Except he planned to commit suicide anyway, even intimating as much to those he shot in the classroom....and it wasn't a gun free zone....
http://www.vocativ.com/news/236421/the-complications-of-oregons-guns-on-campus-laws/ Why does it matter if he was planning on committing suicide? These guys want a soft target where they can get as many kills as possible. They're sick fucks. Harden the target.
It's funny..you talk about the "target" as if it's at some shooting range. These are actual human beings. Other countries are laughing at us because of our paranoid gun culture and you are a great example
Our schools are the target of these psychos. That's the sad truth, which I understand is something liberal pussies are frequently unable to come to grips with. I don't find it funny at all. We need a real solution instead of some happy horseshit political nonsense.
One more time.. If you can't eliminate the threats, harden the targets. Just a sign of the times in which we live.
"Liberal pussies" Haha always resorting to labeling when it comes to curbing gun violence. Don't take my guns don't take my guns I need to defend myself while I'm posting 1,000 times a year on a forum
Part of the process is keeping guns away from potential maniacs. It's not the whole process but it's part of the process. Identifying crazy people, keeping guns away from them and then protecting people on campus. Obviously at some if not most colleges there is not a good safety plan. At the Oregon college they had one or maybe two unarmed Security officers. This after recent debate on campus over this issue. And the decision via the student body and the school administration was no guns for Security. To me, in retrospect a mistake. They needed more security and they should have been armed. There are 3500 full time students at that school and 16,000 part time students. The campus is spread out over 100 acres. Here is one article from a progressive site Media Matters on the question of was the school a gun free zone http://mediamatters.org/blog/2015/10/08/report-conservative-medias-gun-free-zone-myth-i/206037. And on Texas college campuses there is a new law on campus carry that includes buildings. Here is an article about it. Many people on campus are against it including gun advocates. It's not such a democratic process in terms of the campus community having a say in it. But at least it excludes students under 21. http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/09/us/texas-campus-carry-law/. You can have all of the emotional tirades you want. Call names, point fingers but the whole idea is coming up with a solution and stopping this crazy shit. I see absolutely no willingness from stanch gun advocates like the NRA to work on a solution. And on this board forget about it. Just give me one good reason why you're against increased background checks. And saying it won't work isn't a good reason. It's just an excuse.
Here is a 2013 Wash. Post poll on expanding background checks. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-on-guns-why-isnt-this-a-political-slam-dunk/. Most people are for it including gun owners and NRA members. You know why. It's a no-brainer. It doesn't affect your ability to purchase guns. So what's the hubbub and where's the problem. And why so much opposition. Again it's not the solution but a part of the solution.
What does the number of posts I have have to do with anything? When you laugh at someone pointing out that our schools are targets and refer to them as paranoid for doing so it shows how completely ignorant you are. It's typical of liberal pussies to fail to acknowledge the cold hard facts of situations hence my comment. They prefer to imagine we live in some fantasy utopian society where evil does not exist and if it just happens to rear its ugly head a simple sign or law will stop them from commiting evil acts. Pandoras box is open and politicians talking about gun control that they know they probably aren't going to be able to pass does nothing. In fact every time these dipshits flap their gums about gun contol all it does is cause gun sales to spike through the roof. Again, cold hard facts. It seems all they're doing is pandering to an audience that doesn't get what is actually happening. Even if they are able to pass new gun contol measures it's a) unlikely they'd help as no one ever suggests a law that would actually have stopped the crime that initiated the discussion. b) not going to remove the millions of guns already owned in this country legally and illegally So if you live is fantasy utopian land where our schools are not targets and magical gun control stops evil people then I guess that discussion makes a ton of sense to you. If you live in the real world where the fact is our schools are soft targets the obvious grown up response is to harden the target. Unfortunately we will likely fail to address this with a big boy solution and our schools will remain the target of psychos until we do. and before someone goes all retard strawman on me, of course I don't want crazy people to have guns.
oh look ... pclfan talking about background checks at gun shows. shocker. did the shooter get his guns at a gun show without a background check? of course not but that doesn't stop you from blabbing about it as if it's some kind of miracle solution to all the worlds problems derp
what is an "increased background check"? what does that mean? you keep saying it but either you haven't explained it or I've overlooked it.
Universal background checks which include online sales and gun shows. Also not selling a gun to somebody without a complete background check due to a time constriction (like in Charleston). This is just part of the solution.
I think gun control is a partisan political issue but more from the right than from the left. To me the left is just reacting to a terrible national problem not trying to force their thinking on others. If things were ok and it was just a question of hunting and peaceful use of firearms then there would be no issue. If you're inclined to think that Big Brother is out to get you, then what can I tell you. I know that I for one don't care if people own guns. I just want guns to be treated as the serious entity they are: so people who own guns should be qualified, licensed, know how to use them and adopt safety measures to avoid senseless deaths like to kids who pick up loaded guns. And for that you need regulation. It's not just a one sided Constitutional question either: non gun users and the general population have Constitutional rights too. As for the right wing they are almost uniform in supporting the gun lobby and have blocked any kind of compromise to current federal policies. Obama was ripped by some of the people in Roseburg for politicizing the gun control issue after the killings. He even used the word politicize. He's not running for office in the future. Maybe he's like most of us very upset at these kinds of shootings and wants to do something about it. Not just continue with the status quo. I was kind of surprised at the immediate response of some of the people in Roseburg right after the shootings. They seemed to be more concerned about gun regulations than what had just happened. IMO some of the Conservative talking points like change the policies (which are mostly State and local) on who and where you can carry are also part of the solution. But having everyone on a college campus carrying guns, including inside dorms is crazy. Just like it's crazy having everybody on a military base carrying firearms. It can lead to serious problems when so many people in a sometimes confined area have loaded guns. We just saw a few days ago a student carrying a loaded firearm on a college campus shooting other students after a dispute. Drinking, immaturity and guns don't mix.
You cannot react to a situation with suggestions that would not have been applicable in the situation you're reacting to and expect to be taken seriously. That goes for you and the politicians that do the same. If you want to push for "universal background checks" or whatever, fine, but don't use a tragedy that those wouldn't have made a lick of difference on and expect people who aren't pushing the same agenda to applaud it. The argument is asinine. For example, if a 35 year old male killed someone while driving drunk would you react to that by pushing for laws to raise the driving age to 21? Of course not, that would be foolish. There are laws on the books that would have stopped Roof from buying a gun if the incompetent government official would have properly done the background check. You don't get to make people who need to protect themselves now have to wait longer because the existing laws weren't enforced correctly. That's also asinine. No one ever said they want everyone on college campuses carrying guns around. That's an asinine strawman. If you want to be taken seriously make serious arguments. Until then you're just pclfan being pclfan.
Your reply is exactly what I thought it would be. Anger, denial, name calling and predictable anti-gov rhetoric. How do you know something won't work until you've tried it. A lot of people smarter than I am think that it will work. At least in reducing some of the gun violence. Not just on college campuses but everywhere. There was an initiative a few years ago to improve reporting of mental health data in terms of disallowing purchases of guns and there's been some success. http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2014/05/guns-mental-health-background-checks. And this can be further improved. As a part of the background checks system. So things can work. As for people being inconvenienced a few days if there is a red flag in their purchase and saying it could put them in peril because they won't have a gun to defend themselves. This is a silly excuse. Most people already have a gun. And the majority would have no problem purchasing unless there are reasons for holding up the sale.
From the looks of it, you investing this much time in this argument tells me you're the last person who should own a gun.
As easy as it is to normally take shots at you for further pcl'ing a thread, read what you just wrote. Clearly the right is partisan on this issue. Don't be that guy that insists the left is just not as partisan. Seriously. _
So a lawful gun owner making rational arguments about this issue and honestly questioning how to fix it is the person you DON'T want owning guns? That's part of the problem right there. If you want to take guns away from a guy like Nato (who I don't know personally), then you deserve the entrenchment you are getting from the staunchest gun owner defenders. _
On this issue they are not as partisan as the right. There is tremendous political pressure on Repub politicians to be anti gun control and be against furthering gun control legislation. Even Donald Trump won't tangle with them. It's not even close. They won't even touch gun reform.
So the right owns the guns and are partisanly protecting those rights. You don't think the left is being just as partisan trying to attack those rights? I'm being serious for once. Don't be that guy. Your answer will reveal a lot about you. _
