Full 2021 Mock Offseason

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by MaximusD163, Nov 11, 2020.

  1. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    With all due respect, the bolded is where you go off the rails a bit. Prior to 2020, how many straight years have the Jets used their #1 pick and most of their other early picks on defense? When you draft a rookie QB, you have to build around him unless you already have a very good offensive unit. The Jets aren't anywhere near a very good offensive unit. They have 3 pieces in Becton, Mims and Crowder. If Herndon can rebound and Clark develops, they'll have 5, and with Lawrence or Fields, they'll potentially have 6, but that still doesn't get them there. Rookie CBs, LBs, and Edges come into the NFL every year and make an immediate impact. They don't need 2 years to develop or gel with their defensive mates like offensive players often do. They don't have to develop timing with their QB or OL mates or have as much complex timing and information to learn as their offensive counterparts. Defense can wait until 2022.

    Balanced drafts should be the norm when you have a good team with fairly balanced units and at least a solid offense around your FQB. Until then in today's NFL, most of the love and attention should go to the offense. If you have an offense that can put up a lot of points, you can outscore opponents, or at least be entertaining and competitive and you can develop your rookie QB. Balance may help the overall team, but it can hurt the development of the rookie QB. After the Jets have failed to build around Sanchez, Smith, and Darnold, every Jets fan should know what a mistake that was and that it has to be the priority going forward. The defense be damned, the Jets have to ensure that whomever their starting QB is in 2021 has a great chance to succeed and that they have done everything possible to help him succeed. Drafting defense won't do that.
     
    #61 NCJetsfan, Nov 13, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2020
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  2. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    So, if it's "balance:" we're after, taking into account the massive out of balance that has existed on the "D" side of things for over a decade, I'd say by about 2029 we can start thinking about giving the defense a little love again. Just kidding...a little. The fact is that we've made a huge mistake in focusing on defense while the league was changing things to favor offense. Whether you think Darnold was never going to be any good or not, he sure wasn't given any chance to succeed by the lack of talent he was surrounded with. The same thing that happened to Sanchez, Smith, and every other QB in the past decade and a half. I vote for erring on the side of the offense for a while. The only exception to that would be to finally get a true All Pro pass rusher. Other than that, we need to build up the offense.
     
  3. In 99% of situations,you are 100% right. Their has to be a balanced positional approach in player procurement for both sides of the ball.

    But this offensive personnel is so bad it’s non functional. The defense is almost fundamentally set up to fail every week. We really have no idea what this defense even is bc how often are they playing w a lead where they can pin their ears back? How much rest are they getting in the 2nd half of games? Upgrading defensive positions doesnt change that right now.

    Certainly would take a look at both edge & corner to help get off the field on 3rd down but aside from that, it’s long overdue to send a wave of cohesive talent into the offensive ranks.Understanding full well 2022 will potentially be much more defense oriented w 2 1st rounders in hand.

    The situation is so bad right now,to get to the logical balanced approach your suggesting,this offense has to give itself a fighting chance in a scoring league
     
  4. GasedAndConfused

    GasedAndConfused Well-Known Member

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    whats your thoughts on bringing perriman back on a cheap deal (1 year 5 mil) and still adding robinson/juju/galladay? add mims, crowder, 2 rookies, and maybe berrios we'd have a pretty deep WR group and we wouldn't be depending on the rookies and w/o much at TE we can run more 4 WR sets (juju and crowder in the slot perriman and mims outside) stretch the defense and use zone runs for the run game and grab another small shifty back to go with perine and ty.
     
  5. GasedAndConfused

    GasedAndConfused Well-Known Member

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    yah assuming we pick 1 it should be tlaw then with the next 4 picks only 1 defense (CB or edge depending on the board) and the other 3 should be WR, O-line and then either another WR or TE or RB
     
  6. MaximusD163

    MaximusD163 Well-Known Member

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    Many of the best franchises in recent years have had consistently great defenses.
    Who have been the perennial playoff teams this past decade (2010-2020), and how many 1st round picks have they invested defensively?
    -NE (5)
    -PIT (8)
    -BAL (5)
    -NO (7)

    Also, you posted recently about Ashtyn Davis, and how fans think he’s been bad but that’s only because they have lost perspective after years of bad draft picks. I would say the exact same situation applies to having any of those failed Jets defensive picks having anything to do with how you build the team going forward. You need to evenly distribute your draft picks on offense or defense, and bad draft decisions from previous year regarding players who are not even on the roster should have nothing to do with that. Right now the D is really no better off than the O and passing on D is cutting off the nose to spite the face.
     
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  7. MaximusD163

    MaximusD163 Well-Known Member

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    Well theoretically I’d be fine with bringing Perriman back but I do think it’s unlikely he accepts that contract. He took it this year, I’m not sure he would again. I still don’t think it makes sense to add The other three you listed, in this case, you don’t really have 4 WR sets so who would you bench? Plus as I said before you’re adding Golladay/Smith-Schuster/Robinson to play the same role as Mims who looks highly promising at this point, so in my personal opinion the Jets need a stopgap Z, a future Z, and depth. They don’t need a highly paid starter who plays the same position as Mims.
     
  8. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    If we focus on the offense in the 2021 draft, it doesn't mean that we can't have a great D. Those best franchises also have great GMs, great HCs and great QBs that they've built around. The number 1 priority for the offseason is getting our new QB and building around him. Nothing. else. should. matter. If we fail to build around him and give him every chance to succeed, we risk failing yet another QB, him failing us, and having another decade of misery. After we have an NFL-caliber offense then we can worry about balance. We have close to an NFL caliber defense, not great but at least decent. Our offense isn't even Power 5 conference level and is a disgrace.
     
  9. MaximusD163

    MaximusD163 Well-Known Member

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    Agree to disagree on that one I guess
     
  10. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    If this article is accurate - and IDK that it is since they're presenting it as their prediction, not based on any inside info - this would cause me to tune out the Jets.

    https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-...ffseason-plan-d-is-for-defense-and-demolition

    I get that the defense needs help, but how is it in worse shape than the offense? Not to mention that it's been the focus for this team for decades, and what has that produced? IT'S AN OFFENSE-ORIENTED LEAGUE! What aspect of that concept escapes them? I truly hope this is just another out of touch ESPN article, based on nothing more than groundless speculation.
     
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  11. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    If this is true, then Douglas is certifiably insane, and should be committed to an insane asylum, not just fired. If true, Douglas doesn't deserve one ounce of the credit he gets around the NFL. I have a hard time believing that either of the two sentences are true or accurate with what I've read about Douglas, with the moves he has made so far, or the experience he had under Ozzie. I think this is either a rumor the Jets have put it out there to hide their true offseason plans, or Cimini drank some real Absinthe or has done some kind of psychotropic drugs that have fried his brain. If it is true, however, then walking away from this franchise, and perhaps the NFL for good, will be easy.
     
    #71 NCJetsfan, Nov 15, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2020
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  12. MaximusD163

    MaximusD163 Well-Known Member

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    First of all, I cannot say this article is accurate, I have no idea.

    However if it is, I do not think it’s so unreasonable. The Jets defense is terrible, truly bad, particularly at the most important positions. Pass Rusher and Cover Cornerback have absolutely nothing at the starter level.

    The Jets invested in offense this offseason, more so than defense. Their 4 most expensive FA, Offense. Top 2 Draft picks, offense. They also traded away the best defensive player.

    Most expensive Free Agents-
    1. George Fant
    2. Connor McGovern
    3. Breshad Perriman
    4. Alex Lewis
    8. Greg Van Roten

    Top Draft Picks
    1. Mekhi Becton
    2. Denzel Mims
    5. La’Mical Perine
    6. James Morgan
    7. Cameron Clark

    Defensive Free Agents were all signed to 1 year deals, while most offensive FA were signed to multi-year deals. The Jets moves point to a defensive revamp this year, with a likely exception of drafting a top QB.

    Even with a defensive focus, they will not ignore the offense.
     
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  13. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Without top tier weapons and a better OL, that upgraded defense will fare not better than the one they have now because they're going to be on the field 70-80% of the game.

    Of the "top draft picks' on offense, only 2 of the 7 have been proven as reliable starters. Of the 8 FAs, really only Perriman can be said to be a keeper and that's iffy. They have LOADS of more work to do on the "O". Yes, they need a stud pass rusher and improved CBs. but the defense is way ahead of the offense, even as constructed right now.

    I will not waste any more time on this team if they continue to favor the defense over the offense as they have for decades.
     
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  14. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    We can agree to disagree, but that's a bit of a cop out. I'm not looking to argue, but am curious about your reasoning. You're a smart, knowledgeable guy, and I have a ton of respect for you and your opinion, so I want to understand how/why you disagree.

    Do you dispute that the NFL is an offensive league and that the rules favor the offense? Do you dispute the fact that a lousy offense that consistently goes 3 and out and scores few points undermines even the best defenses, as those defenses have to spend too much time on the field and get tired?

    You didn't even respond to any of my points. Why does it mean that the Jets can't have a great D within a couple of years if they focus primarily on offense this year? Do you dispute the idea that rookie defensive players at CB, Edge and LB come into the league every year and make an impact?

    How is the statement that those great teams with great defenses also had great GMs, HCs, and QBs dismissable? If I'm wrong, please point out which teams have won almost exclusively with defense.

    How can you possibly disagree that the Jets failed to build around Sanchez, Smith, and Darnold? How can you possibly disagree that building around a FQB prospect and doing everything the team can to ensure that he succeeds is the wisest thing to do? How can you possibly disagree that QB is the most important position on the team, and when QBs fail, it kills a team's chances for years after they've invested high draft capital? Also, how is our offense as good or better than our D at present?

    I'm not trying to be a smartass. If I'm missing something, I want to see where I'm wrong. As I've said, most of the time, a balanced draft should be the norm. This is just a unique, dire circumstance where the Jets have either drafted in an unbalanced fashion using most of their high picks on defensive players or most of the higher draft picks used on offense missed and the players are no longer on the team or in the NFL. Even Darnold, whom they traded away a lot of draft capital to get looks like a failure.

    What else do we have to discuss right now?
     
    #74 NCJetsfan, Nov 15, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2020
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  15. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

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    This has got to be looked at realistically - no matter who the coach or quarterback is the Jets are going nowhere next year; there are simply too many holes to be filled. A balanced approach to improving the team is what's needed. Failure has been the word around here for decades and for most of the time the focus has been on one side of the ball. How's that working out?
     
  16. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    It is being looked at realistically. The reality is that the NFL is an offensive league, and the Jets don't even begin to have an NFL caliber offense. Their defense, while not great, is at least of an NFL caliber and with a stud Edge and #1 CB, it will be a lot better. The offense needs 3-4 more OL, QB, a new starting RB, a new starting TE, and a couple more quality WRs. In addition, it can take an offense a couple of years to gel. That's why it's so important that they add most of the pieces they need on offense in 2021. Adding them in 2021 should have their offense ready to compete at a high level by 2023, if not by 2022. On defense, it's less about working as a unit and timing, as it is each player upholding his own individual responsibilities, thus it's easier for rookies to come in and play at a high level earlier than it is on offense.

    Normally, a balanced draft is the right thing to do, but not in this coming draft. Focusing on the offense primarily will help even the scales, and will allow them to go with balanced drafts going forward. The Jets have 9 picks in this draft. IMO at least 5, maybe 6 of them (including their first 4 picks) should be used on offense, with the rest on defense and STs.

    In addition, every draft doesn't have to be balanced. It's only important that over a period of 3-5 years that it is balanced, so one draft could favor offense, another defense, and the other(s) be balanced, and the overall result should be balanced.

    Even if most of the draft picks in 2021 are used on offense, the offense won't be totally fixed, and neither will the D. In FA, hopefully Douglas will sign an OG, CB, and WR. They have 9 draft picks in 2021 ( 2-1sts, 2nd, 2-3rds, 4th, 2-5ths, and a 6th). If the Jets can pick up their QB of the future, a WR, a starting TE, a starting RB, and an OG, that will be a good start. They can use the rest of their picks on D/STs, maybe ILB, CB and SS.

    Then in 2022 they can focus on depth and maybe one starter in FA, and they'll have 9 picks (2-1sts, 2nd, 3rd, 2- 5ths and 3-6ths). With their two 1st round picks, they can take their Edge and #1 CBs, then add a RT in the 2nd, another CB/ILB or WR in the 3rd round, and add whatever other defensive pieces they need on the team in the 5th and 6th rounds. Maybe they trade one of their 5ths and one of their 6ths for a 4th round pick.

    That will be pretty balanced and will address their major needs.
     
    #76 NCJetsfan, Nov 16, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2020
  17. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    "Balance", right? Let's say I flip a coin 20 times, and every time I flip heads I give you $100.00, and every time I flip tails you give me a $100.00. Now I flip tails 18 times in a row, and then I flip heads twice. How's your bank account balancing out?

    That is the reality of the Jets situation. They've focused on defense for almost two decades with their highest draft picks, meanwhile the NFL was turning into an offense-oriented league. That's like running the Indy 500 with your parking brake on. If they follow your plan, equally drafting "D" and "O" for the nest couple of years, it'll take them 3 or 4 more years to even get respectable. That's not acceptable to most of their success-starved fans. Yes, Douglas signed a 6 year deal, but even he knows that didn't mean he had 6 years to produce a winning record. He has to start showing some real, substantial progress next year or he needs to go because he obviously doesn't understand the situation here. The house is on fire, it's no time to be worrying about conserving water.
     
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  18. 88toon

    88toon Well-Known Member

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    Couldn't have said it better.
     
  19. jcass10

    jcass10 Well-Known Member

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    By all accounts the Jets will be in position to draft one of the best QB prospects of all time. I believe Douglas would be doing a disservice if he didnt put Trevor Lawrence in the absolute best position as soon as possible. If that means not drafting defense until round 3 this year, so be it.

    The Jets will have a lot of flexibility this year. In addition to the picks they currently have, they'll probably be receiving at worst a 3rd rounder for Darnold (Rappaport said a 2nd and a 5th). I also think we'll see a trade back with one of their second two picks, but I obviously wont assume that.

    If I'm the Jets, I take OL and WR with 1b and 2. Pair up Becton with a blue chip Guard (or C) and the left side of your line could be set up for years. Assuming they bring in a strong WR in FA, FA/1st Rounder/Mims/Crowder could be the best overall group we've seen in a fairly long time.

    If thats how round one shook out, I'd be totally fine on draft night if the Jets invested three 3rd rounders on the defensive side of the ball. Thats not even taking into account potential tradebacks. I absolutely think either 1b or 2 are going to be traded back to pick up additional 3rd or 4th rounders. Team needs talent everywhere, and Douglas wants to put his stamp on the roster.
     
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  20. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    I "liked" your post assuming that you left unsaid that pick 1A would be Lawrence/Fields.
     

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