I don't think this is a dead horse when you have a 50/50 split with no consensus. Forgive me for bringing a passionate topic to the table and interrupt the tantalizing conversation evoked when discussing Haynesworth, Bowens, Coleman, etc... I was at the Jets Titans game and the Packers game and those were arguably two of his best performances. His arm strength deteriorated down the stretch and when the Jets were put in situations where they had to do nothing but pass, our passing options are severely limited. I think Chad can be the answer only if we are very strong defensively and running the football. Despite my beliefs, in Mangini I trust.
i respectfully disagree on a couple things here...... first off i was going to refrain from any QB posts for a while but i admit i am too weak when discussing the jets QB history...... my mantra for some time has been unless the jets surround CP with a bigtime OL, stellar running game and top 10 defense (especially RUN defense) we will NOT be playing football in late Jan - early Feb. Now the glass may be half full when looking at our OL, RB depth and defense considering the changes at the moment. The problem is that CP is not getting any younger and i do NOT think he will be with the jets to enjoy the fruits of any of the above. i think there is better than a 50-50 chance Clemens is the QB in 08. UNLESS - the jets somehow accelerate the improvments around him and CP plays another full season of mistake free football - especially against the upper echelon teams in the league. jil
Honestly, theres no way to "prove" that Chads arm has cost us games, simply because arm strength is more likely to impact a game at ALL points, not the very last second. Honestly, I'm more bothered by his actual performance last year. Sure, if he's doing what he did in 2002/'04 comes back, then he's more than capable of taking any team to the big one. But he wasn't even CLOSE to that last year, and he made some stupid, stupid decisions at time. The fact that he doesn't even have the average arm strength he used to have now is a secondary worry to me.
It isn't a dead horse because consensus is widely split... it's a dead horse because the topic has been turned over more times than pancakes at an IHOP in a week. That being said, nothing has really changed since the last big Pennington debate. It is clear he will be the starter, Clemens isn't ready, and they aren't bringing in a veteran that can really motivate him. And this is the off-season... we are always in short supply of truly "tantalizing" conversation. Lot of dead horses being morbidly beat around here. :wink:
I saw this thread yesterday and didn?t respond to it thinking it would go no where. Chad is the starter! He can take us to the promise land and that?s for sure! Chad makes some real nice throws and some terrible one. The bad one is usually when he's under pressure or getting a nasty rush. Same as any Q.B. My friend has an old video of the "Classic nfl passers" In it they show Joe Montana ,who's passes and throwing motion look to me like Chad's and they throw the ball very much the same. The long balls have a little more zip then Chads but overall, the type of short to intermediate passes that Joe threw Chad throws. The fundamental difference here is they had an amazing o-line that kept Joe upright with tons of time to find a receiver. And a defense that came up big when they needed to or just out right manhandled opposing teams. That is what we are trying to build here!
Yes I most certainly am. In my opinion Chad can make all the throws that Joe did. They won Championship's with dink and dunk and short to intermediate passes. Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson are perfect example that Chad could also win a super bowl! They had a complete team that enabled their Q.B. to excel at what they did well. We are building a team that should enable Chad to "Take us to the big game" What you don’t like my Chad /Joe comparison
They had a terrible rush defense. One of the worst in the NFL in years let alone last season. As a result they allowed a lot more points - 360 - than you'd expect a Super Bowl caliber team let alone a Super Bowl winner to allow. In fact since 1990 only 2 Super Bowl winners have allowed 300+ points, the 1998 Broncos who gave up 309 and the Colts last season with 360. The reason the Colts won the Super Bowl anyway is that they won 9 games last season in which they allowed 20+ points, including the 38-34 AFC championship against the Patriots. They did this because Peyton Manning is a great QB. For comparison in Chad's entire career with the Jets they have only won 8 games total in which the opponent scored 20+ points. You score 20+ points against the Colts and Manning is going to win anyway a lot of the time. You score 20+ points against the Jets and you're going to beat them most of the time.
you have to admit br4 that the colts defense showed up when it had to, and not a moment too soon. jil
Yeah but you also have to admit that they stank like a dead fish for large parts of the season and Manning is why that did not sink the Colts chances. The Bears were just flatout beat at the QB position and they got nailed in the Super Bowl. You put a good QB on that team and the Colts probably can't win the game. Although the way Manning was playing they might have pulled it out anyway. The comeback against the Patriots was one of the most amazing feats in AFC history as the defense gave up scores to go behind 3 times late and the offense came back and bailed them out each time.
If that's the way you feel about it, then we'll have to say shitty QBs on non-special teams can reach Super Bowls.
Pennington was awful against Cleveland, but his final pass was pretty darn good. The play was incorrectly not ruled a touchdown. Everybody sucked in the Jaguars game, including Pennington. Pennington did not hold his own against the Bears. His interception to Urlacher was the result of a horrible read.
Chad will be fine ...and while I'm at it, I appologize for my Kerney prediction......mann..I was WAY off....I based my statement on a radio interview with Arthur Blank who said he would do "whatever it takes" to keep Patrick in Atlanta
The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. The only reason this is even a topic is because PEOPLE OVERVALUE THE QUARTERBACK POSITION. I'm going to spam the crap out of this thread with this post until it hits home. A football team is one giant system. Parts come together to make the whole. The QB is not the glue to those parts. The O-line affects so much more in the game.
You are selling Hostetler and Johnson short. I do know that Pennington would not have made that play in the end zone that Hostetler made in SB25.
I want a guy that can take us there and win, not just take us there... So far, and I love the guy as our QB... I'm not convinced. There are some throws that need to be made in the coarse of a season, that I just don't think he can make. I hope I'm wrong. Ellis
