Junc...you have had some wild debates with stretch marks all over them..but this one takes the cake. The facts you use are so bizarre. They really are. Bottom line..and I would rather have a tooth pulled then go back and read all of your posts..is that you think Brady is much better then Manning? Manning is poor performer in the playoffs? Why would anyone want to have a debate with you over this? Its childish. Its feeding into your brain that you can spin anything you want to read anyway you want it to read. Guys...give it up. Its not worth it. I used to think you brought enough to the table to be worth the effort...but knocking Manning because of a couple poor performances in the playoffs..and saying the COLTS DEFENSE HAS BEEN JUST AS GOOD AS THE PATS DEFENSE...its what children do to stir the pot..not even adults.
You think that was a good pass? Isn't discussing sports and what others do that we cannot do childish in the first place? As far as this debate, I'm sorry you fall prey to the fantasy #s. Some of us look deeper and have watched all his playoff failures. I'm sorry if you fall prey to the hype about the NE defense and the excuses about the Colts defense. Either engage in the debate or stay out of it. If you have something to share that would be of benefit to the discussion please participate but if all you want to do is attack me save yourself the time and move on to a different topic. Peyton is a top 5(probably top 2-3) QB in the regular season, where he drops dramatically is in postseason. If he played almost as well in postseason as he did in the reg season he'd have 4 SB titles AT LEAST by now but we know it has to be his teammates and coaches responsible for all those losses and not the great peyton. Keep listening to what the "experts" tell you, I'll form my own opinions from watching these guys play and i'll back up my opinions w/ facts. I agree w/ you there. The funny thing is I like manning more than Brady b/c I have always rooted for Indy to beat NE but it's obvious to any objective person watching Peyton's postseason history that he has been nowhere near as good in postseason as he has in the reg season and that he has held Indy back in postseason.
Yes. It was thrown right to him, hit him on the hands and should have been caught. You are only claiming it wasn't a good pass because you looked at the stat sheet and saw Manning threw 2 INTs before even knowing what happened and you are now scrambling to try to convince everyone that it wasn't a good pass. It wasn't thrown too hard. It was thrown right to the RB Kenton Keith who had it bounce off his hands. It should have been caught but wasn't. This is the last I'm even discussing it because it is so obviously a good pass from Manning that should have been caught.
Right to him except a little high and hard just as this seldom used RB was turning around from just 5 yards away. This was not a routine catch, it was a very difficult one. You are so clouded by your love of Manning you cannot see this. Watch the slow motion replay- they have the videos at nfl.com. The man threw TWO critical INts that cost his team at least 6 pts and they lost by 4 but there's never been a Colts win the great peyton wasn't repsonsible for and there's never been a Colts loss that he was reponsible for.
I watched it on my big tv last night from the multiple different replays they showed. It was slightly high to the point where Keith had to raise his arms up. He didn't need to jump but did anyway. The ball hit him on the hands and WAS NOT thrown too hard. They lost by 4, but Vinateri missed a 29 yard FG earlier in the game that would have put them down by 1 when they were marching down the field on their second to last possession. Instead of needing to go for the TD they could have kicked a go ahead FG. Regarding the INT...Get a clue. The ball was not thrown hard and should have been caught
and putting that INT aside. After SD took the 28-24 lead Peyton had not one but TWO chances to win the game. Gets the ball w/ 4:50 left at Ind 23, leads them to SD 7 where he couldn't finish off the drive. Gets the ball back w/ 1:30 to play and one timeout at IND 32, they go 4 and out and give the ball up on downs. Putting aside the 2nd INT, we disagree on the pass but whether it was his fault or not why couldn't he lead them to the go ahead score on one of those 2 possessions? What is the excuse for that?
still #1: Peyton ready to throw too soon has to pump fake b/c the receiver is not there yet. Still #2: keith turns around, ball is delivered. Still #3: Keith has to jump. Still #4: Ball is also to the right of him that he has to stretch out. Watch the link at nfl.com, Keiths momentum is carrying him to the left and Manning throws it to the right. http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2008011300/2007/POST19/chargers@colts#tab:watch
But I thought the only reason Brady won was b/c he had Vinatieri? By the way, AV missed a FG against ten in 2003 but Brady later led them to a late FG to win that div rd game. In SB XXXVIII against Car he missed TWO FGs(a 31 yarder and a 36 yarder was blocked) but again Brady led them back to the win. What's the next excuse?
His momentum is leaning to the left. He turns and stops right as Manning throws the ball. He needlessly jumps and the ball is not thrown too hard. It SHOULD have been caught. You're the only person I know that blames that on Manning. It's beyond comical.
His momentum is taking him to his left, the ball is thrown to the right and hard from 5 yards away and he has to reach for it. Putting that aside, answer the question about the last 2 drives. and the AV point was made b/c you guys always said Brady won b/c of AV. Never mind he mised 2 kicks in a SB that was eventually won by 3. B/c he missed one in '07 that cost Indy the game not peyton's 2 picks or his inability to lead them to a score on the final 2 drives.
That ball was not thrown too hard. It doesn't matter how many times you say it, it was not thrown too hard. IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN CAUGHT And then Vinateri kicked the GW in that SB. Are you suggesting that Vinateri's missed FG did not have anything to do with the outcome in the game? Or Harrison's fumble? You blame it ALL on Manning and I continue to show you there are other things that happened to help the Colts lose that game. You blame it ALL on Manning becuse there were two INTs thrown (one wasn't his fault) but ignore the missed FG and Harrison's fumble. The first drive the got inside SDs 10 and had to go for it on 4th down because they were down by 4. On 4th down Manning had to throw it slightly behind Addai because there was a LB coming in front of Addai. It would have been a tough catch and Addai dropped it. In retrospect they should have kicked the FG with their timeouts remaining. Before you make your big claim that Brady makes plays for NE at the end of the next game (AFCC) Brady threw TWO passes where Kevin Faulk made great plays. First was a diving catch and the second was over the middle where Faulk had to reach behind him to make the catch. Maybe if Manning had Faulk in that situation he catches that pass and saves Manning like he did with Brady. Their next drive they had 1:30 left and 65 yards to go without any timeouts and needing a TD.
Those mistakes played a role but the point is in SB XXXVIII Brady had to overcome TWO missed FGs AND a Brady INT at the carolina 2 that cost NE at least 3 points. The difference btw the '07 div rd game btw Indy and SD and the NE-Car SB was that Brady bounced back and made plays while Manning couldn't. Indy had 1 TO from their 32 w/ 1:30 to play. More than enough time to get down the field.
Yes, but it's not easy as you are trying to suggest. The defense gets to play too. If they only needed a FG they would have called different plays and tried to get into FG range instead of needing the TD. They tried to get the ball down field in a hurry to give themselves legitimate chances to score a TD. I've always said Brady's best game was in that SB you've mentioned.
The first time they got it they had 3 TOs and over 4 mins, then he had 1:30 and a timeout at their 32. Easy? of course not but certain possible and they didn't even get a 1st down on that second possession.
They lost their timeout when Wayne got knocked out after dropping a pass when he got hit by Marlon McRee. They would have been inside SD territory. The 4th down pass was just too far as it bounced off Dallas Clarks hand. It would have been a tough catch but one that could have been made. Manning wasn't terrible on that last drive.
Wayne was hurt w/ 1:03 to play after an incompletion on 3rd and 5. It was 4th down after they had to use it b/c of the injury and they were at their 37 b/c after 3 plays they could only gain 5 yards. So needing a TD on that last drive and only gaining 5 yards and turning it over on downs Manning wasn't terrible? he completed a 5 yard pass and and 2 incompletions and used 30 secs of the min and a half and it wasn't a terrible last drive?
This is what I mean when I say I am uncertain whether you even watch the games. Yes, Wayne was injured after an incompletion. You can easily gather that information from NFL.com's play by play chart. What you didn't mention or even acknowledge was that Manning put the ball right into Wayne's hands in between two defenders and Wayne dropped it when he was hit by Marlon McCree. Then on 4th down his pass hit Dallas Clark in the hands but he couldn't hang on. It would have been a tough catch, but the ball was placed pefectly. Yess, Manning wasn't terrible on that drive. They didn't get it done but there were other factors. He wasn't off the mark or threw it to the defenders. This is what you don't see when you read box scores and play by play charts. The results of the last drive was not good, but the plays that were made by Manning were not terrible. But keep throwing everything you got on Manning. The facts are and have always been, that he played well in that game.
