First let me clarify two things: 1. Not because I love the job they've done. 2. "Long term" in this case = two years minimum (but should be more. Maybe less of a leash with Bowles). Post draft and recent cuts it's clear Mac and Bowles have a plan to build the roster the way they want. I'm not here to say it's a good plan. Could be the worse plan. But I want to see it play out. We're going to suck for some time and everyone is going to be screaming for a new regime. PATIENCE. To completely scrap their plan mid rebuild and bring in other guys (which is what we always do, tho this is the first time we're in full rebuild mode) sets the franchise back further. I know right now everyone's gonna say "duh we get it" but when emotions are running high this is gonna go right out the window and ppl will be calling for someone to be fired. Even Bowles needs to stick around bc the players we've picked (Lee, Adams, Maye, etc) you assume are to fit his defense. We've seen in the past bring in another coach and they don't like a player or they don't fit their scheme and we end up posting here about what so and so could have been if given more time. So let's just wait this out and see how it goes
I agree with you. We need to be patient. Maccs background is in scouting. Let's see if his draft picks can rebuild the roster.
I look at at this way 3-4 years is usually how long it takes to determine if a new GM/HC tandem should stick around. Idk if i want to give either a chance after this season or keep them around. But all i know is wins is not gonna determine my opinion on this matter. The play of the young guys is all I'm concerned about. And that lays equally on both Mac and Bowles shoulders, these are Macs players for the most part and i think he actually has to take most of the blame for the recent handlings so far. Leonard Williams looks to be his one prize move so far, but that looks to be it. Lee has struggled (albeit his rookie year), Hack is Hack and Smith is now pretty much done thats 2 of the top 4 picks you've been given the past 2 seasons. And not only have the drafts left more to be desired, but all of potential deals giving Mo money, not being able to get anything for Richardson, potentially not getting anything for Decker. Plus the releasing of Brick last year and Harris this year should have been handled way better. Harris is a life long Jet who has been here for 10+ years and u release him in the middle of practice??!! WOW... this might have been the worst thing he's ever done,(Besides Hack) because it could easily have been handled so much better. Have some respect and let the guy find a job, u can't tell me Demario Davis was the reason we were finally able to release Harris not when Davis was last seen for us as our backup ILB .And for the people who only put blame on Bowles and seemingly look past Macs many blunders i don't see how u can continue to do so. U can tell from his comments that he was no on board with this move. How do repeatedly blame Bowles when this for the past 3 years been an average to below average talent. What do u want him to do? Win despite of it? Nope save it if u blame Bowles put some of that and maybe even more on Mac too. We arent officially the worst team in the league still but thats cause SF and CLE are still that bad we're really neck and neck with them now. Other than our D-line we have a top 5 worst position group every where else
You have some good points and I agree with much of what you say, but imo Bowles deserves every bit of criticism he has received. The talent (or lack thereof) has nothing to do with his game management, clock management, lack of holding players accountable, lack of discipline, lack of the team being prepared to play each and every week, the lack of attention to detail, etc. That's ALL on Bowles. I despise the way Mac has handled the releasing of Brick, Mangold, Harris and Decker. The only thing I didn't like about the way he handled the release of Revis is that he didn't put his foot up Revis' ass and tell him to get the hell out and stay out.
In general patience is needed, but all the patience in the world with someone who is incompetent will not gain anything positive. It will just waste time and engender more ill will towards the franchise by the fan base. Patience was one of the biggest problems with Hess and now Johnson, along with their total stupidity/lack of knowledge when it comes to football. They were too patient and let incompetent people stay here too long much of the time. I think that this season is the make or break season for both Bowles and Mac. If the players that Mac has drafted don't start seriously developing, start making serious contributions, and showing real flashes of promise, then Mac should probably go. I'm not happy with the way he has handled the release of veterans, the Fitz contract situation last year, and others moves that he has/hasn't made. If the team continues to show up unprepared, doesn't play hard, doesn't eliminate all the mental errors and sloppy play, and if they don't become a disciplined team, then Bowles should definitely go. The rebuild will have no chance of succeeding if the right person isn't here running it (GM) and the right HC teaching and building the team ethic and culture.
What upsets me is that we should've done this three years ago when these guys arrived. As usual we are doing this too late (I blame Woody Johnson on that one. A guy who knows nothing about football and is always involved doing something wrong). That being said Macc and Bowles will be graded on what players develop. If player develop and look good then maybe they can stay. Specific players to look at: 1. QB: Hackenberg: He can make or break Macc and Bowles. From what I hear he looks so so. Some might look at Hackenberg's development or lack there of to break these guys. I don't think he will break them but he can hurt them. 2. RB: two veterans. Can't be graded for improvement. 3. OL: Shell and Johnson: Beachum Carpenter and Winters are vets that are expected to contrinute. If Johnson and Shell develop into starters it'll help them Macc and Bowles 4. TE: I don't think any of the players development here will impact them. If any of them catch more than ten balls it'll be an improvement. 5. DL: Wilkerson needs to bounce back as well as Richadrson and Williams needs to continue to develop. 6. LB: Lee really needs to develop. The off field issue the other day hurts but he can't blow assignments and look lost. This one will be a big one on their watches. 7. OLB: Mauldin Jenkins, etc. This group needs to prove they can play. Another knock if they don't. 8. CB: Burris has to look the part along with the picks this year. Without development from them the Jets will continually be torched and look awful. The fact that Bowles was a db coach initially this could affect him the most. 9. S: Adams and Maye have to be studs. If not both Bowles and Macc need to be given walking papers. Wins will not matter. The development of of about 10 players will seal the fate of these two. I think Macc stays if half of them do develop. Hackenburg I think will be his biggest blemish and might be the reason he loses a job. Bowles need 8 of the ten to develop to keep his job. I think if players really show improvement he will stay. If not he is gone.
While i agree, I think Bowles will take the fall and Mac will choose a head coach. With a roster of youth and $80 mil in cap space AND a top 3 pick, it should attract some good coaches. The biggest negative would be that it's the Jets .....
The Jets should've been rebuilt following 2012 and 2014, but we exceeded expectations in 2013 and had a 2015 season that was the result of a band aid job. I applaud our management for finally committing to a rebuild. Mac and Bowles should get AT LEAST two more years, with Bowles only getting canned after this season if the team shows absolutely no competitiveness on the field and he continues to make horrible coaching decisions like he did in Pittsburgh last year. The 2017 Jets should be judged on three categories. 1. How competitive is the team? Forget wins and losses. How good is this team playing on Sunday? 2. Do our young players show growth? 3. Does Todd Bowles show growth as a head coach on and off the field?
Patience???? How much patience can one reasonably ask of a Jet fan, especially those of us who have been around from the beginning. It's now approaching 50 years since the team won. Furthermore, in most of those intervening years the team has not been competitive. A lot of us are collecting pensions, SSI, preparing wills, creating trust estates and generally preparing for the big "exit" and you want us to have patience? Sorry, in order to have patience, I need to have faith that the current Jets brain trust knows what they're doing....and I don't.
That's not how this organization is structured. The GM doesn't hire the coach. I think Bowles should stick around for at least another year, but we need to see improvement.
I'm completely confident in Mac. I am cautiously optimistic, bordering on pessimistic with Bowles. Bowles just might be a coach who needs HIS players to succeed. It's much like when a company merges and eventually replaces all the legacy employees. In either case, Woody is doing a great job at letting football people make the decisions, even if it ends up bad. It was still the right thing to do.
This is a legitimate gripe on woody but let's look at what was happening 3 years ago. There were billboards and planes/banners being flown over practice because the jets were pretty much in the middle of the same season they are creating right now. One of the greatest players to ever play for nyj had just one a super bowl with the hated pats and the natives were very restless. As a businessman woody did what was best for the bottom line and had mac do what he needed to do to appease the angry mob and it almost worked. Even if it had and we made the playoffs I think we would still be right where we are today though. Fitz was going to turn back to a pumpkin at some point whether it was week 17,wild card round or the 2016 season but by week 15 it was obvious the new regime was going to try to run it again. They had too,the play off drought was too long and they were too close to fold it up for 2016. So, yes, in a vacuum this should have all happened in 2015. In reality though, it just made too much sense to do what they did,outside forces being what they were. Now,there are a few parallels to be drawn between that 2014 team and this one, let's see if woody can withstand the pressures when the team is bad and the crowd demands their pound of flesh. If he doesn't expect to be right here again in 2019 .
I don't think Mac and Bowles are on the same wave length unless Woody ordered these cuts. Yesterdays presser, Bowles seemed blind sided and put off by the Harris cut and I'm sure he was just as put off by the Decker news. While Bowles is trying to win games, Macc seems keen to get rid of two talented players and in general to shed the roster of any player over 30. Maccs goal is to build a long term winner by first tearing this whole thing down while Bowles goal is to win as many games which requires a talented roster. The only thing that changes this is if like I said, Woody ordered these cuts and Macc just spoke the company line. Don't be surprised if we go 2-14 or 3-13 and Bowles gets axed while Macc gets retained. It's not about 2017 - its all about 2018 and beyond
Bowles only chance of staying with the team team is if he gets the the players to rally behind him and fight hard every game even though there be some ugly losses. If the team plays a full 60 minutes every week and keeps the games reasonable tight, I think he'll be ok for next year . But if the team gives up on him and becomes malcontent , I could see him getting the axe at some point during the season .
In my opinion the underlying issue to our problem started with day one of the new regime, and the ass backwards selection by Woody of the HC before the GM. I think that in any good organization the GM picks the HC and the HC reports to the GM, period end of story. The GM runs the business and flows down expectations to the HC. The HC coaches and participates in personnel selection from a better fit perpective but not as a long term vision perpective. When they both report to the owner, an owner that does not know football to boot, the results are innapropiate and divergent. Add to that the lack of focus by Woody, with an initial win now approach versus rebuild from day one and we have what we have. I totally agree with NC that Bowles has demonstrated some significant shortcoming in his capabilities, independent of personnel. I dont particulary have a problem with Mac's approach to the releases of some great players although it should have been instituted sooner. We are now at a cross roads of a dilema. Bowles needs to win to keep his job. Mac has a totally diferent outlook and wants to build for the future. In so doing it makes a coaching job harder, almost impossible with a rookie QB. Classic dilema when the leadership has conflicting goals, and an owner that does not know any better. We might not be tanking just for Sam, but more importantly for a new coach. Start looking.
If they truly want to get it right, like most teams,the chain of command should be switched to GM hiring the coach
Sounds a lot like Rex and Idzic last year here. If these guys are in different timelines than expect more of the same every 2-3 years as woody has learned nothing
I think Macc wins in either situation - suck this year - secure a top 3 pick, perhaps even higher and get Darnold (assuming he declares) or play Hack , Hack turns out to play great and you end up looking like a savior. Only one of these options makes Bowles look good.
