what goes in in a locker room could never go on in a "normal" office. if they investigated every locker room they'd find violations in every one of them. The situations are nothing alike. Maybe that this has come out they will treat it the same but nothing will change in locker rooms today b/c of this.
I'm not arguing any of that. I'm simply saying that the idea that "you can't compare" the two is wrong. You not only can, but are required to. I suspect that the very notion you put forth - that you can't compare a football locker room to a "normal" office - is going to be what seals the deal in lawsuits and/or disciplinary actions in this, and any other cases like it going forward. It basically is an admission of guilt in cases like these.
If something comes of this legally they can go after players on every team. A locker room is nothing like an office. Can you or I disrobe in front of our co-workers?
Transcripts of voice mail messages and text messages left for the Miami Dolphins' Jonathan Martin by teammate Richie Incognito indicate a pattern of racial epithets and profane language. Multiple sources confirmed to ESPN that the following is a transcript of a voice message Incognito left for Martin in April 2013, a year after Martin was drafted: "Hey, wassup, you half n----- piece of s---. I saw you on Twitter, you been training 10 weeks. [I want to] s--- in your f---ing mouth. [I'm going to] slap your f---ing mouth. [I'm going to] slap your real mother across the face [laughter]. F--- you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you." Sources tell ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter that officials from both the NFL and the Dolphins have heard the tape and have copies of the message. Sources familiar with the tapes say these are terms Incognito used over time and were not isolated incidents, including the use of the racial epithet multiple times. Sources also say Martin received a series of texts that include derogatory terms referring to the female anatomy and sexual orientation. Incognito was suspended indefinitely by the Dolphins on Sunday night for conduct detrimental to the team.
Who is they? No one can take action until a formal complaint is filed, which is what happened in this case. I think the other issue that is being ignored is that since the topic of bullying is in the forefront of popular culture, the outcome of this event will be a lot worse "to set an example".
That's a silly comparison. We both get dressed for work before we get there and our employment doesn't require us to change our attire in the middle of the day. A locker room is everything like an office. It's an office for football players. Preparation for football activity goes on in it, which is why it's not acceptable for either of us to do things specific to their employment at our jobs.
that's not silly at all, it's part of their jobs. part of their jobs is also to be very mean and physical, what office is that part of the job description? There is no comparison btw an average office and an NFL locker room.
Your argument essentially boils down to "playing football is a different job than selling insurance". I don't think anyone disagrees with you. In the context of this situation involving Incognito and Martin, there is no difference between a corporate office and an NFL locker room. Being threatening, harassing, or racist to co-workers - as Incognito has alleged to have been here - is not allowed. It doesn't matter how physical or aggressive they are supposed to be when on the field of competition.
in an office people are at their desks or in their personal offices, a locker room is an area the players hang out in before going on the field or in meeting rooms. They shower, change, goof off, etc... There's nothing similar to anything that goes on in a typical office environment. The NFL can say all the right things but stuff like this happens in every LR and they don't stop it. They only "care" now b/c it went public. Most fans have no idea what goes on in a typical LR and if it became public there would be issues far worse than this. AGAIN, I am not condoning Incognito. It seems he went too far but that is the culture of the NFL LR. I guarantee you hundreds of players are saying "phew, I am glad they got him before they got me".
I look back now on the Jets in 2011, with the locker room issues. Our issues were NOTHING compared to the Dolphins.
That the employees perform different tasks in their respective employment settings is completely irrelevant to this issue. In the context of this conversation the two "offices" are governed by the same laws. There is no more leeway given to one over the other because the employees "shower, change, good off, etc." That distinction is wholly meaningless in this conversation. The fact that it got away from the leadership as much as it has is a problem with the league and the management of each team, not a means of establishing an acceptable baseline of "what a locker room is". I agree with this completely, though I don't see anyone disagreeing with these points. Also, prevalence of/ignorance to the problem doesn't change anything with regards to the specifics of the Martin/Incognito situation.
it's not irrelevant, the culture is completely different and it leads to things that happened in Miami.
Sure, but that's an indictment of the league and the organizations, not something that should be used as mitigating factor in this situation. Just because stupidity, ignorance, and lawlessness have been relatively unchecked in the NFL workplace does not have any bearing on the degree of potential culpability of the employees involved in this case.
It is a violent game played by violent players, it takes a very different mentality to do what these guys do. we can say they are behind the times but they are in current times for their profession.
Yeah, this is where we definitely disagree. For me, there is nothing about the allegations against Incognito that can be reasoned in any way by the parties involved being football players. I couldn't agree more about the violence in the game, and a unique mentality required to play it.
No personality, obviously no control over his locker room. This is really embarrassing for the Dolphins.
The Jets better not have their annual stinker against the fish this year. I will be more than pissed.
