Yeah I get what you are saying. I was just trying to say that if we could upgrade the NT position it would greatly impact the rest of the defense. At this point it seems like it doesn't matter who you put in their at ILB. As long as we don't have a legit NT who can consistently command a double team our linebackers are going to struggle. An upgrade at NT would greatly improve our defense against the run while a OLB with actuall pass rushing skills would greatly help out our defense agaist the pass. The NT and OLB positions are arguably the two most important positions in the 3-4 and as of right now we are weak at both.
Right idea but you are thinking too big. We can trade Vilma for a 3-4 pass rushing OLB/DE hybrid. At this juncture, he doesn't have too be great; he just has to have the ability to rush the passer. We don't have an OLB on the roster with pass rushing skills. Thomas is a solid player but he is not very good at rushing the passer. From what I've seen in pre-season in Pouha.
Let me say this after I cooled down alot, Ellis is way better in the 4 - 3, so is Vilma so is D-Rob My Front 7 LE Coleman, DT D-Rob, DT Mosely/Pouha, RE Ellis Hobson, Vilma, Thomas What they really need to fix is the point of attack, N.E. looked like they had 11 men blocking for Brady & Co. Also why the 10 yard cushion by our DB's am I missing something? Trade Vilma yeah right, the guy had a pro bowl year playing in the 4-3. A couple questions What are we going to get for him? Would it help us now? Where are you going to find a massive 325 lb 3-4 DT to replace D-Rob? Maybe the Mangini can pop out of his lamp and give us these answers
I really cant take todays game as an indication of anything, for one we probably played one of the better offenses IF NOT the best offense in the league. I'd take a bet that Pats do that to alot more teams this year... Secondly were we really expecting to stop that offense with barrett STARTING ? With dyson injured ( SOFT) I saw somethings I liked out there, well get better... O .... Mangini is not going to change his defense forget about it..... We just played a team that was obviously better then us TODAY.... Well see them again, and well be ready...... On another note, we may never know what exactly is chads injury with this head coach heh ?
Bradway, how can moving Bryan Thomas into a position where has already proven to be less effective than his current one not be worse? Does Kenyon Coleman have the size to play DT in a 4-3? I seem to remember that the best 4-3 defense the Jets had was in 2005 under Herm when we still had Jason Ferguson who is at least 15 lbs. heavier than Coleman is. We lost Ferguson, kept basically the same defensive players (with the exception of swapping Donnie Abraham for Ty Law and Reggie Tongue for Kerry Rhodes) and managed to field one of the worst defenses in the league.
Ellis is an excellent pass rushing DE in a 4-3, that would at least give us something. The3-4 just hasn't worked out and it has reduced the effectiveness of our best players on D. Robertson, vilma and Ellis are not 3-4 players and they are trhe best we have besides Rhodes. All we heard was how flexible we'd be but this defense is anything but flexible. The D was an embarrassment yesterday, whatever NE needed to do they did. The O played well enough to keep us in the game but the D did absolutely nothing and if nto for a couple of dropped passes and a botched snap on a FG the score would have been alot worse.
no, he's too stubborn. the fact that we play the wrong scheme isn't the only problem with our defense, but a lot of the flaws wouldn't look as glaring if players played where they fit.
Give the pats credit for picking up the blitzes even when we sent more than 3 or 4 rushers. That said, it seems like nobody in our front 7 (whichever 7 you want to include) can get to the QB. I was waiting for some delayed blitzes, sending a linebacker or safety in after the first 3 or 4 rushers went in, but we never did that. At least that might have forced Brady to make a few throws before he wanted to. I can't remember a QB having that much time, all game. Bottom line, they need to find a pass rush pretty damned fast.
Agreed, we didn't even have a very good pass rush in '04, we have been in need for an upgrade in the pass rush for years now
Dyson----------Coleman, Pouha, Roberston, Ellis----------Revis ------------------Hobson, Vilma, Thomas --------------------Rhodes, Coleman
Ellis isn't good enough to be the pass rusher on this team even if we switched to the 4-3, definitely not good enough to be our pass rush, no matter what we have to improve the lines after the year is over
We weren't bad against the run yesterday, our nonexistant pass rush is what killed us yesterday, it is better to just finish what we started and finish the 3-4
Ellis is a 3-4 DE. He excels in the system. Harris is an outstanding young ILB in the 3-4. Barton is playing out of position, has been for 2 years - he and Hobson. Barton is an OLD in the 3-4 who has show in the past he can rush the passer and create pressure. He has long arms and should be outside. Hobson is better inside next to Harris. The Kickers are Robertson and Vilma - our two former #1 picks. Neither is suited to this defense, and it shows often. Vilma is a tweener, always has been - but can play inside behind a better BIGGER NT. The key problem is NT. Is it time to put CJ Mosely in and see what he can do as starter? I've wanted to replace Roberston for 3 years now... We did play the best offense in the NFL Sunday - so wait and see, the D will improve, but to reach the next level, we need some changes, and I'm sure Mangini will make them.
other than the 2 times that miller was juked out by Moss and the quick passing, our secondary played pretty well, it was just that Brady had a year and a half to throw the ball, no secondary would look good in those conditions
We weren't a garbage team when he got here, we were injured in '05. he inherited mostly the same team e had from '04 where we were a kick away from the AFC title Game and had a top 5 D. Ellis is a 3-4 DE? he's had his worst years in the 3-4, the only effective year he had was as a rookie. he was a Pro Bowler as a 4-3 DE.
