Harris is a bust. He did not start from Day one so is total crap. Just one more reason the Jets have not won in the past 40 years, (there I hope thats better) :rofl:
Harris, a second round pick, sat behind Vilma, Gholston a top 10 pick is sitting behind BT who was bad and by his own admission dogged it last year. It appears as if Harris should have started from day 1 but Vilma's rep prevented that. BT rep is his a dog with speed who plays slow. I'm not saying Gholston should be rushed if he isn't ready but the idea that BT is a good linebacker and we don't have need at outside linebacker is beyond me.
Thomas is a good OLB when he's playing well and a pylon when he's playing poorly. Things will depend on both how well Thomas plays and how quickly Gholston comes along. If Thomas is playing to 2006 form then the Jets have a good deal of leway on how much time they give Vernon. If he is the total piece of crap he was last year we could see Vernon and Bowens splitting alot of time in his spot this year.
I know you were joking. Seeing Gohlston yesterday reminded me of harris at this point last year. A little tentative, still learning the ropes, figuring out his assignments, but then he came on like gangbusters.
Well if Gholston can have anyting near the type of second half that Harris had last year I'll be doing cartwheels in front of the TV every sunday! I think in a few years everyone will be very, very happy with the pick.
Thomas had one pretty good year when he was vying for a contract. He was terrible last year after getting a contract. He was not great in 06, he was surprisingly good for a guy who was basically a bust before and after his contract year. Thomas is a guy you want as depth, not your starter. To at all compare Gholston as a No. 6 pick behind Thomas to Harris a second round pick behind Vilma is not really a fair comparison. I'm not saying Gholston should be rushed, but he was absolutely a pick of dire need for this team at a position that has been at best weak to bad.
i dont want to go back but i do seem to remember many having him be the second coming of christ and the guy who would push us over the top type stuff a couple months ago. there were quite a few who caught up in the fantasy of the draft projected him to be a day 1 starter. so i will have to agree with the poster who said its good to see many people on the board come back down to earth. gholston can and probably will be a very good player in time.
Rookie behind vet. Rookie behind vet. Not too unfair. Actually could take it a step further... High draft pick behind underperforming vet....high draft pick behind underperforming vet. The *huge* difference in this is that Thomas has had success in Mangini's 3-4...is healthy...and knows he has to work to stay with this team... So yea...get off the guys back...like we haven't even played one preseason game yet and you sound mad lol.
I'm not mad at all and I'm not at all in favor of rushing Gholston. BT has been an outright bust for this team and that's why we want after the best outside linebacker in FA in the offseason and used our 6 for another outside linebacker. Harris was drafted to play next to Vilma not to replace him. It just worked out that Vilma got hurt and had more value as a 4/3 player than in the 3/4 the Jets are committed to. BT is the depth player, Vilma was never looked at as a backup when Harris was drafted.
Obviously it would be STUPID to start Ghoulston before he understands his new position. The guy is working hard on and off the field to get ready, that's all we can ask. Any debate that he should start even over BT before he understands OLB, is stupid. I don't care that he was a top 10 pick, its irrelevant. He'll play pass rushing downs until he learns pass coverage as an OLB.
This is where we disagree...BT had success in this system...Vilma, even before his injury, hadn't shown an ounce of improvement in this system. He was light as it was, but he also lacked the physical strength and toughness this D asks for. I don't think Vilma was looked as a backup, but when Harris was drafted it was clear Vilma either had to put up or shut up...just like Thomas. The real difference here is that Vilma got us a decently high pick, while Thomas will probably just be cut if he sucks balls. I also disagree that BT has been an outright bust. He's been a little better than the Matt Jones' of the world.
We didn't have a nose tackle until this season. Vilma is light but he was taking on blockers and getting chiped up by the lack of a true nose tackle. I don't like Vilma in the 3/4 because he has less value in the system but he certainly would have been held onto if he was healthy and we had a nose tackle. Bust is strong but based on his performance last year after he got paid, he deserved to have his lazy ass fired.
Harris had no problem doing it. Maybe Vilma would have done something had he been healthy with a NT, but why would we wait around to find out? Like that'd be counting on alot of things working out to make one guy better....and even then Vilma is still just not a good fit in the 3-4. And it'd just be another reason for fans to complain.
If you believe that than you have to think Tanny blew it but not unloading Vilma when he had max value before last year. I agree with you Vilma was never a good fit but apparently Mangini and Tanny decided to hang onto him rather than get the value which goes against your theory.
It's not exactly an easy situation...Vilma had alot going for him here...fan favorite...probably the best first round pick we've made since that '01 haul...very good player for us...young as hell...extremely smart...leader on the D... The situation was delicate, and theres a good chance we walk away with a second round pick. So...I think they did a fine job with Vilma. There doesn't even seem to be any animosity btw Vilma and this FO.
So your saying they gave up picks for Harris and wanted to make sure he was good before unloading Vilma. They may well have gotten a late 1st for Vilma after the draft last year before Vilma was hurt. Hard to say what we got for Vilma after the fact but he clearly had excellent value to a 4/3 team last off season. I think they had every intention of putting Harris next to Vilma and unloading Barton at some point.