I already did and there was not a 5 1/2 year lull 2004 with the Giants , 86.5 QB rating, 62.8% , 2054 yards in 10 games 2005 with Cards 85.8 QB rating , 64.5% , 2713 Yards in 10 games 2006 with Cards 89.3 QB rating, 64.3%, 1377 Yards in 7 games Those seasons can Hardly be construed as a "Lull" - they are not the 4,000 yards Great seasons(though 2005 could have been) but they are far from supar, especially if you extrapolate the #'s to compare them to a 16 game season.
Player - Games Played - Championship games/titles Warner - 109 - 2SB - 1 championship Jim Kelly - 160 - 4 SB Aikman - 165 - 3 SB - 3 championships Van Brocklin - 140 - 2 championships Staubach - 131 - 3 SB - 1 championship Waterfield - 91 - 4 championships Luckman - 128 - 2 championships Graham - 72 - 10 championship games - 7 championships Warner's numbers are clearly just a tad below those of the listed HOFers. His games played well below his peers of the modern era and most of the old timers who played less games per season. Everyone on that list also has at least 2 championships or 3 championship game appearances. Warner does not. I am going to stick with my original stance whereby he becomes a first ballot lock with a combination of a 2nd championship title, or a few more solid years or another championship game appearance. The politics involved must also be considered. Warner is not the popular figure Kelly and Aikman were. They were the faces of their franchises. Fitzgerald is the face of the Cardinals. I have always thought he was a great QB and couldn't understand why he got the Jeff Garcia treatment everywhere he went, but that is public perception. While he is certainly turning heads lately, he went through years of relative obscurity from a media standpoint. I think this also hurts his case. The 2 MVPs are a good argument and may well go far, as will the fact that he is hot at the end of his career, so his success will be fresh on the minds of HOF voters. His accomplishments thus far may be enough to get him in, but surely do not yet make him a lock.
Absolutely. Two MVPs, 3 SB appearances, a ring, some of the most dominant seasons in QB history. He had one bad season, another ruined by injury, got thrown under the bus, then split time in AZ for 2 years but put up decent half-seasons. If someone would have shown some loyalty to him he'd have broken some records.
One of my favorite players in the game. I started liking him when he was in New York because I have always felt people un-fairly wrote him off and i knew he still had it. way to go kurt :grin:
I didn't think th deserved it before but leading 2 different teams to SBs, having one of those teams be the Arizona Cardinals along w/ his 2 MVPs, SB MVP, etc... I think it's enough for us to all throw up watching his speech in Canton talking about his Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
I used to hold his lack of intelligence, his religion and his wife against him, but the man can play football. granted any time he's been successful he's been surround by a ridiculous cast of skilled players. but he's taken 2 teams the big game and that more most players will ever see. especially at his position.
2004 he threw 6 TDs and 4 INTs in 10 games. That is not HOF numbers. 2005 he threw 11 TDs and 9 INTs in 10 games. That is not HOF numbers. 2006 he threw 6 TDs and 5 INTs in 7 games. That is not HOF numbers. 2002 and 2003 he was injured. He played 37 games out of a possible 80 in 5 seasons. That is a big time lull in his career and needs to factor into the discussion on whether he is a HOF QB or not. You can't extrapolate the numbers over a 16 game season and use that as an arguement as to why he's a HOF QB. I understand the MVP's and SB appearances play a factor but so does 2002 thru 2006 seasons.
He was benched in 2003 after one game because of poor play. He was benched in 2004 after losing two games in a row, and Coughlin made the decision to put Eli Manning in as the starter. In 2005 he lost his job to McCown. Granted it was after an injury, but he couldn't get his job back. That is somewhat telling. The first ballot thing is a big deal because it shows some question on whether he belongs (which is the title of this thread). I agree, that if you're in your in and getting in on the 2nd or 3rd attempt doesn't mean you don't belong. I get it that you think he's a slam dunk. I do not believe that he is. There's too much in between where there was no production for Warner (injury or not). I still feel he will eventually get in but not immediately and he shouldn't get in immediately.
He Threw 11 Td's in 2005 not 1 - nice try though And Yes you can extrapolate #'s to determine what kind of #'s and season he was having, if you look at 2000 yards you say oh lousy season but when you factor in only 10 games it is the equivalent of 3200 yards for 16. He Also had seassons of 41 (ridiculous),21, 36,27 and 30 TD's -- Coupled with the mediocre seasons they are HOF #'s As of Now Career reg season , 65.4% comp, 28000+ yards,8.04 YPA and 182 TD's to 118 Int.
That was a typo ... calm down a little pal You actually think you can extrapolate numbers and use that to show he belongs in the HOF? AYFKM! :breakdance: His really good seasons are why we are having this discussion. But his really bad seasons are also why we are having this discussion. It's not a slam dunk that he's going to be a HOFer
He probably isn't a HOFer right now but if he wins another SB that could all change. Especially against this Pittsburgh team.
If you extrapolate Warner numbers from 2004 thru 2006 2004 - 3286 yds 9 TDs 6 INTs 2005 - 4340 yds 17 TDs 14 INTs 2006 - 3147 yds 13 TDs 11 INTs But the neat thing about this is....You will never know becuase HE DID NOT play all 16 games
Absolutely and this run with the Cardinals is nothing short of amazing and the most impressive of them all. The 1999 run was amazing too, but theyhad Marshall Faulk where during this run they had no running threat at all. It is interesting to note that Warner is playing with the guy that replaced Faulk when the Colts traded him to the Rams.
Warner should be a mortal lock. The goal is to get your team to the SB. Warner in his up years has done more than most NFL HOF legends. The guy was as good as anyone when he was healthy. I would have said yes based on his two MVP seasons and SB victory.
I think he's in. I also give him a lot of credit for ragging on himself yesterday before giving credit to our lord and saviour. Man's got to know his limitations.
