Fields, Wilson, Jones, Trask, Lance (Volume 3)

Discussion in 'Draft' started by Brook!, Apr 8, 2021.

?

Who would you pick at #2?

  1. Fields

    26.8%
  2. Wilson

    58.8%
  3. Other - Please Explain

    2.1%
  4. Trade Down

    12.4%
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  1. IIMeanDeanII

    IIMeanDeanII Well-Known Member

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    The only two options for me would be...

    Trevor Lawrence or Justin Fields.

    Without a doubt In my mind.
     
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  2. King Koopa

    King Koopa Well-Known Member

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    I may be one of the only ones on here that prefers Fields but is fine/ happy with Wilson.

    Lance is just slightly below them in my rankings, but his upside is right with them.

    Just as long as it isn’t Mac Jones I’ll be happy.
     
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  3. REVISion

    REVISion Well-Known Member

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    This is the crux of the issue for me. People talk about Fields like he has the most upside of any of the QB prospects, I just disagree with that completely.

    Passing effectively is by far the most important thing QB's do. I honestly think Wilson has more upside as a passer than Fields. Wilson throws with more anticipation, he has a stronger arm, he's as accurate if not more accurate, and he throws a lot better on the move. I think their average velocity is about equal.

    A QB who can run as well as Fields is great but I think it's asking for trouble to have your most important player running consistently. With that in mind I'll choose the passer with more upside every time.
     
  4. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    I’ve gone back watched games and cut-ups I can’t get myself excited either. It is what it is. What’s another 3-5 years anyway? It should fly by. We could also be completely wrong that would be great.
     
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  5. patleahy

    patleahy Well-Known Member

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    Legler, I have to give you credit. You are being much more reasonable today, and I appreciate that. :)
     
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  6. ZachMFWilson

    ZachMFWilson Active Member

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    Was it as bad as Burrow’s 2018 film?
     
  7. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Mac Jones as a 1st round pick is crazy. One full season at the most stocked college football team does not a 1st round pick make, particularly a guy who looked like a good game manager doing it.

    Nonetheless, the way the QB fever has panned out we may get 3 guys who shouldn't be in the 1st round taken in the top 10 or so picks.

    It's just crazy.

    BTW, the reason we keep getting questionable QB picks at the top of the draft is that bad teams are doing the drafting.
     
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  8. patleahy

    patleahy Well-Known Member

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    Well-said on all points, Br4d. :);)
     
  9. IIMeanDeanII

    IIMeanDeanII Well-Known Member

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    I think I get what you are trying to convey, however, they aren't the same.

    I didn't watch much of Burrow after he left OSU. I really liked him when he came In and played for OSU though. He had a lot of things I liked about his game then. I didn't watch much Burrow outside of the playoffs though with LSU.

    So I don't have a truly educated comment to give here.
     
  10. IIMeanDeanII

    IIMeanDeanII Well-Known Member

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    This would be a concern If Fields was a below average passer. That wasn't what he displayed on tape In his college career.

    The way you talk about Fields Is If he had the same concerns and limitations as someone like Lamar Jackson coming out of College. I know he turned out just fine going to the Ravens, but, he had a lot of question marks as a passer heading into that draft. Fields Is a far better prospect as a passer than Lamar Jackson was coming out of college.

    There Is literally nothing to suggest that Wilson Is a better passer. The film doesn't show It, the stats don't show It.

    I hope he Is better, If we take him. I just don't think he will be.

    I am fully anticipating the...

    "Well, Fields went to {Insert Team Name Here} and Is doing awesome because of that team, If he was a Jet, no way he Is good!" blah, blah, blah....

    I'm just out here calling my shots.

    Hope everyone Is well. :)
     
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  11. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Lamar Jackson looked fine coming out of Louisville. The only questions I had were whether he would fix his often 3/4's throwing motion and whether he would hold up physically at the NFL level if asked to run as often as seemed likely. The flick throws he made from 3/4's were very accurate and looked great but I thought in the NFL they would likely get batted down more often than you'd like and they'd ultimately put more defenders in the path of the throw leading to more interception chances.

    Of course by the time he got on the field for the Ravens you never saw those throws again. Harbaugh and the Ravens offensive staff had worked them out of his system.
     
  12. K'OB

    K'OB 2021 TGG Fantasy Football Champ

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    You mean he was coached properly?

    Poor Sam, just think what all those draft picks we could have had for trading down could have gotten us.

    Gase or the Johnsons who do you hate most? It is like the ultimate chicken or egg conundrum.
     
  13. abyzmul

    abyzmul R.J. MacReady, 21018 Funniest Member Award Winner

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    I'm not sure what you consider a system fit but 3 years ago Kyle Shanahan was hot and heavy to draft Josh Allen so I think the idea of the guy that brought this system back to the NFL of a system fit might be a bit different from yours.

    https://www.49erswebzone.com/articles/143020-adam-schefter-shares-story-josh-allen-drafted-49ers/

    TBH I see SF picking Lance but maybe I'm just a weirdo.
     
    #2293 abyzmul, Apr 24, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2021
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  14. Rockinz

    Rockinz Well-Known Member

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    I’m in a similar boat. Just switched. I prefer Wilson but would be happy with Fields.

    I think it’s Win Win for the Jets and I’ve been analyzing QBs for a while now.

    it’s really about what flavour of ice cream you want with this pick in my opinion. Both are good kids and clean off the field. Both are competitive gamers on the field. Both are all in on football. The difference is in my opinion that Fields is the superior athlete with his ability to make plays with his feet and Wilson has the superior arm with his quick release and accuracy. That’s not to say that Wilson isn’t a good athlete or that Fields doesn’t have good arm talent because they both do, it’s that they are elite in those aforementioned qualities.

    As a guy who prides himself on analyzing QBs for me I look at that release and footwork Wilson has and it’s really hard not to love it. It’s one of the best throwing motions I’ve ever seen. That mechanic alone is so important when you have to get rid of the ball in under 2 seconds.
     
    #2294 Rockinz, Apr 24, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2021
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  15. Rockinz

    Rockinz Well-Known Member

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    If SF don’t choose Fields after giving Miami a king’s ransom they are fools.

    Giving up 3 first for Mac Jones I just don’t buy it.. maybe Lance but that’s a lot to give up for a kid who played 1 year of division 2 ball and had 1 game last year where he wasn’t very good throwing the football.. I just don’t see it...
     
  16. baalworship

    baalworship Active Member

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    2021 NFL Draft: Pro execs, scouts, coaches break down the QB class
    Published: Apr 22, 2021 at 11:20 AM
    [​IMG]
    Tom Pelissero
    NFL.com Reporter

    "Trevor Lawrence is a really good player," an NFC coordinator said. "I don't know if he's a generational talent like people are saying." Said an AFC quarterbacks coach: "If you didn't take him and you're Jacksonville, and it turned out that he was a perennial Pro Bowler, then you'll never live it down. They have to take him. I think the intangibles are there. He can throw the ball. But he does not have unique, rare playmaking ability. If I'm comparing last year to this year, Joe Burrow (who was drafted first overall by the Bengals) is picked over Trevor Lawrence 100 times out of 100."

    And then there's Wilson's ability to connect with NFL teammates, who surely can get on board with their new QB's edge, boy-band looks and swagger, as long as Wilson's dealing and they're winning games. One executive described it last month as "a little bit of Baker Mayfield syndrome, where you like [the edge] to a point. It's just whether or not you can control it and toe the line." Others compare Zach Wilson to Russell Wilson, a seven-time Pro Bowl pick and Super Bowl champion whose relationship with the Seahawks has become strained after nearly a decade in Seattle, with his personal brand growing beyond football. There's no spotlight like New York, where the Jets own the No. 2 overall pick. If Zach Wilson stays healthy, he has the talent to be a superstar. "If I was picking No. 1 -- hoo, man, it'd be hard for me not to take him over Trevor," an AFC quarterbacks coach said. "He's got real playmaking ability. He's shorter (than Lawrence) -- I get it. But he's got ball all about him. He makes plays -- unique plays."

    "I think you appreciate [Fields' game] more when you see him live, because it's just how he's built. And I think he'll work all f---ing day. But I don't think it's ever been demanded of him from the mental side of the game." Said a coach: "You've got to do your homework, because the fact of the matter is, he's just not being asked to (process) for a lot of things. But you talk to (Ohio State coach) Ryan Day, you talk to those guys out there, they'll tell you he absolutely can. And in the interview, I would tell you yes. There's going to be a learning curve, but I think he can do it, for sure." Several people brought up the struggles of past Ohio State QBs coming from the same system, though as one AFC GM put it: "It's not Fields' fault (Dwayne) Haskins was a [mess]."

    Jones also earned first-team all-America honors, the Davey O'Brien Award as the nation's top QB and an invite to the Senior Bowl, where he had a good week. "Mac's 'Bama tape is really, really good. There's no denying that," a college scouting director said. "But you watch him in Mobile -- this doesn't really feel like a big, big, big-time guy. You trade all that s---, for him?"

    It's a total projection on Lance, who has NFL size (6-3 7/8, 224), arm strength and athletic ability, but started just 17 games against lesser competition in the Missouri Valley Football Conference, operating a run-first offense for a team that has won eight of the last nine FCS championships. "If you're making the argument for him, you can put a tape together and say, 'Wow, look at this!' " an AFC quarterbacks coach said.

    https://www.nfl.com/news/2021-nfl-draft-pro-execs-scouts-coaches-break-down-the-qb-class
     
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  17. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    It’s definitely a flavor thing. However, I’m not in the win win category. I truly see superstar potential with Fields that I don’t see with Wilson.

    With regards to Wilson having a superior arm, I’d say he has the edge in release speed only, not arm strength and accuracy. Athletically and as far as frame they are not close.

    Outside of a couple uncharacteristic bonehead plays against Indiana, Fields rarely puts it in harms way. Conversely, Wilson takes wild chances. Some like that; I prefer a QB that values the football.
     
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  18. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    Mahomes didn’t need it. It probably would have helped Darnold and Sanchez but when it comes down to it, they weren’t as good as their draft status
     
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  19. abyzmul

    abyzmul R.J. MacReady, 21018 Funniest Member Award Winner

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    I think he would have been successful with or without the year on the bench but I wonder if he'd be this good right now without it.
     
  20. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    I don’t know and not sure it’s relevant considering the vastly different type of college offenses they were running. Herbert was running some version of the Spread. Fields offense is designed to have him hold on to the ball. You are welcome to find out if it’s of value to use.

    I just wanted to throw some water on the panicky under pressure narrative. Herbert got that same label based on PFF numbers. Then he turns around and crushes in that department in the pros.

    https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2020-nfl-draft-biggest-pro-con-every-top-quarterback-prospect

     
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