it wouldn't have been pointless, it would have been dramatic. what you suggested is the George Lucas theory of exposition. the audience already knows Vader is Luke's father, so we'll reveal it in the prequels as well and eliminate the surprise completely from Empire Strike Back. you don't eliminate the exposition of the drama based on what the audience may know.
I agree it's pointless. How would you have suggested leaving mystery to the character? In Star Wars Episodes 4 through the reveal in 5, Vader gave no indication of being anything but evil. That's why it worked. Nobody had access to anything Lucas had for Episodes 1-3, so nobody suspected anything. The Governor would have had to appear "good" for a number of episodes, then, out of the blue, swerve everyone and reveal himself to be evil. If even one character, Michonne for example, gave a hint of suspicion towards him, it would have made viewers suspect him as evil, thus, killing the reveal. Once he revealed himself, chances are, unless it was brilliantly written, it would make one, or more characters, appear stupid. I've seen countless horror movies where you watch a whole movie, then BOOM, swerve. Why? Just because you didn't see it coming. Yet it's almost always poorly written and makes little sense. I think it's much better to see The Governor manipulate the main characters. We know he's evil, so it will be harder to watch characters we care about fall into his traps.
Wow. I saw the episode at my sister's the other night and was blown away. I was a little buzzed so I don't think I fully understand the scene with Lori. Why did she need a C section? Was the baby breached, or was she simply incapable of giving birth without it even though they never mentioned it before (that I can remember)? I didn't get the explanation. Also didn't that other lady specifically practice c sections on zombies to prepare for that moment? Seemed like a waste. Also I understand that mommy loves the child, but why sacrifice yourself to bring a baby into this kind of world that probably will not survive and only hold everyone else back? At least Lori would have been able to help the group. Very strange. 2 more characters bite the dust. Pretty surprising they killed off Tdogg. Also how did the scene with Lori end up in the comics?
***SPOILERS FOR ANYONE WHO DOESN'T WANT TO KNOW*** As I remember it she goes down in a hail of gunfire (won't say who from) and she's holding the baby at the time and kind of falls on the baby, not sure if the baby got shot too but it's obviously dead. But if someone read it more recently maybe they can confirm that or give a more accurate description.
except none of that is how stories actually work. one of the most basic elements of story telling is called foreshadowing. nothing just happens out of the blue, as you explain as the only possible alternative; you drop hints of what is to come and then deliver on it. well told stories do this seamlessly with audiences not being aware until the reveal, but then realizing that was where they were being led all along, and poorly told stories telegraph it and make it obvious. drama isn't about out of the blue surprises. that is actually an indication of poor story telling. obviously the show had a choice to make -- reveal him immediately and eliminate any dramatic surprise, or reveal his character more dramatically. just because some of the audience is aware of it doesn't eliminate the potential drama. but the show took the eliminate the drama approach. which is strange because the show has taken the approach of the audience learning as the characters learn, which isn't the case here. I suppose the drama the show is aiming for is simply wondering what the Governor will do with Andrea and Michonne, but I don't really find that interesting or dramatic. it would be the equivalent of us knowing that the barn was filled with Sophia and walkers from the very first time they made it to the farm and the audience simply waiting for the characters to find out for themselves. but that isn't interesting or dramatic. that is what they have done with the Governor. as far as Star Wars, George Lucas has stated that the series is meant to be watched numerically, which means the surprise of Darth Vader being Luke's father, which was clearly intended when watching it starting at 4, should still exist if you start at 1. the problem with that is that Lucas took the approach devil mentioned, since the audience already knows you can simply skip the drama of it. that is just bad storytelling, which is the major criticism of the prequels anyway.
^The last thing we need is for this show to turn into another LOST. Lost followed that exact mantra for EVERYTHING and thus went stale during season 3 and into 4. I can dig it every now and then, but it's also poor writing to make every single storyline a surprise. You don't need to foreshadow everything. You also have to realize there on only like 12 episodes a season, whereas most shows used to have 20-25 episodes per season and had much more time to develop story lines and plots. Lost was like that for seasons 1-3, then switched to 16 for 4-6. As a result the show had to rush more into shorter seasons and the writing and development took a hit. I wish Walking Dead had 24 episodes a season. I don't know if the industry has just gotten lazier or what, but it seems like all shows have less episodes these days.
You're assuming that the information they've revealed about the Governor so far is as bad as it gets and that what they have shown is not just foreshadowing of how bad he really is. If they follow the line of the comics pretty closely then there is a lot more to be revealed. I agree they maybe could have played it a bit closer to the chest off the bat but so far the only really crazy stuff they have shown is his room full of zombie heads. The shooting of the national guard guys isn't a bad reveal from our perspective because, really, you could make the argument that he's just trying to protect his town. You heard the pilot's story: One guy gets infected and everything went crazy. He's obviously willing to stop at nothing to make sure that doesn't happen and then he goes back and gives the people a warning to be ever vigilant. That's all consistent with his end goal of keeping the town safe at all costs and being practical vs sympathetic (i.e. beating the National Guardsman to death to save a single bullet). The reveal on the zombie heads was maybe premature but I think all they were trying to indicate is that this guy has some pretty messed up secrets and there is more to him than simply a guy who will do anything to survive which, while important, wouldn't really seperate him from many people in this universe. It foreshadows some pretty messed up stuff to come and gives you a real look into how he is a lot more messed up than initially thought. So I wouldn't say that they have handled him perfectly thus far but overall I think they have done a good job with him and the season in general.
No one is ever safe with The Walking Dead...any of you read the comics? If not Youtube has videos of the scans...I recommend reading/watching it. In any case Robert Kirkman is guaranteed that anyone can or will be offed at any time. Fucked up world, but its how it should be
Lost failed because they introduced new mysteries that they did not have an answer for. they painted themselves into corners. that isn't the case with TWD. you can have a plan on how to introduce the audience to the character in the most dramatic manner possible without it being an open ended mystery. it is actually how every well written story has managed to do so throughout history -- the basic three act structure. a set up, complications and climax. every story follows it, and even every season has followed it. in fact, that is how they did so in the Governors first episode. they introduced him as a seemingly normal leader, complicated it by having him kill the Guard (which can be rationalized), and then climaxed the arc by showing that he is likely completely nuts. the point is that arc could have taken place across the entire season, with him being the good guy for the first few episodes while foreshadowing his darker side, the middle of the season you find out he is not what he seems, and then the likely climax where you find out he is in fact a raving lunatic. the equivalent would have been had they simply had him kill the Guard in the first 5 minutes of the episode. clearly the writers wanted us to believe he was good for some length of his introduction, so the excuse that the audience already knows isn't valid. they simply chose to reveal it immediately in one episode rather than being an interesting turn of events for the season.
Hershel's main weapon of choice happens to also be his main vechile of transportation. How the hell is this guy still around after he got bit like 4 episodes ago?
Really cool fan video someone made on YouTube that Glenn mazzara the head producer of TWD tweeted [YouTube]Zy4a7Rivauo[/youTube]
Don't mean to hijack this into a LOST discussion, but I always feel the need to defend my favorite show. LOST did not introduce new mysteries that they didn't have the answer to. Every major mystery was addressed (even if you don't like the answer). There were some minor ones that got dropped along the way for various reasons, because they weren't essential to the core story of the show. The problem was, people so over-analyzed the show that minor plot points (who was in the outrigger, why was Libby in a mental institution, how did "Mother" get to the island) got blown out of proportion. That being said, I see very little of LOST in TWD. Other than both being cool genre shows, they have very little overlapping DNA.
I hope you all read Andy Greenwald's recaps, they're incredible. http://www.grantland.com/blog/holly...walking-dead-season-3-episode-4-killer-within
I'm a big lost fan, so I din't mean the show failed as a whole, just that it failed in the execution of its "mystery" strategy. when the "minor" mysteries were introduced, they weren't done so as unimportant elements of the story. in fact, they were given enough attention for the audience to assume they would be answered later on. expecting that isn't the audience's compulsion to over-analyze everything, it is basic storytelling -- you don't introduce something that isn't resolved. they only became unimportant when they were never addressed further.
The Walking Dead feels very similar to LOST to me. That is why I like it. The story telling, the mysteries, the unsolved questions, the set-ups for future episodes, I can't think of a show closer to how LOST was done. I don't watch many dramas, so I can't speak for them all, but I see their similarities.
Oh yes they did introduce mysteries they didn't have an answer for. They kept doing it even up to halfway through season 6. That was the issue. Too much crap to explain. They never adequately explained the following: - Moving the island with the wheel (even though they claimed it was constantly moving later) - Half the plane passengers time traveling upon coming back to the island - The moving cabin of MIB (thought to be Jacob) - The ash stopping MIB - Jacob appearing as a kid in season 6 randomly then an adult, then back to a kid again and back to adult. Why? - The numbers and the connection with Hurley winning the lottery - The origin of the island - The details of the actual game with MIB and Jacob - The reason why some people were stuck time traveling when it was skipping and others weren't - significance of the water drinking ritual and names on the wall being crossed off - where did the coordinates to enter or exit the island come from and the shield that hides it? I mean you can't just say "the light did it" and call that an explanation. That's lazy writing. There's plenty more, that's just off the top of my head. They kept introducing mystery on top of mystery on top of mystery. They over did it. They spent more time in season 6 introducing new mysteries than finalizing the story line, hence why many fans felt cheated. Even the biggest reveal ever, (the episode with mother) only brought more questions. I agree TWD is nothing like lost aside from focusing strongly on character development. Lost was also my favorite show but I feel the writers dug themselves too deep and failed to address a lot of it in season 6. I thought they could have done a much better job ending the show.
I don't have much money, but if I did, I would bet it all on DBJ having a sweet response to Barcs soon.
