Jim Harbaugh discussion

Discussion in 'NCAA' started by Br4d, Nov 28, 2021.

  1. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    Credit to Br4d here. I’ve never been a big Harbaugh fan, maybe because he’s a dick. But I think I’ve turned a corner. As long as he’s OUR dick. Looking deeper into his HC record, there really is a pattern of bringing success to mediocre teams. Even at UM, if you look at the program left to him by Rich Rod and Brady Hoke. In 2015, if you told UM fans that Harbaugh would bring the program back to just a shade below Lloyd Carr’s winning percentage, I have to think they’d accept that. His problem is, UM will always measure it’s success against OSU, both in the standings and The Game. That hasn’t been a fair comparison for 20-years. In 2021, he caught lighting in a bottle. I can’t see how that’s sustainable.

    Agree entirely about Lincoln Riley. Smartest thing he could have done. For a guy who’s successfully been pulling 5-star talent out of CA to OK, now joining a conference that can’t get out of its own way, I’d put real money down that USC will be in the CFP within three years. Plus, did you follow the hilarious drama leading up to the announcement? OKState trolls OK by piping “Callin’ Baton Rouge’ over the stadium speakers, so some dope reporter asks Lincoln if he’s considering the LSU job. He responds, “I won’t be the next coach at LSU.” One of those bullshit responses we hear from coache all the time, but no follow up. Less than 24-hours later, he surprises everyone by announcing his move to USC. Worked out 100x better than OKState could have ever planned it. Some reporter should be sitting in a corner wearing a dunce cap today.

    Also agree with your point on LSU. That’ll be another fun one to watch. Tiger fans are all pissed off today that Florida and USC struck quickly, while they’ve been sitting around dreaming about Jimbo Fisher. Again. As you said, unless they can coax Urban back to the SEC, I don’t see any new hire making that fanbase happy. Maybe Lane Kiffin. The rumors about Meyer have been out there for both LSU and Florida but I haven’t heard any comment from him one way or the other, have you?

    I have sweet tooth for this soap opera shit.
     
    #21 Sundayjack, Nov 29, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2021
  2. Brook!

    Brook! 2018 Friendliest Member Award Winner
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    Awesome post. Learned a lot sir. That's why we missed you on this board :)
     
  3. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    The Mara’s have slowly become the new version of the Wilson’s but I still think that’s the only place Harbaugh would go. They’re going to clean house from general manager on down.

    It’s not a Giants-type move but I imagine they’ll deviate from the George Young tree for the first time since he took over and hired Parcells in the early 80’s out of desperation.

    Once Michigan gets housed by Alabama in the first round of the CFP to the tune of something like 42-17, Harbaugh will have taken Michigan as far as he can. Their best chance was to see Alabama lose to Auburn this past week in the Iron Bowl and get a weak draw like Notre Dame sneaking in.
     
    #23 Jonathan_Vilma, Nov 29, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2021
  4. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    I've wanted Harbaugh as the Jets coach for a long time. Its never going to happen, though. This sucks
     
  5. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    crazy that you posted that about LSU and hours later they joined in on the soap opera in a big way
     
  6. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    Agreed 100%. The Jets are in desperate need of some credibility. They need a guy who has been there before, has a plan, and isn't afraid to hurt any feelings instituting it. Top to bottom that would help this organization. Harbaugh fits the bill. But there are others if the Jets ever thought outside the box.

    You got Woody making decisions though and the guy has picked losers his whole life, on and off the field. Plus someone like this would not be cheap anyway, and its a lot cheaper to pick up the 49ers defensive coordinator and hope for the best
     
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  7. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    He is a great coach of football. The "step below" issues come from recruiting. In the NFL that wouldn't be an issue.

    Even his recruiting might not be that bad, he is a little bit handcuffed in that he is Michigan's coach. Alabama & Ohio State, teams like that, will give out scholarships to anyone who can run fast & jump high. Michigan at least abides by some academic/personal conduct standards
     
  8. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    Not trying to be hyperbolic, but this season, capped by the last 72-hours, will be remembered for years. Just awesome. And it ain’t even over. The losers in all this drama? Oklahoma and Luke Fickell. I have no sympathy for Oklahoma. Fickell, though, is a victim of his own success. I’m sure all of the ADs looking for a new HC reached out to him, but he’d have been scorned if he disrupted Cincinnati’s Cinderella run by accepting a new job before it was over. He could still come out on top if he’s offered the ND opening, but it seems like a good chunk of ND Nation would prefer Marcus Freeman - who ironically built his reputation at Cincinnati under Luke Fickell. Crazy stuff.

    Funny that we’re talking about coaching salaries here, because when details of Brian Kelly’s contract are released, it’s going to break the salary scale entirely. Some guessing around $15 million. Maybe, maybe not. But he did tell everyone just two weeks ago that it would take an obscene amount to pry him away from ND.

    Which brings us back to the main topic of the thread, because I think the drama now turns northward to Michigan. If you’re Jim Harbaugh and just ten months ago you were asked to cut your salary in half, how happy are you today? If UM genuinely wants to keep the guy, they would be handing him a new contract offer five minutes after he beats Iowa. On the other hand, if UM somehow finds a way to lose this week, I can’t see them doing that. On the OTHER hand, if Harbaugh leaves, then two best candidates to replace him - Fickell and Freeman - are both OSU guys.

    Man, this is so much fun…
     
    #28 Sundayjack, Nov 30, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2021
  9. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    100%. Let's say he does win the National Championship. Well, that's one and done because Ohio State is still a better program and it's absolutely dominant in the Big Ten. Harbaugh's best move at that point is to cash in on the trophy and go someplace where he'll be working with an equivalent resource base to the competition. Strange as it may sound the Jets resource base, if appropriately managed is as good as anybody in the NFL's right now. There's cash flow and high picks and a number of potential good young players here for him to start with. The salary cap means he will not face the kind of disadvantage he does vis-a-vis Ohio State in the Big Ten. Drafting is like recruiting except you don't have to make visits all year long and sit on a million couches to try to get the best guys to play for you - you just need to make your picks well. Most importantly the Patriots don't get more draft picks of a higher quality than the Jets do - at least not until his plan is succeeding.

    For Harbaugh finding the next great thing is much better than sitting in a status quo where he is most likely going down, now or in the near future.
     
    #29 Br4d, Nov 30, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2021
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  10. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    I hate to say this because I'm afraid it's sounds like confirmation bias, but the Jets are a really good landing spot for Harbaugh. As long as the job comes with full control of personnel. But it's no secret he'll be looking for that
     
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  11. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    I think you have to give him full control of everything on the football side, including facilities, marketing of the football operation and players, and of course hiring on that side of the house.

    The reason is that you don't want a single point of friction that could turn into a problem down the road. You want Harbaugh to maintain an even keel and to understand that as long as things are going well he's not going to have any divergent opinions from people he did not hire and maintain hire/fire control over.

    He'd still be in San Francisco and that organization would have done much better over the last 8 years if he and Baalke hadn't gotten into the endless control fight over personnel and strategy.

    You can talk all you want about Shanahan and Lynch but the 49ers have been a lousy franchise since Harbaugh was fired - with one winning season in the last 8.

    I'm trying to figure out as I look at their record how the hell Saleh was a prized catch last season. He was coming out of a dysfunctional organization with one bright point in 2019. Regression to what we are seeing now seems like the more logical conclusion of him joining a last place team.
     
  12. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    Here's yet another angle on the coaching salary thingy. Imagine you're a well-regarded assistant in the NFL and you're traveling around for college pro-days preparing for the draft. You park your Chevy Equinox rental in the parking lot at USC and while you're gathering up a pile of scattered reports and notes, Lincoln Riley pulls in right next to your in his shiny new McLaren. Picture Josh McDaniels standing next to Lincoln watching players run drills. The guy is one of the highest paid assistants and can thread his cock with Super Bowl rings all the way to the tip, but somewhere in the back of his head it must gnaw on him that Lincoln Riley - who doesn't have a single championship to his name - is making three times his salary. Like it or not, money is a measure of worth, and the imbalance must be pretty depressing in the NFL coaching ranks.
     
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  13. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    It has been fun. Cincinnati is joining the Big 12 soon though, so Fickell could just stay put and have a big time job as HC of a Big 12 team

    I like ND, I guess you could say they are one of my favorite college teams, so I have followed Kelly closely. I am a South Carolina alum so I follow the SEC the most. I like Brian Kelly, but LSU seems like a poor fit. I dunno how that's gonna work. Idk, I guess they are hoping he's like Nick Saban, a midwest guy who builds programs anywhere and sustained success will bring in the top recruits. I dont know that Kelly is that guy myself
     
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  14. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    That's why Harbaugh will never be the Jets coach. A general manager (like Joe Douglas) would never bring in Harbaugh to the Jets. That's just asking to be on the wrong side of a power struggle. For him to come here it would have to be a move made by Woody Johnson directly, with promises of lots of money and full power.

    Johnson's ego would never allow him to give full control to anyone. His pocket book is too tight to pay for it, and honestly, a guy like Harbaugh or any established, football first guy, laughs at a nerdy clown like Woody Johnson. They don't want to work for him and since they are established, they don't have to.

    That's why Belichick walked out him. That's why we have to hire coordinators who would take any HC job offer every time
     
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  15. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    I would assume that everybody on the football side is fired and Harbaugh rebuilds the organization from scratch.

    One of the key mistakes the Jets keep making is having a mix of multiple incompetent org charts in each administration.

    Idzik would likely have worked if he had a clean slate at the start. Instead he was living with the remnants of past organizations and guided them into a crash.
     
  16. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I was just going to say. Even if Woody likes the idea of grabbing the headlines with Harbaugh, there’s no way he would force Douglas to cede control to Harbaugh and thus there’s no way he goes somewhere without full control.

    He’ll end up with the Giants or maybe the Bears. The Bears roster and cap situation with Mack is a mess though. Maybe the Vikings move on from Zimmer?
     
  17. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    Two questions:

    First, are you among those ND fans that would take Freeman over Fickell? I work with a guy who sleeps and breathes ND football and he's been saying for months how he was hoping Kelly would retire soon so ND could keep Marcus Freeman.

    Second, as a UGA fan of 40-years, I've always found it hard to hate the Gamecocks. Even when Head Ball Coach was constantly trolling us. Even when Marcus Lattimore was tearing us apart. Not so much in 2019, but I'll overlook that one. My question: your thoughts on Shane Beamer after a year? I liked him when he was at UGA, but I LOVE seeing his raw emotion and the way he interacts with his players. It's about as un-Saban as you can get, but it's real and I can't not admire the guy.


    Edit to add: This post prompted me to think of my favorite Spurrier troll of all time. Better even than when he used to refer to Florida State as "Free Shoes U". Ten or so years ago Spurrier was asked his thoughts on moving back the USC-UGA game later into the season, after a long stretch of early season games. At the time, Georgia always seemed to have players getting into off-season trouble. He replied, "Well, I prefer playing them early in the season when most of their best players are usually still suspended." Had to give the guy credit. That was brilliant.
     
    #37 Sundayjack, Nov 30, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2021
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  18. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    This is really interesting. An admirable thing to do, but I'm not sure how this might fit into the Grand Jim Harbaugh Theory. Maybe to soften the criticism of a potential exit? Or, perhaps just . . . nice.
     
  19. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    I can't answer your 1st question all that well because I'm more of a casual ND fan. Freeman is a rising star though.
    ---

    2nd one I can better speak to. I'm happy with Beamer after his 1st year. Not all SC fans will feel the same. There's this whole thing in the South where they wanna play a certain way. That's why Kiffin is popular and the Tennessee coach is super popular and he hasn't really done shit. Good ole fashioned 20-17 type football games is frowned upon. SEC fans looked at the Big 12 and they really envied the 55-52 wide-open air-raid type games.

    Beamer has started 3 different QBs, including most starts going to a guy who wasn't even on the football team during spring ball. To get bowl eligible in the SEC with a talent level that honestly would struggle to finish atop the Conference USA or the Sun Belt, is a fantastic 1st season in my opinion. Shane Beamer teams will probably always look like his Dad's did - getting the most out of less talent, tough D and special teams leading the way. Lots of 20-17 games

    That's another reason why I don't think Brian Kelly will match expectations at LSU. Those fans are gonna want the wide open air-raid type teams and that's not his M.O. When they have an off year and go 6-6, the fans will ride him out of town
     
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  20. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    I'ma just leave this here.


    ETA: Every day that goes by I'm more convinced - Jim Harbaugh gets a new contract or a new job.
     
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