Has JD vastly improved the Jets since taking over?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by KingRoach, May 21, 2022.

?

Do the Jets have a better roster now than 3 years ago?

  1. Yes

    58 vote(s)
    65.2%
  2. No

    3 vote(s)
    3.4%
  3. Too Early To Tell

    25 vote(s)
    28.1%
  4. I Hate The Jets

    3 vote(s)
    3.4%
  1. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    21,415
    Likes Received:
    20,928
    Drawing conclusions on the roster is the purpose of this thread.
     
    KingRoach and abyzmul like this.
  2. All Gas No Shake

    All Gas No Shake Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2009
    Messages:
    2,128
    Likes Received:
    713
    all of them
     
  3. cval

    cval Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2010
    Messages:
    3,583
    Likes Received:
    3,371
    I think it is possible to get close. Depends on more than just Zach. If the line, running game and defense play well then yes. How are we defining the top half, QB rating?

    EDIT: I really do not care that much where Zach's rating is per se. I want to see him grow and play better and win some games. I want to see him become an NFL QB, the ratings will take care of itself.
     
    #63 cval, Jun 17, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2022
    KingRoach, Noam and ColoradoContrails like this.
  4. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    On what scale? I couldn't find any.
     
  5. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    I also don't care that much about ratings but someone made the comment that he could move into the top half of QBs as if it was a cake walk. And I don't know what he wanted to use for a ranking but somebody else says a handful of QBs have done just that. I would echo your added final sentence.
     
    cval likes this.
  6. NYJ1970

    NYJ1970 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2019
    Messages:
    513
    Likes Received:
    483
    I think more specifically that's YOUR understanding of the thread. It's certainly not reality. Your statements are so Outlandish and assuming that's like me saying, "The Jets are going undefeated this season and they'll win the SB 40-0" dumb
     
    Noam likes this.
  7. KingRoach

    KingRoach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
    Messages:
    2,998
    Likes Received:
    2,386
    Jerrod Goff.

    *2016 Rookie year started 7 games. Straight trash. QBR TD:INT everything. 35-40th in most metrics.

    2017 Very good year, great TD:INT, top 10 in most metrics.
     
    #67 KingRoach, Jun 22, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
  8. KingRoach

    KingRoach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
    Messages:
    2,998
    Likes Received:
    2,386
    It’s the off-season, we have 3 huge unknowns offense, defense and coaching staff.
     
  9. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    The question was if there was any reasonable expectation of Zach Wilson leapfrogging from the bottom of the league to the top half and if anyone had ever done so after his rookie year.

    Goff was still bottom half of the league in both completion percentage and QBR his second year. So, depending on what metric is used, If it takes a week or so to come up with Goff as a typical guy who Wilson can aspire to be, the Jets are in deep manure. Solid mediocrity is probably enough of a goal for 2022 and would represent a big jump in performance.
     
  10. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2010
    Messages:
    5,452
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    He was the 6th best passer based on passer rating with a 100.5 in 2017.
     
  11. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    Maybe so but that's not what @edray10 used in setting the stage for the discussion:

    "...if Zack’s QB play puts him in the top half of QBs, this team will be very competitive and has a shot at the playoffs."

    He didn't talk about a passer rating, completion percentage, TD:INT ratio, points scored or anything specific.

    Since he hasn't clarified anything since then, I think it's a stretch to cherry pick any particular stats to use and even using the QBR is pretty meaningless. We all know Wilson has to get much better to be what will win games consistently.
     
  12. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2010
    Messages:
    5,452
    Likes Received:
    5,822
    Passer rating takes into account completion percentage, touchdowns and interceptions. What more do you want?
     
  13. KingRoach

    KingRoach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
    Messages:
    2,998
    Likes Received:
    2,386
    Yes Goff.

    By some random metric?
    No, by every metric

    He was bottom half of the league in QBR and Comp %!
    Correct, he was 17th in both but was 34+ the prior year so he still jumped 16 spots.

    PS. I replied to this within an hour. I’m not sure where you get “taking a week” thing from.

    PPS. Oh yeah, you don’t actually read, that’s probably why you miss it.
     
  14. KingRoach

    KingRoach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
    Messages:
    2,998
    Likes Received:
    2,386
    Goff was top 10 in like 6 out of 8 stats. The 2 he wasn’t top 10, he was 17th aka not the top half.

    Talk about cherry picking stats jfc.

    The bigger picture with Goff is you have a QB who took a season to learn the system, THIS SYSTEM, and came back looking good year 2.

    2 mediocre QBs have taken this system the the SB in the last 5 years….the bar is so low I can’t believe some think he can’t clear it.
     
    #74 KingRoach, Jun 23, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2022
  15. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    I don't want any of it but there's a reason the QBR rating has been around for over ten years; there's more to being the quarterback than just throwing passes..

    ESPN’s Total Quarterback Rating (Total QBR), which was released in 2011, has never claimed to be perfect, but unlike other measures of quarterback performance, it incorporates all of a quarterback’s contributions to winning, including how he impacts the game on passes, rushes, turnovers and penalties. Also, since QBR is built from the play level, it accounts for a team’s level of success or failure on every play to provide the proper context and then allocates credit to the quarterback and his teammate to produce a clearer measure of quarterback efficiency.​
     
  16. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    He was supposed to jump into the top half according to the guy who made the claim about Wilson, which is what this part of discussion is about. The question about who has done such a thing was asked on June 15th. I guess you didn't read it.
     
  17. KingRoach

    KingRoach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
    Messages:
    2,998
    Likes Received:
    2,386
    Nah, I didn’t read his post. I read your post.

    I was replying to you.

    You wanted to know if someone had ever done something, I let you know that someone has.

    You’re welcome
     
  18. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    11,531
    Likes Received:
    6,878
    I also wanted to know what standards should be used to make the judgement.

    So, by the standards you have set "Jerrod" Goff has gone from the bottom of the league to the top half. Fine. Swell. Terrific.

    Now, to get back to the original question, is it reasonable to believe Zach Wilson can go from the bottom of the league to the top half of all quarterbacks? We are talking about the Jets here after all.
     
  19. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2008
    Messages:
    19,705
    Likes Received:
    13,343
  20. KingRoach

    KingRoach Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2013
    Messages:
    2,998
    Likes Received:
    2,386
    Not by the standard I set….. by every standard, Goff jumped 16 spots.

    Now, to the next question, I’ll start with the closing sentence “we are the jets after all”. I get it. I haven’t been a Jets fan for nearly as long as many other members and I’ve had the benefit of being a fan of teams who’ve found success over the years. I totally get the apprehension of being optimistic given the history of the franchise.

    In the past, the Jets have made moves, and many would try and justify those moves. We wouldn’t agree with the moves, didn’t understand the moves, but if it all goes right, we could see how it might possibly work out.

    The reason “it is the Jets after all” no longer applies, imo, is bc all the Jets moves -to me- make sense. Every move.

    Removing the stigma, we can get to the heart of the question. I believe, yes, it is 100% reasonable to believe Zach can go to the top half of the league.

    This Offense is said to be very complicated to learn but very QB friendly once acquainted. Goff is a mediocre QB and he ended his 2nd season in the top half of *almost every QB stat.

    Career backups who, despite one’s personal feelings, have spent the last several years learning wtf it takes to be a NFL QB came in and looked damn good, one ending up in the NFL HOF. The f’ing HOF.

    I had mocked all 7 of this years picks at one time or another, I like all the picks this year just as I did last years. The scouting Dept has commented how good the communication is btw them and the CS. I believe the last 2 drafts, the combination has shown an eye for talent. I have 0 reason to suspect the combination managed to draft: 2 great RBs, 2 great, WRs, 1 great OG, several good DBs in late rounds, and somehow managed to whiff completely on QB.

    Based on the president Goff set, if Wilson is serviceable, there’s a chance he’ll end up in the top half of the league in passing stats.

    Based on the my belief in the CS and Scouting team, I think there’s a very good chance Zach is better than serviceable and we will see it this year.
     

Share This Page