Hey great point about Wilson and 15. That could end up being a tough call for the Jets. Drafting a Cb with a high pick this year definitely gives them some more flexibility and even leverage dealing with Wilson's situation. I assume you refer to Patterson bein doubtful next year due to injury. I see that, but also just dont think he's that good a player.
I'm not pushing for just Lee, we need more play-makers. That could be Cooks, or Ebron. Could be a Free Safety in Ha-Ha Dix. The idea that we can fix our skill position issue for the mid-term sounds much better then drafting a freaking CB again in the 1st round. Show me proof of this. Don't make shit up to make yourself "look good". When Milliner gave up the TD to Wallace he was in man coverage. He got 1 interception in man and 1 in zone. It's obvious he played better in zone then in man the last 4 games. We had inexperienced players at CB / SS - that doesn't mean you go out and draft one in the first round again - dumb idea. We didn't pressure well enough, what is up with people and just being happy to apply pressure? We need more turnovers, more sacks, more QB hits. I want that defense to be just as intimidating as Seattles. We have CBs that can cover, no reason for our CBs to be covering more then 4 seconds at most. When has a team ever won a SB by putting most of their resources into the CB position? When?
1. Yes the Jets should play zone, they should look to send 4 or 5 and put the rest in coverage, that is what SB teams have done in the past. As far as I am concerned the 2 CB shutdown system has not worked. It is time for a change. Again, we need to generate more TOs. 2. They are both deep. The receivers in the first round are far better then the CBs in the first round. If you look at the 4th and 5th rounds - there are CBs available that can come in and produce. 3. Again, read the shit I have posted - don't be close-minded look at the results, why did Milliner play well? he played well because we ran more fucking zone. I keep repeating myself but you don't seem to listen. DD is not the BPA at 18.
i think Patterson is on a one year deal, but could be wrong. and there is the injury factor. Patterson does have some upside this season if he can stay healthy. I just don't want to bank on that. Drafting a CB helps give us some insurance there (even if not in the 1st round), and gives us more flexibility for future considering we could lose a couple CB's after this season.
Totally agree the insurance factor is another reason to go Cb high in the draft. I hate that the Jets are in this situation due to Idzik's mismanagement, but it is what it is.
I agree we also need playmakers. Your argument however, is that we don't need to draft a CB at all. According to you we have guys who can cover just fine, and we should continue just using them. We just need to abandon what has worked best for Ryan, and try a new formation. we already tried that last year, and our guys proved they couldn't cover in any formation. We played man and zone for most of the year, not just the last 4 games as you claim. The more we had to try to mask their deficiencies, the less aggressive we were able to get up front, affecting our ability to pressure the QB. In terms of Miami, i have the entire game on my DVR and will watch it again to cite you some examples. The passes Milliner was breaking up had no safety or zone help, and neither did his pick. You can look right at highlights on youtube in the meantime to see yourself. He didn't get better because of zone. We played a lot of zone most of the year. He got better on technique and awareness, which improved his execution. Sometimes it takes a rookie a little time. one other thing, if we don't draft a CB as you are suggesting, what happens next year if we lose Patterson and Wilson? It doesn't have to be round 1, but we absolutely need to shore up the CB position for both the present and future. to suggest otherwise is the 'dumb idea' No we don't have CBs that can cover. they proved that most of the year. Milliner fortunately got better on the tail end of season (and not due to zones) so hopefully he can build off that, but who knows. If you want more turnovers , QB hits, and sacks, better CB play is a great way to go about it. we weren't even sending 5 most of the time, as we needed to mask our deficiencies in the secondary. playing vanilla defenses just allows our best guys up front to get double teamed. Granted we have a few good ones, and they can't double team them all. but i would like to see them all single blocked as much as possible, with an occasional free rush at the passer. Seattle's strength was in the secondary, so i don't understand that argument at all. one of the best CB's, SS's, and FS's in the league, and plenty of CB depth. Losing Thurmond and Browner, i expect they draft CB again this year. I'd argue the secondary, and often playing with a lead, is what made their Dline look so good.
Milliner will build on what he did last season, we have like 6 CBs on the roster, Walls will need to step up just as Antonio Allen did for us at SS. Rex can coach those guys up, no need for a CB at 18. Seattle's primary strength on defense is their 2 safeties. They set the tone in the SB. I think Sherman comes 3rd in regards to that. Watch Earl Thomas and Kam dominate, it's fun to see. Their defensive line also has an excellent pass-rush and they have linebackers that can move. Sounds like something the Jets should be looking to do instead of wasting time looking for a corner at 18. And I said, Milliner played better when we went to a more zone defense, which could be better for the Jets down the road. In 2010, they incorporated more zone and they won 11 games including 2 playoff games. The game against the Pats, Rex ran a zone heavy defense that clustered the middle of the field with defenders. In terms of the Miami game, I also have the game on DVR, watch when Milliner got beat for a TD and see what coverage he was in. He did grab an interception playing in both man and zone that game. Browns game he was far better in zone coverage against a better receiver in Josh Gordon. Maybe playing zone, eases the transition a little bit for CBs? Who knows
being competitive isn't the end goal, building a Super Bowl contending team and ultimately winning the Super Bowl is the end goal. The Jets can be competitive this season without Revis; they were last year and likely will be this year. But being competitive doesn't equate to achieving the end goal of building towards being a Super Bowl contender. And having Revis for one year certainly doesn't assist in building a Super Bowl contender if he simply has to be replaced the following year while simultaneously costing us additional cap space that would be used to replace him and add additional pieces that contribute to the process of building a Super Bowl team. having Revis for one season serves zero purpose in the goal of building a Super Bowl caliber team for the Jets, which undoubtedly is a multi-season task for the Jets, the way Revis does for the Patriots who can be a Super Bowl caliber team for that one season. The only dispute of this, as I mentioned, would be to argue that the Jets would be a Super Bowl contender next season with Revis; and that would certainly qualify as being a homer to make that statement. But if the Jets aren't going to be a legit contender for the Super Bowl this season with Revis, and he is gone the next season, he serves zero purpose in the building of a Super Bowl caliber team which will likely not occur for a year or two afterwards, while costing us valuable cap space that would be used in the pursuit of building that team. you want to argue that we should have signed Revis for 4 years then I'll abso-fucking-lutely agree. sign him up. but one year serves zero purpose in the prusit of a goal that will not come to fruition a year or two after he is gone while also costing us resources that would assist in achieving that goal. being competitive is only valuable in the sense that it is one step in the process of becoming a Super Bowl contender, and it is only important if that can be continued after that season and going forward. we could sign every player to one year contracts and be competitive, but if we don't win the Super Bowl and lose all of the players and have to rebuild what long-term purpose did simply being competitive achieve? nothing.
1. You can make a case about drafting a certain position - for any position. For instance, Jets during Al Groh era and Herm Edwards days didn't have the best secondaries in the NFL - but it didn't matter much. The reason was, Jets had John Abraham and Shaun Ellis filling both DE positions, and their presence covered up a lot of deficiencies in the back four. 2. So, in that light, you could make a case that, Jets should draft 2 edge rushers this year. If both edge rushers grow up to be what we believe they can be, then the deficiencies in the back four won't be magnified either. 3. To that tune, you could even argue that, since Jets D are much closer to being championship-calibre than the offense is, Jets should first invest in the defense this year; that way, Jets will be very competitive for the foreseeable future (1) and concentrate heavily on the offensive side for the next two to three years and fix everything up (2) 4. My two cents goes to: it all depends on who is available at the spot.
Calvin Pryor round 1 Bradley Roby round 2? Cut Landry, so our starting secondary would be Milliner, Roby, Allen, Pryor. Maybe 1. Calvin Pryor S 2. Bradley Roby CB 3. Donte Moncrief WR 4. CJ Fiedorowicz TE 4. ILB 4. OLB 5. Slot WR 6. Trade Fodder 6. OL 6. TE 6. P 7. Trade Fodder
The schedule announced just made it imperative that the Jets get secondary and pass rush help early. I'm thinking a bounty of either Clinton-Dix, Pryor, or Dennard round 1 Dee Ford, Attachou, or some other pass rusher round 2. Ford will prob be gone. I think we should target an offensive weapon in rounds 1-3 also. Disclaimer: this post is a panic post. I know Idzik will not make draft decisions based on the first 10 games on this year's schedule. That said ... I think it should be considered a tiny factor. This season will be over fast if we don't stop these high flying offenses early on. We are not a rookie away from hanging with these teams offensively. Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
how does the schedule release change anything? we already knew the teams we will be facing. knowing the order the games are in doesn't change anything really
Well it shouldn't change anything, but his point is just that we play teams that have a strong passing attack in weeks 2-6.
Your third point was exactly my original post. As far as the comparison to Herm Edwards days, I gotta disagree. Our current pass rush is not really worse than that one, Wilkerson is an elite player, as good as John Abraham, except more well rounded and so far, less injury prone. Shaun Ellis was never an elite pass rusher consistently, and so Wilkerson + Coples + Pace (+ hopefully Richardson who improves that aspect of his game this offseason) is every good as bit of a pass rush as what we had back then. The difference was our secondary was better, thought it wasn't great in those days, it wasn't as abysmally bad as what we had last season either.
I have long considered you an above average poster, but your jag here of focusing so much on Revis is tiresome. The issue is that the Jets have a hole in their roster at starting Cb. Revis could have been an answer, but I am not so focused on that as on the hole itself. There were other ways to fill it than signing Revis. Hole at CB - THAT is the issue. Get it? I am also historically dubious of the notion that teams can turn competiveness off and on from season to season. Sure there are ways to go all in on a season, signing a bunch of FA's to contracts that blow your cap in following years. But that doesn't mean you can improve the odds of successfully running a team by purposely tanking a season, except in extraordinary circumstances, like Indy's when they got Luck. Even that was forced on them and not a choice on their part, and they were coming off a string of successful seasons with Manning. That is the exception. Winning from season to season creates a culture of success and expectations that feed into more success. As a result I do not believe that putting the best effort into making the team successful this year is any enemy of possibly greater success down the road. So there's that. And speaking as a fan, sure the SB is the ultimate goal. But winning games is a goal, too. We are fans of a team that has not won the SB since 1969. Does that mean you and other fans have derived no pleasure whatsoever from following the Jets because of that string? I don't feel that way. There's a saying - don't let pursuit of the excellent be the enemy of the good. Think about it. The Jets possibly being competitive this year is not going to lessen their chances of a Super Bowl down the road. Sure there might be things done to lessen that chance. I don't think filling the hole at CB in a reasonable way is one of them.
VERY WELL SAID Blocker!!! And I doubly agree...it IS a culture. We may not be the 49'ers or Steelers but we aren't the Lions either. Outside the the 2011/12 seasons the Jets have been a pretty decent football team over the last decade/decade and a half. I'll take it over the 80's/90's!!! It starts in that building and continues year to year...and ends up on that field. Every year it's done in steps....as you said...you have to be good before you can be great. FANTASTIC post!
