Oh, you weren't blabbing on about current conditions, got it. Metlife will have grass for the world cup for sure. I thought you were making an overall point about how you wish the NFL would operate but I guess not, Idk anymore
The World Cup's lead is no more than an idea on paper right now. Just because they may very well be able to have success for a limited number of games in the middle of the growing season bears no relationship to implementing something similar across vastly different climates for an entire NFL season.
If it works then how does it bear no relation? It's a proving ground (no pun intended). If it works then there is proof that it can be done. I would say there's a definite connection there.
"If it works." Again, a few games in the summer does not equate to an entire NFL season in vastly diverse weather conditions. There's no need to repeat the same thing again unless you don't understand that climate has a huge affect on what can grow and thrive. How many World Cup games do you expect to see in torrential rain and sub-zero conditions with snow?
Again I'm not sure if you're deflecting on purpose or you just are not aware. Soccer leagues all around the world play in more diverse weather conditions than just the US and yet you still act like these games at the World Cup are the only ones they'll play? Soccer has full seasons and yes, they do equate and are even longer than an NFL season. So again, tell me why it can;t be done in the US for 18 weekends a year in the NFL? If Soccer can put down these surfaces all year round then why can;t the NFL for 18 weekends? Try to answer the question.
Instead of simply repeating the same thing over and over, why not address my questions? Try this: what surface do you propose the NFL puts down that will survive in every NFL stadium. Here's another: what makes you think whatever single surface you, or the league, selects will reduce injuries?
And you still haven't answered my question! it's a simple question and simple solution. Yet you keep taking the opposition view without providing any good supporting reason. I've already provided my supporting reason which is if it can be done in Soccer, including on the same fields where they play the damn NFL games, then why doesn't the NFL follow suit? I'll be waiting. You have no good answer exceptt to repeat the same lazy response of different weather in different cities causes different field conditions. WRONG! The World Cup playing on those same surfaces disproves your theory. So what's your response to that? We already heard your weather/environmental conditions excuse so come with something new or just admit that you don't know.
He is already giving you a response my friend. But let me chime in as well. Soccer in Europe is being played on Grass except a few Northern stadiums in Sweden, Norway, Iceland etc. But those non-grass stadiums are far between. It can be done in the NFL as well if teams agree to spend some money to properly maintain it. But there is one main difference here in USA versus Europe. In USA stadiums are used for multi purpose. On top of NFL games, there are concerts, local events etc which will harm a grass surface. In Europe, soccer stadiums are only used for soccer 95% of the time. Like my team Galatasaray. There are roughly 20 soccer games being played at our home turf but that's it. Only soccer events take place there. No concerts or no other stuff. That's why in my opinion Grass won't work for NFL stadiums. It will cut down their revenue streams. Just my 2 cents.
There are not many events during the NFL season from what I can recall, at least at Metlife. I do not see a reason why grass cannot be put in. They have grass in Harrison. NJ for NYRB MLS soccer team, with the season going from March to Dec. Especially if they put a roof as well, which would be so much better for the fans as well as preservation of the grass. Now, to @Ralebird 's point, I also have no clue whether it will actually reduce the injuries. There is some evidence it is better for the knees longer term, but the actual injury data I have seen has not been conclusive. However the important thing is that 92% of players prefer grass. So, having grass at MetLife might help attract FAs and it's a good thing in general if players get to play on their preferred surface. And the roof would be great for the fans as well. So, to me, installing grass and roof would be a positive development, but it will cost more, so not holding my breath.
Yeah let's just say he has selective hearing, or reading in this case I only told him that in like 4 posts and yet he just came steamrolling forward without even understanding or not wanting to accept that very important fact that I presented to him. Willful ignorance I suppose. And no doubt it's been done before in Soccer (forever) and at some point in the near future the NFL will address it because it is such an elephant in the room and the players in the league overwhelmingly are in favor of it.
Well, uniformity would require the use of the same type of grass - since he won't answer why he thinks a uniform standard for grass is workable perhaps you will. Also, what makes anyone so sure such implementation would reduce injuries?
I saw your point every time you made it - soccer fields have grass; I don't dispute that at all, that's not what I addressed. You have yet to acknowledge my point that uniformity would require using the same type of grass throughout the NFL - I find that problematic if not impossible. As @Borat mentions above, information regarding cause and effect of football injuries as they relate to playing surfaces is inconclusive and largely anecdotal. Personally, I believe properly matching footgear to whatever playing surface, in whatever condition, is most important in reducing injury and has been largely ignored. That is surely exacerbated by the decision on what shoe to wear is largely left to the individual player who makes decisions based on performance advantages rather than injury prevention.
As a reminder, Giants stadium opened in 1976 with artificial turf; In 2000 natural grass in a replaceable tray system was installed. In 2003 artificial turf was reinstalled as the real grass attempt produced an inferior playing surface. The New York Times reported on the tearout of the grass and reinstallation{ PRO FOOTBALL; Giants Stadium Counter Tray: Grass Gets Greener in an Instant - The New York Times (nytimes.com) Similar attempts have been made elsewhere in the past twenty years with limited success: Wikipedia regarding Houston's NRG Stadium: During the 2015 season, a permanent artificial surface was installed at NRG Stadium. The Texans had used a natural surface since the stadium opened, using a system of trays of sod similar to one used at Giants Stadium in its experiment with using a grass surface. In recent years, the stadium installed artificial turf to be used during high school and college games while keeping the grass for Texans games. After the Texans' home opener, complaints about the field conditions finally led to the installation of the artificial surface for Texans games. The surface brand is UBU Speed, which is part of Act Global.[20] In 2017, NRG Stadium selected Hellas Construction to install its Matrix Turf with Helix Technology at the stadium. The three year contract calls for a new turf field each year.[21] Currently only Arizona and Las Vegas use similar systems to those used in Giants Stadium and Reliant/NRG in the past with only the Cardinals system having passed the test of time, although there were many complaints of the field being slippery for last year's Super Bowl. The highly impressive, and promoted, system used by Real Madrid has only been in use for a matter of months; time will tell if it was a worthwhile billion dollar gamble.
Metlife since its shared has a football game every weekend, sometimes 2. When we had grass at Giants Stadium it was a mess
I think without a dome it may be tough to maintain grass in this time period, which has a lot of rain. Which is why I think they need to install a roof to drastically improve their chances of having a great grass field. When a bunch of 300lb lineman collide on the very wet field for 3.5 hours, it could turn to mud. The roof will almost completely solve that problem. Looking at Houston, which had a grass dome too until recently, suggests that the mud was not an issue. The issue that killed the grass there was that they had interlinking of grass and it kept coming apart. Not unlike what Metlife had decades ago. To remind, back in the day Metlife installed interlocked trays of grass on top of turf. That did not allow deep grass roots to develop. Coupled with lack of roof and rainy fall season it caused the grass to turn into mud. Taking the lessons from that and Houston fiasco, a roof to stop the rain (not to mention make it a much better viewing experience in poor weather for fans) along with permanent grass I think would drastically improve grass field quality. And help bring free agents, better for fans, make players happy. Perhaps the time has come to give it another shot with the outlined improvements above. It will cost a lot more to install roof and permanent grass as well as maintain, so probably won't happen, but would be nice.
I have a question - that's why I asked it. Do you have an answer? I've read many many reports and found exactly zero roofed stadiums that have had sustained success with real grass, even when the grass is on tracks that allow it to be outside most of the time.
I should have clarified - I meant retractable roof, not a permanent one. Metlife is ready to have it built into current structure, but it will cost 100+ mil. Grass could be outside most of the time, only in cases of floods or poor weather during games they could close it. I did check on grass fields: https://en.as.com/nfl/what-nfl-stad...ch-ones-have-artificial-turf-the-full-list-n/ Looks like Arizona and Vegas are full indoor stadiums that use the grass. Not sure how many others have retractable roof. However, it looks like majority of the stadiums do have grass, and they appear to maintain it just fine, including poor climates, like KC, some even without a retractable roof. Bermuda grass and Kentucky bluegrass seem to be more prevalent. Also there is Dasso GrassMaster like in GB that seems intriguing. It just seems to me that there should be a way to make this happen, the owners just need to invest in it. But players prefer grass overwhelmingly, and surface could be a selling point instead of disadvantage. Not to mention retractable roof would please the fans.
