I figure because defenses and schemes have gotten more complicated. Because of the rules more has been put on the QB to perform. At the end of the day is context. Look at Mac Jones he was put in a pretty good situation but when he was asked to win the game he sucked. Doe that mean he is doomed to suck, no it just means he is a young QB and it takes time. Zach was asked to carry a bad football team he was not ready. When the running game started working and his young play makers developed Zach looked much better. There is a difference between playing as a rookie and playing as a second or third year player. At the end of the day you either have it or you don't. Sam could not take the next step, Sanchez or Geno couldn't either . Marriotta and Winston started hot as did Daniel Jones. Remember Rick Mier how good he looked as a rookie? The truth is Zach's story is not told yet and we find out a lot more next year than we did this year. He did not look like he did not belong and that is at least encouraging.
I’m just not sure how you can make the bolded claim and then draw the conclusion that Wilson has “it.” I’m open minded to seeing how he progresses in year 2 assuming we continue to add around him. But I definitely don’t feel great about him turning into a FQB.
I believe this is demonstrably false. Zach (pre-injury) Att 181 Comp 104 Pct 57.5 Yards 1168 YPA 6.45 TD 4 Int 9 Sacks 19 Pass Plays per Sack 10.53 Zach (post-injury) Att 202 Comp 109 Pct 54.0 Yards 1166 YPA 5.77 TD 5 Int 2 Sacks 25 Pass Plays per Sack 9.08 The difference between pre-injury and post injury is that the Jets asked Zach to do less and that showed up in every metric except for Comp% and Pass Plays per Sack. Zach, despite throwing fewer long passes completed fewer of his passes and got sacked more often. You can focus on the many fewer Int's if you want but all of us saw Zach throwing the ball low, often into the ground, after he returned. Many of us remember Mark Sanchez and Richard Todd both having those response mechanisms when criticism of high Int #'s showed up in their rookie years.
The proof is in the pudding man. QB stats are up hugely compared to the past. Sure, there's more pressure on them, but that's because we rightly expect more of them because the league now caters to passing. I'm sorry but Zach definitely did look like he didn't belong for most of the season. I was very encouraged by the last several weeks because he definitely improved but he was flat out awful for the first half of the season.
We've just got to see how this turns out and honestly if the draft were held again, I'd still take Wilson...
If the draft were held again, I would trade back and take Lance (if available) or Jones (if Lance isn't available).
With hindsight we could just say take Mills and get more studs in round 1. But its an interesting question. I wonder how many people here would still take Wilson with that pick.
If I knew Mills would be available in round 3 and would have the second best season out of the rookies, I would've taken Chase at 2, Humphrey at 23, and Freiermuth at 34. I was as high on Chase as you were on Smith, so that's a pick I would've made without hindsight.
That would rock. Except we could have gotten Waddle/Smith plus multiple firsts, seconds, and a 3rd just to trade down to 6. Is Chase worth more than Smith, plus picks 38, 69, last year, and an extra 1st and 2nd this year? IMO Chase isn't better than Smith, he's just in a way better situation.
I believe there's a point where all those additional picks would yield diminishing returns even for a team that's bereft of talent. And we'll have to agree to disagree on who's better. I think Smith can be a good WR, but not quite on Chase's level.
I don't think Mills is that great. He put up pretty good numbers for a rookie given that he was on a bad team, but his skillset doesn't look like that of a future top QB.
I honestly don't understand how you can say Zach was awful while not accounting for the awfulness that he was surrounded with. By the time he got hurt, LaFleur had gone back to the booth, and the playcalling improved, as well as the OL was starting to settle down and the skill players - especially the rookies - were starting to adjust to the NFL. Zach didn't have any of that his first 5 games. When he did return there was noticeable improvement in his game, and that remained the case until the injuries piled up on the OL and skill players...still he did well considering and didn't have a T.O. for 5 straight games, something that only Rodgers equaled. I'm not saying he should be inducted into Canton, but how can you not be encouraged and have some real hope that he's the long lost FQB they've been looking for?
Easy to say now, but not many were sold on either of those guys before the draft. And frankly both would've struggled mightily on the Jets unless they could've been allowed to sit for a year or so. Mac is not very mobile and would've been killed behind our OL, even at its best this year. Lance is so raw he would've been overwhelmed trying to deal with what Zach dealt with. I actually did suggest that if they traded back that Mac should be their pick, but only if they were either going to massively improve the OL and/or get a vet for him to play behind until they did.
The OL was a disaster to start the year, I agree with that. It improved throughout the season though. Wilson also played most games with most of his receivers healthy, right? Not all, but most. The Rodgers comparison with the INT's doesn't mean anything to me. Wilson reduced his INT numbers by never pushing the ball downfield and missing low over and over. Rodgers had low INT numbers for entirely different reasons. Rodgers was also completing 75% of his passes over that span and throwing for over 250 yards per game and 3 TD's on average. Wilson's low INT numbers came while he was completing 58% of his passes for 160 yards per game and 0.5 TD's per game. They are not at all comparable other than the INT numbers. Almost any QB can go out there and not throw a lot of INT's if that's their primary concern. It is another thing entirely to play the position at an elite level while not throwing INT's.
Dude come onnnnnn with dragging people like Rodgers into the discussion. He threw 20 touchdowns in his last 7 games on 72% completion for 275 yards a game en route to his 4th MVP award. It’s not even worth mentioning that him and Wilson both didn’t throw a lot of picks at the end of the year.
While technically most of his receivers were "healthy" most of the time, this implies that they were all NFL-caliber receivers, which of course they were not. And he did have a lot of his "starting" receivers injured. Maybe the Rodgers comp doesn't mean anything to you, but who else equaled it? If it's so easy as to be dismissed why didn't more QBs do that? In fact, "Almost any QB can go out there and not throw a lot of INT's..." isn't true. Again, I'm not saying it means Wilson is great, but it's an indication that he has learned that taking care of the ball is important, something that Sam didn't.
Yes, if I was trying to say that Wilson is almost as good as Rodgers, it wouldn't be worth mentioning I suppose, but that's NOT what I was saying.
Sorry, I was not clear. I meant I think Wilson had most of his starting WR's for most games. And our starting WR's this year were definitely NFL caliber (though not great). I do agree that Wilson showed a definite ability to realize his biggest mistakes and eliminate them. Having said that, his Y/A and TD numbers took a big hit because of it and so did his completion % because he was so intent on not throwing INT's that he was missing a ton of guys low and short. Is that better than throwing INT's? For sure, but he will need to put up way bigger numbers while eliminating the INT's for me to feel good about it.
The best receivers he had were not available quite a lot - Crowder who could be considered their best receiver was out for 4 games, Corey Davis went on IR for the last 5 games but was also hurt- Questionable for 5 others, Elijah Moore was out for 3 games, but "fortunately" Mims WAS available every game. That's a lot for a QB to have to deal with when the subs were sub-NFL caliber, despite what you say. The fact that his Y/A and TD numbers "took a big hit" have to be looked at in context: he's a first year QB playing the most demanding position in sports. Of course someone doing something for the first time isn't going to perform at the speed and competency of someone with experience. Why this should be any indication of alarm is baffling. Yes, I understand - and agree - that until he DOES perform at a FQB level we fans can't assume that he will. Fair enough. But to write him off as a failure as some here have been doing is ridiculous.
