Here are the QB stats for Gruden's Tampa Bay teams after the Super Bowl year: 2003: 27 TDs, 22 INTs, 81.5 rating 2004: 24 TDs, 18 INTs, 89.1 rating 2005: 15 TDs, 17 INTs, 73.5 rating 2006: 26 TDs, 11 INTs, 91.0 rating 2007: 18 TDs, 8 INTs, 91.7 rating 2008: 18 TDs, 13 INTs, 83.8 rating That's not Bill Walsh, and it's not Sean McVay. It's about 21 TDs, 15 INTs, and an 85 rating, hardly what anyone would call big numbers. Nobody criticized the Bucs for firing him after the 2008 season, and no one other than the Raiders was begging him to return in the last five years, and the Raiders have always been more fascinated with the idea of things than the things themselves. He did a great job of keeping himself in the public eye with his Failed Football Coaches Association, but there isn't any reason to think that he is actually all that special as a coach.
That was a faaaaaar different time from now. And if you remember what Tampa's QB play was like before Gruden got there that was a vast improvement.
Can't have those when you're charging or are looking to charge $20+ million per year. With the big dough comes big expectations.
Your second favorite team besides the Jets is the Raiders? The RAIDERS?! What kind of a Jets fan are you?! I just barfed a little.
Baloney. First, I made a couple of mistakes in transcribing things; here are the right numbers: 2003: 27 TDs, 22 INTs, 81.5 rating 2004: 24 TDs, 18 INTs, 89.1 rating 2005: 17 TDs, 14 INTs, 80.7 rating 2006: 14 TDs, 18 INTs, 66.2 rating 2007: 18 TDs, 8 INTs, 91.7 rating 2008: 18 TDs, 13 INTs, 83.8 rating The league rankings for the team in passing TDs were 5th, 11th, 23rd, 28th, 20th, and 19th; that's consistently well below average the last four years. The league rankings in QB rating were 12th, 10th, 16th, 30th, 8th, and 15th; that's mediocre, with plenty of random variability. Those numbers reflect a very conservative offense that is just trying to not make mistakes, especially starting in 2005, resulting from not much talent at QB. Seems to be a "passing guru" should be able to do better than the exact same strategy every coach without a top QB does. Gruden's entire reputation is based on two players - Brad Johnson in 2002 and Rich Gannon in 1999-2001. Even there Gruden's effect is open to question, since Johnson had years almost as good with different teams beforehand and afterwards; Gannon had fine years under Gruden, but had an even better one after he left. Gruden is great at one thing, however - being a huckster, which is exactly why the Raiders hired him. They wanted a public face for the move to Las Vegas that could distract the high rollers from the fact that the team wasn't very good. Maybe it will work out, but I doubt it, and certainly there is no argument that history suggests that he is some offensive genius. That perception comes from his incessant selling of himself for the past 10 years.
Apparently Chucky said this to his assistant coaches earlier this week: "Damn - Khalil Mack had another strip sack. Are you ... kidding me?"
The fact that you are a Gruden guy after all the crap the media has bestowed on him is impressive. This tells me you have your own mind that is not easily swayed by the media like most folks. I was never a big Gruden fan, but now that the media is dumping on him I hope he proves them all wrong. The only thing I don't like is the Chucky Dolls I will have to see every time I see a Raider game. Gruden does like having an offense that pounds you with the running game. I remember him once saying if you can run the ball 40 times and control the clock it was a satisfying way to win. In this pass happy league, not sure if you can do that these days. As to Prescott, probably the most overrated QB last year so I agree with you 100% here also.
You don't compound one mistake with another in the other direction...just because Carr's not been worth his money (so far) that doesn't mean you trade a guy who clearly is in Mack and completely de-fang your defense. And the Raiders were just one season from being a great up and coming team with both Carr and Mack, there's no reason to think they couldn't have done better with Mack this year and won all the close games they've lost so far. You act like they've had 5-7 years together without success, Carr wasn't even available IN the playoff game they lost. And btw if Gruden is as great as you say about finding a QB off the street just because of Gannon then why can't he mold Carr (who has shown flashes) into an elite QB? They don't really have a choice, they can't easily cut or trade him. Dollars to donuts I don't even think Gruden's the reason they traded Mack, I doubt his master plan was to get back in the game and start playing Moneyball, rebuilding a team that didn't need rebuilding. He just dutifully played the public heavy rather than say the organization didn't have enough money to pay Mack the signing bonus he wanted.
Which is extremely unlikely...I like the exercise someone proposed a while back. Take any two consecutive first-round picks in your team's history and see if you'd trade them for Khalil Mack. The VAST majority of the time the answer is of course you would.
What was the Bucs QB production like BEFORE he got there? He was brought there for one reason to get that team over the hump. They won the Super Bowl. Mission accomplished. The end.
I'm convinced I know more about football or my team than many of these media people. I don't believe they watch the games or understand what they're seeing, many just parrot what their sources tell them. There's a few I have a great amount of respect for like Mike Francesa but it's a very low number. It's a different game now. On the surface going away from the ground game defies logic even with all the rules favoring the passing game. What better way to beat these great QBs/passing attacks than by limiting their possessions by controlling the TOP with your offense? I believe that style of play could still work but the league doesn't want that they want these cookie cutter 'great' passing attacks.
Mack didn't elevate his game after Carr went down. That team went down without much of a fight. Contrast that to how Philadelphia played after their starter went down last season. I thought the same exact thing was going to happen to Philly instead that team stepped up. Can't start handing out multiple $20+ million per year contracts before they've had any postseason success that'd be madness.
It's not his fault the previous regime paid a middle of the pack QB like he was Peyton Manning 2004/2013. Then a defender that didn't make a difference after Carr went down two years ago comes asking for another $20+ million per year contract? I'm sorry no I would've done the same thing. He's been away from the game for a long time it's called rust. If the Raiders fans want something REAL sonething built to last they'll have a little patience. Otherwise heck bring him here if he gets fired and we still haven't hired Jim Harbaugh.
Sorry to get back to you so late, life has been crazy again. You are so right about the league being so much into the passing game. I personally believe it has ruined the game. In the old days, part of the enjoyment of a football game for me was watching the punishment QBs endured. Could you imagine what kind of stats Namath would have today? Call me stupid, but in very bad winter weather, you need a running game. Also a good running game protects the QB and makes Red Zone success even better. Oh I miss the old NFL days! By the way it appears a good running game helped the Jets kick some ass against the Broncos! Oh I wish I could have seen that game in my area!
