JD gets some credit for this debacle too...

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by Cman65, Sep 29, 2020.

  1. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Whoever said that Jets fans are the worst in the NFL had it right. I can't believe some of the absolutely stupid negative BS I'm seeing in this thread and on this site.
     
  2. WarriorRB28

    WarriorRB28 Well-Known Member

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    Aikman is a very impressive analyst and coming from him a HOF QB for the Cowboys a great organization his words carry a lot of weight.
     
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  3. WarriorRB28

    WarriorRB28 Well-Known Member

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    We got roasted by one last night Jeudy.

    And Becton will have to stay on the field to sniff Canton.
     
  4. WarriorRB28

    WarriorRB28 Well-Known Member

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    Where's the 1 win coming from?

    Last night might've been their best shot.

    0-16 is looking & feeling like a very real possibility now.:(

    If coach Gase gets fired I hope the Johnsons do it the right way this time.

    CLEAN FRICKIN' HOUSE!!!!

    Hire the GM first and let him find the new HC.
     
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  5. WarriorRB28

    WarriorRB28 Well-Known Member

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    There were so many possibilities.

    This offense should've been loaded for bear for Darnold. With Adams & Quinenn on the defensive side.

    The Jets should've been in on the wide open AFC East fun this season.

    HOW HOW HOW after last season's 6-2 finish to get to 7-9 could they possibly think that this was the correct course of action to take?
     
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  6. MJK

    MJK Well-Known Member

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    He traded down and Mims unexpectedly fell to the Jets....if JD was so high on Mims he's not trading out of the second round spot when Mims was mocked early second....I'm not arguing not taking a left tackle at 1 I'm arguing not trading up for a receiver or staying put and drafting Claypool....the fact the Steelers took Claypool who have a great track record with drafting receivers is a big tell.
     
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  7. LAJet

    LAJet Well-Known Member

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    Absolute nonsense. Take away that gift that fucking Desir gave him on a horrible pass. Jeudy is a very very good player drafted in the first round. The comment about Becton is crap. He played hurt and with a lot of heart, no thanks to our idiot coach. Every fucking player has to remain healthy to make Canton and very few do.
     
  8. Mickey Irish

    Mickey Irish New Member

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    I can't believe people bashing Becton. This dude is a beast and could be one of the most solid pieces of this team for the next 10 years. It's not a coincidence the Jets had some of their best years when D'Briskishaw and Mangold were in their prime (for a good 7-8 years). Taking those 2 in rd 1 back in 2006 was one of the best decisions this shit organization has ever made. Great pick by JD. Games are won in the trenches.
     
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  9. Section 336

    Section 336 Well-Known Member

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    Or a good GM has a pulse of who teams are targeting, what their needs are and make decisions based off of probabilities. You have no idea what JD thought of Mims, he may have felt that their was a strong likelihood that Mims would still be there and took advantage of it.
     
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  10. LAJet

    LAJet Well-Known Member

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    Agree 1000%. Getting quite depressing actually.
     
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  11. Mickey Irish

    Mickey Irish New Member

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    Fans are sick of losing. Can't blame them. Also, I think the Jets fan base is passionate as hell. When this is even a .500 team people go nuts at the thought of making the playoffs. Imagine an actual winning organization could do for us? Not as much can be said about team like the Patsies who have no appreciation about what has happened the past 20 years and actually boo TB last year when the offense didn't click for ONE game. That is a disgrace. Not Jets fans.
     
    #171 Mickey Irish, Oct 2, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2020
  12. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

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    If history is truly doomed to repeat itself, Becton and Williams could be this year's trade bait. How long will it take many of the posters here to understand draft picks come with no guarantees, even at the highest level? If you have a couple of guys doing the job well you don't lose them for a few dollars and create new holes that need to be filled.
     
  13. NYJetsO12

    NYJetsO12 Well-Known Member

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    I am 80 per cent happy with our new GM particularly the way he wheeled and dealed a bit at the Draft

    The Free Agents, letting Robbie go well thats another story

    So I read 2 articles in the online Post by Costello that were critical of JD and he's right

    The Problem is mostly with the FA hires and not necessarily with the Raven philosophy of "right player, right price"...this will work if you get your evaluation correct

    Douglas failed at the OL reconstruction (his evaluation)>>>Van Rotten Fant and McGovern came cheap but they have not protected our QB efefctively..no better than last year. I think this concerns me the most..

    Plus, while I am not worried about letting hissy boy Jamal go Joe D, wouldn't give Robbie A, Sams big target, a 20 mil contract (he has now) and paid down for Perriman at 6 and half mil and the guy does not show up fro 3 out of 4 games!?

    The other point that BC made in his articles was that Gase Sam and JD are on different timelines due to Chris J's failure to fire MM sooner

    Sam and Gase have to win now while Douglas has 4 and half more years to put together a Playoff Team
     
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  14. tomdeb

    tomdeb Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, I totally disagree. Douglas IMO has done a nice job of trying to recover from the total debacle called Mike Maccagnan. MacCagnan drafted terribly for FIVE years, totally ignoring the offensive line, and wasting high picks on guys like Darron Lee, Leo Williams, Chris Hack, Ar Stewart, Chad Hansen etc. MacCagnan traded three second round picks AND a 1 first round pick just to move three spots in the draft without even knowing who would be there. Worse yet, MacCagnan locked the jets into ridiculous multi-million dollar contracts for losers like Tru Johson, Quin Enumwa, La Bell, CJ (sit out) Mosely, Dar Revis, Mo Wilk, etc. What did ANY of those losers do for the jets after they signed for millions? Douglas at least has the jets in great cap shape for next year when they hopefully bring in a new coach. Douglas was forced into MacCagnan's cap situation, he was forced into pairing with Gase, and he deserves say some into the next coach. I thought that JD's draft in 2020 was good except QB Morgan in round 4 when I thought he should have gone WR. Who knows...Morgan could turn out to be a good pro anyway. At least Douglas has TRIED to address the offensive line, an area that Mike MacCagnan announced at his press intro in 2015 would be built with low round picks and free agents (what a stupid thing to announce). IMO Douglas is NOT the problem.
     
  15. RedRoute1

    RedRoute1 Well-Known Member

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    I'm a big JD supporter but I think everyone in a leadership position in this organization takes blame anytime the team is this bad, that's the way it works in the world no matter the business. The real question is how much blame do you assign to everyone? That's where I think we need to take into account what JD has to balance:

    1) Year 1 of a colossal rebuild where doing it the right way takes time...using the draft...not spending big in year 1 on FAs that, because of the shellfire of NFL players, most likely won't be able to help the team by the time the rebuild is at the stage of putting this team in contention. This should be year 2 of the rebuild but ownership bungled fireing Mac...

    2) Year 2 of working with a friend (Gase) that essentially got you the job, which I think we'll look back to say is the only thing Gase did right for this organization because I think Douglass is the real deal and Gase is a pretty terrible leader/coach...There's just no way all of incredibly positive feedback from all of the NFL execs could be this wrong about Douglas, when they all nailed the bad decisions we made in hiring Idzik and Mac...You can't predict success unless there's a proven track record so one never knows, but starting from the point we did with Douglas at least feels right.

    3) Year 3 of evaluating their QB of the future, not killing the team w/ FA contracts (see #1), yet trying to provide the players at the right place that will help you with your evaluation of this asset....All at a time that after 16 games in 2020 you need to make a huge decision on this asset...Yes, the talent level stinks, but it really started with the Idzik hire and the entire lack of talent in the pipeline leading us to where we are today...Ownership's fault

    4) Year 9 of unscrewing the bad decisions of ownership caused by the terrible decisions they've made in executive leadership hires at Coach and GM...This was actually made worse by the org structure they implemented where both the coach and gm report to the owner...I'm not saying the structure in general is terrible but I am saying with this ownership group it is terrible as ownership just completely has no idea what they're doing when it comes to the business of football...I truly believe they want to win desperately, so they're not apathetic, they're just incompetent...Not sure what's worse but it's pretty terrible

    5) Year 10 of dealing with the reality that this team's paying fanbase is tired of rebuilding and hearing about starting from scratch...100% Ownership's fault for continuing to hire the wrong people...Knowing your season is over by Columbus Day every year is quite frankly horrible...Once or twice a decade, ok, that's acceptable as long as you know the team has a plan to get back in contention the other 8 years...As a fan, we all know you can't win the SB every year, but being totally out of meaningful games year after year by Columbus Day is just flat unacceptable

    6) Doing all of this in NYC...Let's be honest, have you ever seen a team this bad consistently get so much media attention...Cleveland's been a worse org and how often did that ever get play on ESPN, NFL Network and all the related media outlets/talk shows...Losing teams usually get no coverage...But this comes with the territory in NYC....

    I'm sure there's more but that's what came to mind and makes Douglas' job pretty hard...That's why the guy held out for 6 years, he's not dumb and wasn't desperate...He wanted the job but on his terms only and I love that, shows confidence and understanding of how this works and needs to work to get it right. Think if we give JD a chance we'll all be pretty happy but in the meantime we have to suffer through the failures of ownership over the last dozen or so years, Gase being one of those failures, and see where we're at in 2022. The only tragic part of this is Darnold, what becomes of him I'm not sure but I have a feeling it won't be half of what he deserves at least while he's on the Jets...Makes you wonder how many players this organization has screwed up over the past few decades as the one thing that's been consistent has been ownership, and they're seriously and ridiculously horrible.
     
  16. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Right now running the Jets is close to an impossible job.

    There's no talent on the roster.

    The fan base is used to useless free agent acquisitions that won't change that fact because it's what we always do.

    The young QB is about at the end of his rope after 2+ seasons of playing with no talent around him.

    The HC is an introvert who does not lead well.

    The DC is an extrovert who always gets his defenses in trouble eventually due to his advanced age and the fact that the NFL has evolved away from what worked for him when he was in his prime.

    The GM did exactly what you would expect him to do this off-season and parlayed the Jets into as many draft picks as he could. He stockpiled future picks to help the Jets rebuild. Wise moves however they certainly did not help the HC or QB this year.

    The fan base was looking for Joe "Mary Poppins" Douglas to fix things immediately and make the Jets into a contender but the sad reality is a successful rebuild at this point means 7 or 8 wins next year and maybe playoff contention in 2022.

    However... The next QB isn't likely to be on that schedule with an average talent base around him. The young guys who have done really well early on in the last couple of decades have had an outstanding cast of supporting talent to work with. The Jets talent at best might look like the Chargers in the early 00's and those Chargers got Drew Brees fired.
     
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  17. CotcheryFan

    CotcheryFan 2018 ROTY Poster Award Winner

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    Not even playing in a Super Bowl for 52 years and counting has made the fanbase angry and impatient. Plenty of heartbreak, misery, embarrassing plays, and collapses along the way to make us believe this team might be cursed. We're conditioned to expect the worse.
     
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  18. LAJet

    LAJet Well-Known Member

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    If the do trade Becton or Q I’m done with this sorry excuse for a franchise. Both positions are key pieces to rebuild a team and harder than hell to find. Both players have nothing but potential. I’ll be so disappointed with JD who I am hoping is also our only shot to fix this mess I would say fuck the stupid ownership and move on. Jets, Knicks, poor owner destroys a team for generations.
     
  19. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    It's not very often at all that we disagree, but we definitely do on this point. To begin with, Douglas hasn't failed at the OL reconstruction. This season isn't over yet and with no OTAs and/or preseason, we all knew it could take a while for the OL to gel and for them to play well as a unit. The truth is however, they may never play well as a unit. Douglas knew that. That is evidenced by the contracts that he signed them to. Fant can be cut following this season with $2 million in dead money, but $7.4 million in cap savings. Van Roten can be cut with $250k in dead money but with $3.25 million in cap savings. McGovern is the only one where the Jets would take a hit. He would cost a dead money charge of $10,666,667 and ($1,333,334) in cap savings). Andrews has been a better backup at C than Harrison, and he also has played decently at RT. He will be a FA at the end of this season. Conor McDermott played pretty well against Denver. The depth and flexibility of the OL is definitely better, but still not where we want it to be.

    On top of the "right player, right price" philosophy, don't forget that the Johnsons supposedly hamstrung Douglas in FA limiting how much he could spend. He could have wanted to sign other OL, but not been allowed to or perhaps those players didn't want to play for the Jets or live in NY/NJ.

    I don't think most of us believe that JD is done with the OL reconstruction. It will likely continue in the 2021 FA and draft, and possibly even into 2022. Clark could develop in to a quality starter by next season, or at least be a quality backup. With all the extra draft picks over the next two seasons, I think it would be a mistake to think that Douglas isn't going to draft any more OL.

    Fant has struggled with run blocking, but he has been much better at pass blocking than his predecessors. If I were Douglas, I'd find a new RT as that position needs to be an excellent run blocker as well, and make Fant the backup LT and blocking TE. So far McGovern hasn't been good, but I believe he was ranked as a top 15 NFL center, his play at center with Denver was better than his play at OG, and he was considered to be a pretty good OG. NFL.com had this to say about him: "All too often, McGovern was the calm in the middle of the trench storm as his Denver linemates disintegrated in a maelstrom of blown blocks and ill-timed penalties." He was ranked as the 75th best FA available, ahead of Brian Poole and Andrus Peat to just name a few. I don't know what his problem is here. It could be the scheme, it could be trying to help Van Roten, or it could be some issue with Gase and/or the OL coach. We have to hope that he turns things around by the end of the season. Even if not, the Jets could get rid of him in 2022 when he would only cause the team a $1, 333, 334 dead money hit and result in $9 million in cap savings. I don't understand why Van Roten has been so bad. He was solid with the Panthers the last two season. Van Roten has steadily improved during his NFL career, just becoming a starter a couple of years ago, and continued showing progress as a starter. He could still adjust and his play wind up being better than Winters. If not, he will be gone.

    No GM can predict how well a player will perform on his team. They don't have crystal balls. All any GM can do is evaluate whether the player has talent, whether he's a hard worker, how well that player has played to date in his NFL career, whether he has improved during his NFL career and is likely to continue to improve, if he is a scheme fit, and if the has the right character/attitude.

    Neither Costello or the Post are the be-all, end-all in reporting. Like Mehta at the Daily News, it's part of his job to create click bait, and you know how negative the NY media is.

    I've said it before that not re-signing Anderson could have been a mistake, and I wanted Sam to have a familiar target, but I wouldn't have given Anderson $20 million. His effort was lacking at times, and he dropped more than his share of passes, I believe.

    Criticizing Douglas because C. Johnson didn't fire Mac early enough is silly and makes no sense. How is that Douglas' fault?
     
    #179 NCJetsfan, Oct 3, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2020
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  20. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    What makes you think JD would trade Becton or Q Williams. I don't believe that is even a passing thought in JD's mind, much less something that would happen.
     
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