There's an article up at the Star Ledger regarding the Eagles' Draft that I think is a bit interesting. It's got me wondering, and I'm curious what you guys think regarding the number of carries RBs have coming out of college. Since the Jets have had so many holes over the years, and rarely have drafted RBs, I've never really thought much about the number of carries they had in college, but I can see now where this could be a big issue. 600-1,000+ carries in college is a lot of hits and wear and tear on RBs. Of course the number of carries they got in college depends upon several factors: how good they are, how good their team's offense was (did they have a decent passing attack, or was the RB solely their offense?), the team's depth at RB, injuries or sickness, etc. It seems that it could be the biggest reason that RBs have the shortest NFL careers on average. If so, I think that's another good reason not to expend a high #1 draft pick on a RB. But is that reality? Does it make a big difference? One would also need to consider the number of receptions they had and also whether they ran back kickoffs or punts. I'll post the RBs and their comments in several posts, but if you want to see video of each of the RBs, go to the article itself. http://www.nj.com/eagles/index.ssf/2017/02/2017_nfl_draft_top_20_running_backs_fans_should_kn.html 1. DALVIN COOK, FLORIDA STATE ROUND: 1st SIZE: 5-foot-11, 213 pounds STATS: 687 carries, 4,464 yards, 46 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Cook is the biggest home-run hitter among this year's running back class, and has the ability to take it to the house every time he catches the ball. Cook can also catch the ball out of the backfield, and is decent in pass protection, making him a three-down running back. 2. LEONARD FOURNETTE, LSU ROUND: 1st SIZE: 5-foot-11, 213 pounds STAT: 616 carries, 3,830 yards, 40 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Fournette didn't have the final season that Cook did, but his sophomore campaign -- 1,953 yards and 22 touchdowns -- shows just how dominant he can be. 3. CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY, STANFORD ROUND: 1st SIZE: 6-foot-0, 202 pounds STATS: 632 carries, 3,922, 22 touchdowns ANALYSIS: McCaffrey is pretty firmly behind Cook and Fournette on most draft boards, but one thing that does separate McCaffrey is his he has a proven track record of catching the ball out of the backfield. In three seasons at Stanford, McCaffrey caught 99 passes for 1,206 yards and 10 touchdowns. 4. ALVIN KAMARA, TENNESSEE ROUND: 2nd SIZE: 5-foot-10, 215 pounds STATS: 210 carries, 1,294 yards, 16 touchdowns ANALYSIS: One positive for Kamara? He has close to 400 less carries than Fournette, Cook and McCaffery. For a running back, that is a huge deal, and will likely be very attractive to teams at the top of the second round. 5. JOE MIXON, OKLAHOMA ROUND: 3rd SIZE: 5-foot-10, 215 pounds STATS: 300 carries, 2,027 yards, 17 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Mixon comes with off-the-field red flags, but if a team decides that isn't enough to keep him off their boards, he is without question one of the most talented running backs in the draft. 6. MARLON MACK, SOUTH FLORIDA ROUND: 4th SIZE: 6-foot-0, 205 pounds STATS: 586 carries, 3,609 yards, 32 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Mack had nearly twice as many touchdowns last season (15) as he did during his sophomore season (8) on 34 less carries.
7. SAMAJE PERINE, OKLAHOMA ROUND: 4th SIZE: 5-foot-10, 235 pounds STATS: 685 yards (should be carries), 4,122 yards, 49 touchdowns ANALYSIS: He isn't as explosive as Mixon is, but since he comes without the red flags, it is very possible some teams will have Perine ahead of Mixon on their boards. 8. WAYNE GALLMAN, CLEMSON ROUND: 4th round SIZE: 6-foot-0, 210 pounds STATS: 675 carries, 3,416 yards, 34 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Gallman had impressive numbers during his final season at Clemson, but he rarely dominated, going over 100 yards just five times in 15 games despite getting over 15 carries in 10 games. 9. KAREEM HUNT, TOLEDO ROUND: 4th round SIZE: 6-foot-0, 225 pounds STATS: 782 carries, 4,945 yards, 44 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Hunt was a threat running the ball and catching it last season, finishing with 1,475 yards rushing and 403 yards receiving. 10. D'ONTA FOREMAN, TEXAS ROUND: 4th round SIZE: 6-foot-1, 249 pounds STATS: 431 carries, 2,774 yards, 20 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Foreman came on strong in his junior season, totaling 2,028 yards and 15 touchdowns. One concern, however, is his lack of production catching the ball out of the backfield, bringing in only 13 passes in three seasons. 11. JEREMY MCNICHOLS, BOISE STATE ROUND: 4th round SIZE: 5-foot-9, 212 pounds STATS: 571 carries, 3,205 yards, 23 touchdowns ANALYSIS: McNichols was a touchdown machine at Boise State, finding the end zone 53 times in his final two seasons. 12. COREY CLEMENT, WISCONSIN ROUND: 5th round SIZE: 5-foot-10, 221 pounds STATS: 576 carries, 3,092 yards, 36 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Clement proved last season he could be a workhorse, carrying the ball a whopping 314 times. 13. BRIAN HILL, WYOMING ROUND: 5th round SIZE: 6-foot-0, 219 pounds STATS: 775 carries, 4,287 yards, 35 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Hill had a monster junior season, finishing with more touchdowns (22) than he did in his first two seasons (13) combined.
14. JAMES CONNER, PITTSBURGH ROUND: 5th SIZE: 6-foot-2, 240 pounds STATS: 668 carries, 3,733 yards, 52 touchdowns ANALYSIS: After being diagnosed with Hodgkin's Lymphoma during his junior season, Conner 1,092 yards and 16 touchdowns last season. 15. DONNEL PUMPHREY, SAN DIEGO STATE ROUND: 5th round SIZE: 5-foot-8, 169 pounds STATS: 1,059 attempts, 6,405 yards, 62 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Pumphrey would be an excellent fit in the Eagles' offense, as the head coach Doug Pederson like to line his running backs out wide, and Pumphrey is more than capable of doing just that. 16. MATTHEW DAYES, NC STATE ROUND: 5th round SIZE: 5-foot-9, 207 pounds STATS: 550 carries, 2,856 yards, 34 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Dayes did not have the senior season he was hoping for, as he averaged just 4.7 yards, less than he did in his sophomore and junior season. 17. JAMAAL WILLIAMS, BYU ROUND: 6th round SIZE: 6-foot-0, 211 pounds STATS: 726 carries, 3,901 yards, 35 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Williams ended his college career on a high note, averaging 5.9 yards per carry his senior season. 18. ELIJAH MCGUIRE, UL LAFAYETTE ROUND: 6th round SIZE: 5-foot-9, 212 pounds STATS: 710 carries, 4,301 yards, 42 touchdowns ANALYSIS: McGuire was amazingly consistent in college, finishing with 1,000 yards in three of his four seasons, and over 300 yards receiving in three seasons. 19. DEVINE REDDING, INDIANA ROUND: 6th round SIZE: 5-foot-10, 208 pounds STATS: 508 carries, 2,252 yards, 17 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Despite getting 508 touches, Redding found the end zone just 17 times in three seasons, a potential red flag for NFL teams. 20. DE'VEON SMITH, MICHIGAN ROUND: 6th SIZE: 5-foot-11, 220 pounds STATS: 495 carries, 2,235 yards, 22 touchdowns ANALYSIS: Smith didn't get a ton of chances at Michigan, and with good showings in private workouts, could shoot up draft boards.
By comparison following are some notable RBs in recent drafts. Dalvin Cook - 687 carries in 3 years Leonard Fournette - 616 carries in 3 years (300 in his sophomore season) Christian McCaffrey - 632 carries in 3 years Alvin Kamara - 210 carries in 2 years Joe Mixon - 300 carries in 2 years Marlon Mack - 586 carries in 3 years Samaje Perine - 685 carries in 3 years Wayne Gallman - 675 carries in 3 years Kareem Hunt - 782 carries in 4 years D'Onta Foreman - 431 carries in 3 years (but 323 were last season) Jeremy McNichols - 571 carries in 3 years Corey Clement - 576 carries in 4 years Brian Hill - 775 carries in 3 years James Conner - 668 carries in 4 years Donnel Pumhrey - 1,059 caries in 4 years Matthew Dayes - 550 carries in 4 years Jamaal Williams - 726 carries in 4 years Elijah McGuire - 710 carries in 4 years Devine Redding - 508 carries in 3 years De'Veon Smith - 495 carries in 4 years Ezekiel Elliott - 592 carries in 3 years Derrick Henry - 602 carries in 3 years Jordan Howard - 647 carries in 3 years Kenneth Dixon - 802 carries in 4 years Devontae Booker - 560 carries in 2 years Todd Gurley - 510 carries in 3 years Melvin Gordon - 631 in 4 years Tevin Coleman - 452 in 3 years Duke Johnson - 526 in 3 years Ameer Abdullah - 813 in 4 years TJ Yeldon - 576 in 3 years Jay Ajayi - 678 in 3 years (347 his jr. year) David Johnson -866 carries in 4 years Karlos Williams - 241 carries in 4 years DeVonta Freeman - 404 carries in 3 years Carlos Hyde - 523 carries in 4 years Tre Mason - 516 carries in 3 years Bishop Sankey - 644 carries in 3 years Terrance West - 802 carries in 3 years (including 413 his Jr. season) Andre Williams - 704 carries in 4 years
I'm not a running back crazy guy. Not in this day in age. Packers, Patriots, Falcons, Seahawks, Raiders, Lions, Giants. None of these teams have a "franchise runningback" but they all have a franchise quarterback. If any of these guys above that you mentioned were on any of these teams I mentioned the teams would still be successful. Don't get me wrong it would be great to have a guy like Bell, Elliot, AP in his prime etc. But Id much rather build an offense around my quarterback and line. It really amazes me how well the Packers and Giants have been so successful with basically no runningbacks. With that being said out of everyone on your list I would love to grab Mack in the 4th or Clement in the 5th. Been saying that for awhile now. Late round picks with upside. I really hope we don't take a back in the first! we have way to many problems.
I agree. QB is definitely more important to a team's success, and a team's offense should be built around the QB rather than the RB. I had just never thought about RB's collegiate carries that much, because I've never thought about RBs that much since they aren't that important to me. The idea intrigued me a bit, so I did a little research. We definitely need to add a RB, but I agree that it should be in the middle rounds, not the 1st round.
You're right, but with the FQBs they have they don't need - nor would they use to his potential - a FRB. But what if you don't have, or aren't likely to get a FQB soon? Then in that situation a FRB makes HUGE sense. And if the Jets don't think any of this year's QBs are the answer, they had better find themselves FRB. I really like Cook at #6 for them, but if they decided to draft a RB lower I like Hunt as a "poor man's Dalvin Cook".
I keep trying to talk myself out of Leonard Fournette but I'll get behind it if we add to the OL and bring in an established vet like Hoyer. This guy is special, yeah it's not a RB league, yeah we have colossal needs at other positions but to lock in a talent like Fournette has huge upside. I know I'd order my jersey right away and retire my Revis jersey until it's a throwback.
You aren't wrong except for the fact that this game has a funny way of reverting back to its roots just when you think the passing game is "here to stay". Defenses are getting smaller & smaller to try and compensate for the pass happy quick passing games...teams that remember to prioritize the running game will be rewarded. Both Cook & Fournette are rare talents..their stock is not being inflated by any means...they both project as dominant at the next level. Fournette can hit holes & kick it outside w. power & a devastating stiff arm.He's a home run threat & can also be a work horse. We'll have to see what the combine Dr's think about the ankle. Cook is extremely explosive..catches the ball w. ease..will pass block & above all else he is a football player. He'll find a way to help the offense day 1...and if your an opposing D you absolutely must account for Cook when he is on the field. He can break off the top in a hurry.
The two Superbowl teams , Atlanta has 2 excellent backs, the key to their Superbowl run and NE had Blount over 1000 yards and 18 TDS and white, who will likely be NEs feature back next year had 3 scores in the Superbowl. The Packers are missing a RB and will likely draft one in the first round , that's what they need to reach the Superbowl. Seattle is far from the same team they were with Lynch. The Giants are in desperate need of a running back. The Raiders scored with richard as an UDFA and had Murray and Washington to carry the load in Carr's absence. The Lions..... Have not won a playoff game since 1991, last road win was 1957 a decade before Joe Willie's guarantee. The Giants and Packers had their success when they had running backs. The game has evolved into a passing game, but the RB is still a key position. The run still sets up the pass and better teams now utilize pass catching RBs like Cook, McCaffrey and to some extent Fournett.
Fournette had 300 carries in 2015 and then was banged up for most of 2016. That doesn't speak well to his ability to carry the load in the NFL. An NFL RB gets sore his first year and then stays sore forever. Some guys can handle it and some guys can't.
Laveon Bell was considered by many as a RB that had too many carries at Michigan State. He seemed to be doing ok with the Steelers but lately he has been nicked up, not sure if there is any correlation but we will see if the same thing happens next year. He was a 2nd round pick and he is extremely productive for them, which shows that you can find good RB in the later rounds, and because of the reasons you highlighted in regard to the amount of carries these guys get in college, there is no need to select a RB with the 6th overall pick. Ezekiel was fortunate enough that he was selected by the Cowboys, a team that already had 95% of the pieces in place. If the Cleveland Browns had selected him, there is no way he is the star he is today. The jets need to stay away from fournette or any RB with the 6th pick, just fix the trenches, once that is done, bring in a RB through FA or draft one in later rounds. This way those pieces become the finishing touches on a well built team.
You discount the impact an elite RB would have on the OL. A guy who makes his own holes, and catches passes out of the backfield takes tremendous pressure off the QB and OL. Maybe you can find an elite RB in a later round, but probably not the quality of a Cook or Fournette. And there are no OL rated as even Top 20-caliber this year, so if your heart is set on drafting an OL first, you're talking about trading down, which means giving up a better chance at grabbing a prime impact player, or seeing the guy(s) you want taken before you. I understand the philosophy of getting more draft picks, but I don't like the idea of giving up control of my destiny so to speak.
Are you referring to Todd Gurley? Because he became a very pedestrian RB after having a monster year. He could not help the oline or that QB who is on his way to suckville because teams continue to reach for their FQB. If you can tell me that the RB the jets select is going to be Adrian Peterson like, then I will be on board with it, however if there is doubt that he will be able to give them that type of production then the number 6 pick cannot be used on a RB.
Well, first off if I could tell you what the future holds, I'd be richer than Bill Gates and I would buy my own damn team. But the majority of assessments of Fournette is exactly that: He's "Adrian Peterson-like". And Cook is thought to be right there with him, and for my money, the better fit for this Jets team, but I wouldn't cry if they took Fournette. I know from reading your posts you lean towards drafting "D", and also are for trading down. That's completely the opposite of what I would do, but probably closer to what Macc will do. That said, where has all this investment in defense gotten them? Of course, as long as they have defense-oriented GMs and coaches, there's a big question of would they even know what to do with an offense? Judging by their record, the answer is no.
I wish I could tell you what the future holds as well, and I agree, that I would buy a team, but it would be a hockey team, the islanders. So I could fire Garth Snow. I think you have me confused with Hasty regarding drafting and trading down. In regards to the building of the jets, I actually don't have a preference for either side. My philosophy would be to stay where you are on draft board and draft from the trenches out, always make an effort to keep a strong foundation on the OL and DL so that skilled players such as RB, WR, QB, TE and OLB can be productive. I would never have spent the money on DL players or CB like the jets did with Mo and Revis, I would save that money for a FQB, and a dominant OLB. I believe in what Bellicheat does, get rid of players while they bring value in return not when there is diminishing value. Keeps the team young, reasonably cheap and skilled. Sentiment is only for the fans not a way to run a business. My selection with the number 6 pick this year regardless of what Todd Mcgay and Kiper say would be, either Ryan Ramczk or Cam Robinson. We will have our LT spot taken care of for the next 10 years, not a flashy or sexy pick, but it's a solid pick. JMO
Red, you're one of my favorite posters, one of the posters I'd most enjoy having a beer with, but I have to say that if the bolded sentence above is true, I'm glad that you're not the Jets' GM. Cam Robinson is a pretty bad pass blocker. That's the most important role of an LT. His strength is as a run blocker. Now maybe he can greatly improve, but I think he probably got coaching at Alabama equal to or better than of any player on any other college team, and he still lunges, gets off balance and whiffs on pass blocks. Further, most of the media "experts" are projecting him at best to RT, and a number of them are projecting him as an OG due to his liability as a pass blocker. That is not someone on whom you use the #6 pick in the draft. I like Ramczyk's potential a LOT, but he has only one year starting experience at a major college program and is coming off of hip surgery. He may not be fully healthy until well into TC. Again, you don't use the #6 pick in the draft to take a player like that. Reaching for one of those two (and make no mistake, that's a HUGE reach born out of desperation), almost never pays off, and winds up biting the team in the ass who reached. I want the LT position addressed as much as anyone, but taking Ramczyk at #6 is not wise. If the Jets trade down to the teens and take him, fine. I could live with that, but if Mac takes Ramczy at #6, he should be fired and not even allowed to finish the draft.
Thanks for the kind words NC, I know how guys feel about the LT prospects coming out of this years draft. I'm not blind to the facts or possible short comings of the guys that are eligible. Very few collegiate players come in and automatically do everything like a professional, they tweak and develope the ability that is already there. If the Jets don't select Ramczyck or Robinson, they drop down to middle of the first round or end of the first round, where the Giants or the Dolphins end up with them. What's going to happen when those guys are prow bowlers for the next 10 years for those teams? When should a 10 year pro bowl starter be selected in the draft? It's just my opinion, a top ten pick should play day one, not sit on the bench. I believe those 2 guys will do that for any team that selects them and will be doing it for quite a while at a very high level. Again it's just my opinion.
