlights can do that to a player. Ballard is very good against the run, and was probably Iowa's best DL this year on a very talented DL. Again...beyond perceived need and a hack comparison to Clay Matthews that he got when he started getting hyped there is no real reason to consider this 24 year old 5th year senior from the University of friggin Arizona a legit option at 30. I really think it's hilarious that this nobody comes out of nowhere for a week, and suddenly he's one of the best pass rushers in the draft (which he is...just not first round quality) and a slam dunk for a first round pick. If this nobody is first round quality, then a guy like Ballard from a big program under a big coach who played quality football for a long time without adding any extra years is probably capable of doing it...Even if his 10 yard split isn't that of a RB...it's off by a few miliseconds.
