Leo Williams worth

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by nevbeats319, Sep 25, 2018.

  1. AJT73

    AJT73 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2016
    Messages:
    1,134
    Likes Received:
    1,011
    Just going by history. The Jets should not take anyone from Penn State or USC. I hope I'm wrong with this because of Darnold. But first round picks from Penn State: Blair Thomas, Kyle Brady. I'll throw Hackenberg i n their too.

    USC: Keyshawn (was a good player but an issue off the field), Sanchez and now Leonard Williams.

    Just an observation with some history.
     
  2. LeonNYJ

    LeonNYJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2008
    Messages:
    5,002
    Likes Received:
    832
    Keyshawn was so good once they had someone to"Just Give Me the Damn Ball!"
     
  3. Matthew_McBride

    Matthew_McBride Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2013
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    80
    But what makes you say he's a top lineman besides other people's opinions. As most of us watch every play of every game, we see a lot more of the Jets than most analysts.
     
    JetsNation06 likes this.
  4. STARoSCREAM

    STARoSCREAM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2015
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    817
    I think not having a true edge rusher is hurting Leo's production. If we sign, lets say Fowler, next season, the opposing O-line will have to decide where to dedicate extra protection.


    If they double Leo, the edge rusher is 1 on 1, if they put excess protection on the edge then Leo with get more 1 on 1 looks.

    having a very good edge rusher makes the rest of the front 7 that much more effective, if for no other reason than the opposing team must account for the up front play makers
     
  5. JdotGriff

    JdotGriff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,114
    Likes Received:
    342
    read my stats post on the previous page sir
     
  6. JdotGriff

    JdotGriff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,114
    Likes Received:
    342
    Now you are just falling into the group with the rest of the trolls. "I Don't care about facts I only care about what I see on my tv. "

    Henry Anderson is taking advantage of what its like to not be the focus of the Oline. Henry Anderson is not taking the brunt of double and yes sometimes triple teams from the blockers. This is the Benefit of not being the main threat to offensive lines. Hence why adding an edge rusher to this defense will allow Williams to be that much better. Like 80% of the guys listed
     
    K'OB likes this.
  7. Matthew_McBride

    Matthew_McBride Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2013
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    80
    Geno Atkins, I do not consider Carlos Dunlap a bonafide edge rusher by himself, I think he is made BY Geno. Same with Fletcher Cox.

    I don't think Leonard is that good, he's not bad, but he's not a great player, he's supposed to make the people around him better and make plays regardless.
     
  8. JdotGriff

    JdotGriff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,114
    Likes Received:
    342
    2015 Carlos Dunlap 13.5 sacks
    2016 Carlos Dunlap 8.5 sacks
    2017 Carlos Dunlap 8 sacks
    2017 Carl Lawson 8.5 sacks

    You dont think Henry Anderson is about to have a Career year because of Williams? You think its magic he hit the jets and is playing better than ever?
     
  9. JdotGriff

    JdotGriff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,114
    Likes Received:
    342
    Bottom line despite the knowledge fan base we have here Dline pass rushing is not a 1 man job. You need talent around your talent or you just get buried by blocking scheme's

    You also need to give your defense breathing time with offensive drives so they aren't mentally and physically exhausted come 4th qtr. Even int he browns Game Williams had so much push on the pocket till the late 3rd / 4rth Qtr Where the continues double and yes sometimes triple blockers just became too much for him. IF you had an edge rusher while this shit happened QB pressure would be very consistent. If the offense had to Actually pay attention to an edge rusher Williams would not be as tired and free'ed up more to get through blocks.


    This is common freaking sense. Not even like you need a high football IQ to understand this
     
    #89 JdotGriff, Sep 27, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2018
  10. nevbeats319

    nevbeats319 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,960
    Likes Received:
    670
    He was drafted #6 overall. He should be so good they build the scheme around him. Almost every player I named before gets double teamed. If the jets got a big time edge rusher then they won’t need to pay this guy to do what he does
     
    94Abraham likes this.
  11. Matthew_McBride

    Matthew_McBride Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2013
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    80
    Yeah I don' think Carlos Dunlap or Carl Lawson are great pash rushers, and I believe their numbers are inflated by Geno Atkins. I don't think Leonard Williams is very good.

    And no, I don't think Henry Anderson is going to have some amazing breakout campaign.
     
  12. STARoSCREAM

    STARoSCREAM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2015
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    817
    If we signed a good (not great) pass rusher like Fowler from the jags in the off season, you don't think he would benefit from Leo being double teamed?

    Elite pass rushers, that don't need the aide of another very good linemen that eats up double and sometimes triple teams, are far and few between....and EXPENSIVE. Look at Khalil Mack, his contract is something like 6 years $120 million, and THE elite pass rusher of the league.

    Sometimes a combo works just as well, like with the Bengals, or about 7 years ago or so when Aldon Smith and Justin Smith of the 49ers were eating up O-liens together.
     
  13. JdotGriff

    JdotGriff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,114
    Likes Received:
    342
    So you agree with me Jesus thanks was that so hard. He needs talent to success just like 90% of the people on your list had around them and 100% of the people statistically better than he had.

    Also I never once said a big-time pass rusher I simply said A pass rusher. We don't need a Miller Mack or Jones we need a Fowler Irvin or Judon type pass rusher. True defenses have a key player at all 3 tiers of the defense and we are missing our pass rusher. Find one and this defense will rise quickly. Dumping another one of those tiers because we already lack one is a recipe of the SOJ theory
     
    #93 JdotGriff, Sep 27, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2018
  14. JdotGriff

    JdotGriff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,114
    Likes Received:
    342
    Who said amazing breakout. I said career year. You said that williams needs to make those around him better. For the first time in Anderson's career (outside of 1 fg deflection), Anderson is contributing well to a team.
     
  15. Matthew_McBride

    Matthew_McBride Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2013
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    80
    I absolutely think they would be a good combo. I'm very in favor of that idea--but no I don't think Leo is an elite player, maybe hit or miss on pro bowl level player.
     
  16. Matthew_McBride

    Matthew_McBride Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2013
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    80
    I don't know the extent of Anderson's career, or what his baseline is. I just don't think Leo is elite, or all-pro level. I don't think he's worth a real big contract.

    If he comes at a moderate price, then yeah I'd love to have him contributing, but I saw him turning out better than this.
     
    ColoradoContrails likes this.
  17. STARoSCREAM

    STARoSCREAM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2015
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    817
    i agree, by no means elite, but that SHOULD mean we don't have to dish out an elite level contract for him. Pair him with a very good pass rusher and I'm good
     
    ColoradoContrails likes this.
  18. WarriorRB28

    WarriorRB28 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2003
    Messages:
    9,842
    Likes Received:
    2,194
    I saw Williams getting blocked by one o-lineman many times against the Browns and he was getting stonewalled.

    Why would a OC need to devise exotic blocking schemes for Leonard Wiliams that kind of respect is given to players who have proven they can take over, dominate, wreck a gameplan.

    Williams hasn't proven to be that type of defender.
     
    ColoradoContrails and 94Abraham like this.
  19. WarriorRB28

    WarriorRB28 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2003
    Messages:
    9,842
    Likes Received:
    2,194
    Nah I understand that as a former top five pick, a guy who's been marketed by the Jets as one of the faces of the franchise and with him now doing tv commercials chances are good he sees himself as a 'star' and will charge accordingly.

    He'll also be what 25? When his rookie contract with the Jets is up.

    He's not accepting a bargain deal common sense tells me his agent will advise him to test the open market IF (I pray) the Jets do lowball him to see if there's a sucker out there willing to pay him what he wants.

    How many are former top five picks?
     
    ColoradoContrails and 94Abraham like this.
  20. JetsNation06

    JetsNation06 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    6,935
    Likes Received:
    2,958
    Did you ever notice the recurring theme with Jets players who are overrated by some fans a la Mo Wilk, Sheldon Richardson, etc? And they went on to star for other teams with more talent when they left the Jets, right? NOT.

    Sometimes you just gotta face facts and realize the talent level on this team is bad. Williams ain't all that. And he's not the problem so I'm not trying to knock him because he's a solid player. My bigger point is Mac fooling people into believing he's doing his job and he's not. This team has bottom 10 level talent due to Mac's crappy drafts.

    Throw the 3-4, 4-3 crap in the garbage where it belongs. The eye test rarely lies. Like I said Williams is slightly above average, but to make him out to be elite, or close to, is delusional and not accurate.
     
    WarriorRB28 likes this.

Share This Page