I wouldn’t want my football IQ to be compared to Favre’s lol. He came into the league not knowing what a nickel defense was. But point taken.
Can you please let us know what you see? @legler82 How does Allen compare to Wentz in your eyes? I hate Allen but I feel better that you are high on him. Seriously. There is a chance Jets might draft him. I don't want to be depressed draft night. I want to be happy. So your take on Allen gives me hope.
It looks like I’m not going to have time to do this today, but it’s the next football related thing I want to do and I’ll post my thoughts in this thread when I get to it.
Josh Allen might be the Kristaps Porzingis of the NFL Draft. If the Jets end up with him the fans will flip out until they seem him throwing bombs over the heads of Patriot corners in a blizzard. At the end sometimes we overthink things as fans. Would it shock anyone if an athletic guy who is built like Cam Newton and has a Brett Favre like right arm is a successful QB at the next level? It sure seemed to shock people that a 7’2 guy who can run the floor like a PG would be a successful NBA basketball player. Josh Allen is not a perfect prospect, but he is absolutely worthy of a top 10 draft pick.
I was pro Allen, then anti Allen, now I’m neutral. I would implore people to watch the Oregon game. There is no cut up of just his throws, so it takes a bit of effort to do so... This is the most damning piece of evidence against Allen for me. I realize his team was outgunned, but he totally looked every bit as bad as the worst moments of Hackenberg when faced with that level of pressure. I like what the kid has done since the end of the season + seems like he can be developed, but the bust potential is there.
Favre had a rocket arm with great football IQ on the field. He just wasn’t a student of the game which is different from football IQ.
I got around to watching some Wentz NDSU games again... Wentz and Allen are very similar in their abilities to stay on their feet through tacklers and extend plays. They both have such strong legs that they shed can shed defenders even when firmly in the grasp. Allen is actually better than Wentz at this. TBH, I don't think either has a very good natural feel for pass rushers - they often never see them coming - but they get by with brute physicality and athleticism in the pocket rather than finesse movements. Both do have occasional moments where they maneuver through the pocket though. Arm strength is very similar but the slight edge goes to Allen. They can both consistently squeeze the ball into tight windows that not many prospects can. However, while they're similar players in the intermediate range, Wentz is much more consistent both short AND deep. Allen has a tendency to spray the ball on short routes (especially flares/flat routes) which is what probably elicits the Hackenberg comparisons. He also overthrows his deep ball way too often, which sucks because someone with that arm strength should be able to capitalize on it downfield. Wentz's deep ball shows much better placement and opens up the rest of the offense as well as providing the occasional huge play. Both Wentz and Allen had some accuracy issues. Wentz's mainly stemmed from his slightly elongated release preventing him from getting on top of the ball, leading to some passes sailing high. Allen's seem to come from overstriding. Lots of people suggest that it's easier to fix lower body mechanics than the release because of muscle memory, so we'll see if Allen can overcome it. Wentz is also more consistent throwing on the move, whereas Allen misfires occasionally when throwing off platform despite several absolute DIMES on the run. So far, they're pretty similar players despite Wentz's superior deep ball. Here come the 3 categories where I think Wentz really pulls away... - Processing speed: Allen far too often gets stuck on his first read while Wentz sees the entire field much better. Additionally, Allen has a bad habit of fleeing the pocket when his first read is covered, whereas Wentz remains calm and looks for his second receiver. - Anticipation: Allen relies on his arm strength way too much, leading him to throw passes extremely late. There are times where he throws out-breaking routes when his receiver is already on the sideline. It's impressive arm strength, but I don't think it'll work all the time in the NFL. He's either going to be sacked from holding the ball too long, or he's going to tip to defenders where he's throwing. Wentz routinely threw receivers open before they were finished with their breaks. - Touch: While Wentz regularly floated passes between levels of the defense, I think Allen has less of a natural feel for being able to do this. Like many strong armed QBs (Mallett, Flacco, etc.) Allen is infatuated with his fastball and seems reluctant to ever throw anything less. This led to numerous occasions where there was an open receiver but the pass was batted down by a defender who was in the throwing lane but could have easily been thrown over. Wentz had remarkable touch for a guy with his arm strength. In all, Wentz is every bit as good as I remembered him. Allen stacks up in most areas (especially the physical ones) but falls short in several very important ones. Whether or not they can be taught remains to be seen.
Good assessment. This is the stuff I see as well. Can Allen fix this stuff? Probably, but not overnight, ad by that I mean maybe it'll take 2-3 years. I don't think the NY Jets fans will tolerate that long of a project. Some people hear referred to Rosen as likely experiencing a "Rodgers fall", but I think Allen might be more apt to have that, and frankly I think it would be for his own good. He needs to go to a team/situation like Rodgers did and be able to sit and learn for a couple of years. I see the Giants as a good spot for him.
Plays for the Knicks. Was one of Phil Jackson's "guru" picks three years ago, and while he has shown tantalizing flashes, he's often hurt.
Thanks. That's what I suspected. If someone had responded that he was an NBA player, I was gonna ask what's the NBA? LOL I hate the NBA.
Nitpicking at its finest, I hate when "scouts" say things like this but then don't provide the tape of it.
At least he said Allen does NOT have accuracy issues. So I don't want an Allen hater whose been saying all along he sucks because he is inaccurate to use the "great" Orlovsky's evaluation for validation.
Sometimes crappy QBs on the field are better evaluators. I think seeing the field is still an issue for Allen and it will take time for the game to perhaps slow down for him. Then again, this is a problem for a lot of young QBs so why bash Allen for it.
Actually, I feel his evaluation of Allen is pretty accurate as it's very close to mine. He just puts a TON more weight on those negatives than I do though. I've being saying for a while now if you are hating on Allen because he is inaccurate then your reasoning is a false one. His processing speed may never develop to that of a Big Ben but he still get to the Cam level. Also to use the Iowa, a game where his team was completely unmatched, as a point of reference is a tad bit unfair. Josh Allen 2017 Games Discussion Thread Post by: legler82, Jan 29, 2018 in forum: Draft
