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Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by AJW, Sep 12, 2021.
Lets give him more than 1 game before calling for his head that we lost by 4 points.
NO. We have to overreact NOW!
Been thinking about this more. I’m thinking he’s not there physically. I noticed this last year, while he seems to get open when he’s out there. Which…is a pretty dope superpower, because in the Carolina game the defenders seem to have not seen him. When he catches the ball, he just doesn’t seem that fast. Idk…I feel like if he was faster, he would’ve had a TD.
On paper, he’s fast. But when he catches the ball he just doesn’t seem fast. This factor may make him a situational receiver.
I'm not calling for his head after one game, so let's not misquote and mischaracterize what I posted!!!!
Look at the reception again. He had to slow down/stop for the ball, and there was a defender right there that shielded him somewhat, and he bobbled the ball momentarily. He then turned to start running, but another defender was right there.
He looked completely lost.
My dad and I said the same shit watching it. We both yelled "what the fuck are you doing?!"
Good article on Mims. Seems the playbook and routes are likely keeping him off the field.
I'm willing to defer to the coaching staff for now. If they think his grasp of the playbook is such a detriment to the team, than he should not be seeing the field.
Having said that, he played two snaps, and one of them was a 40 yard reception. The coaching staff needs to be pretty certain that he can't contribute, because that is a big potential playmaker occupying the bench. Zach could use all the weapons the Jets can give him.
Don't let perfect be the opposite of good here. If the man can contribute, let him contribute.
You really expect Joe and Saleh to turn this team around in 2 years? No disrespect but you're a fool if you feel that way. How long did it take Walt Michael's to make the playoffs? I rest my case.
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He was never a catch and run player in college nor was he shifty. He was/is a tall long strider that needs to run down field and past receivers. Not a particularly great leaper either although the hope was that he would be able to jump and out-compete players for the ball as he grew into his role.
Someone else thinks he needs to be more involved.
Our offense needs someone to stretch the field vertically, the burning question is why can't Mims do it? It really doesn't make any sense to me.
The problem is that Moore can do that too and he also does other things better than Mims. There's not really a burning need for Mims to be on the field.
I think you need to read the article I posted above.
This seems to be much deeper than just not playing him. If that article is correct, he would be hurting this team if he sees a lot of playing time, simply because his understanding of the play book is just not fully there yet
Where did I say I expected him to turn the team around in 2 years? You can't show me where I did, because I didn't say it!!! I said that within a couple of years he could be pickier about his schemes and only playing players who are ideal fits for the scheme. I said nothing about the team being turned around.
I swear the reading comprehension of some on this board is abysmal. 1/3 of the board is so effing busy trying to find fault with what others's say (or maybe it's just me they're busy trying to find fault with) and reading between the lines, that they can't see what's there in black and white.
Thanks for posting the article. It highlights all the more why the requirement for Mims to have to learn all 3 WR positions is freaking stupid. He is NOT a slot WR. It's a dumbass arbitrary decision. He's a player that can help this team. Why isn't Miles Austin working with him night and day to get him up to speed??? I didn't realize it but according to the Twitter link I posted, it's the position coach who determines what the rotation is and who plays. So Miles Austin ought to be catching more heat, but unless having to learn all 3 WR positions is an Austin requirement and Saleh is just backing his position coach up, Saleh and/or LaFleur need to wise up in imo and do away with that dumb fucking rule. It makes sense for both Moore and Berrios, because they are more slot and #2 WR types anyway. It makes zero sense for Mims, who is a #1 or at worst a #2 type WR. It's bad enough that he ran a limited route tree in college, lost alot of practice time last year due to no OTAs or mini-camp, and then injury. Then he missed the key portion of OTAs this year with food poisoning. They ought to be doing everything possible to get him on the field instead of adding arbitrary requirements that only serve to keep him off the field.
The stupidity of football coaches never ceases to amaze me.
Yes, I think this puts in perspective nicely.
EDIT: To put a finer point on it, if Mims is out there and runs the wrong route - say a READ route where he's supposed to break a certain way, and Zach is counting on him to do that, this could easily result in an INT. The QB has to know where the receiver is going to be, especiallywhen he's under such immediate pressure.
I think the comment about having to learn all 3 positions is just smoke to cover up the fact that Mims is struggling with the basics of his own position.
That said, I think they ought to be able to get him into the game a few more snaps than just 2.
I disagree that he looked lost, but if he did, it's little wonder, since he gets so few reps and never gets on the field.
INTERESTING from Jets X Factor
The real reason Denzel Mims is buried on the New York Jets’ depth chart
Denzel Mims' predicament on the New York Jets' depth chart is not difficult to understand when you analyze the entirety of the situation.
Denzel Mims, Robert Saleh, NY Jets, Getty Images, Jet X Graphic
Why aren’t the New York Jets using Denzel Mims more?
Denzel Mims is the most controversial player on the New York Jets’ roster right now.
A second-round pick just a year ago, Mims only played three offensive snaps against the Panthers in Week 1 despite the absences of Jamison Crowder and Keelan Cole.
Three snaps were all Mims needed to record the longest reception of the day for the Jets, a 40-yard bomb down the left sideline from Zach Wilson in the fourth quarter to set up New York at the Carolina 10-yard line.
With Mims seemingly producing as soon as he got on the field, many fans have been questioning why he wasn’t playing more to start with.
According to head coach Robert Saleh during his Monday presser, via the New York Jets public relations transcript, Mims was on the bench because he is still learning the playbook.
“When you’re not one of the main three (wide receivers) you got to know all three spots, and you got to know them at a high level so you can step in and take advantage of all those opportunities.”
Mims has been more or less playing catch-up his entire Jets career.
He missed time in his rookie training camp with a hamstring injury. Then, he injured his other hamstring before Week 1, which landed him on injured reserve. Mims returned for the final nine games of the year and caught 23 passes for 357 yards, flashing his potential as a boundary threat but never dominating on the stat sheet consistently.
The 2021 offseason brought more of the same troubles with Mims missing time in OTAs and minicamp due to food poisoning.
Apart from the illness, Mims was and is learning his second offensive scheme in as many years.
Coming out of Baylor, Mims ran a limited route tree as a boundary receiver and primarily won with athletic talent rather than precise route-running. Winning with pure athleticism is not a bad thing, but in the pros—where everyone is athletic—technique is vital to consistently succeed.
Mims had a lot to learn.
The Jets’ new offense, under offensive coordinator Mike LaFleur, is derived from Kyle Shanahan’s San Francisco 49ers offense. The Shanahan offense is known for its ability to maximize the players within it.
However, while beneficial in the end, the Shanahan offense is also incredibly complicated to learn, especially for wideouts.
Most routes in the playbook have multiple variations or adjustments. Defensive looks pre-snap, post-snap rotations, coverage indicators, and even the receiver’s own split all affect how the routes are run.
To further explain how complicated the offense is, here are a few routes from the 2018 49ers route tree:
In this scheme, even a simple quick-out is finely detailed. This is an “Omaha” route, a five-yard quick-out made famous by Peyton Manning.
Like most routes in the Niners’ offense, alignment and coverage can change the route entirely.
If the corner is in a cloud zone, the route converts to a sideline fade. If the corner is pressing, the route stays the same. When the receiver is outside the numbers, he runs a square cut on the break. When he’s inside the numbers, it becomes a speed cut.
Here’s an “Attack” route, an inside curl designed to, fittingly, attack the MIKE linebacker. The receiver will change his break depending on the MIKE’s coverage responsibility. Against Tampa 2, the receiver will “replace” the MIKE, filling the void left by the Mike dropping deep.
If it isn’t Tampa 2, the receiver works between the hashes to find a spot between zones. If it’s man coverage, the receiver breaks back outside away from the leverage of the defender.
The receiver and quarterback don’t know how the route will be run until after the ball is snapped. If they aren’t on the same page, or if the receiver makes the wrong choice, it can and will lead to interceptions.
Finally, we have a trio of routes all based on a “Read” route. It’s called a “Read” route because the receiver has to read the safety down the field and break based on the safety’s leverage.
If the safety is flat-footed, the receiver continues vertical and tries to run past him. If the safety is backing up, the receiver converts the route to a deep curl before looking back for the ball. Like before, the route is undecided until after the snap, and an incorrect read can ruin the play entirely.
The next two routes are adjustments of the “Read” – “Read Out” and a “Read Takeoff.”
The “Read Out” looks just like a regular “Read” for the first 15 yards, but instead of reading the safety, the receiver rolls to a deep-out at 25 yards.
A “Read Takeoff” is more of the same, but the receiver never stops to actually read any defenders, they simply get vertical.
Both routes are designed to look like a normal “Read,” so it’s imperative that the receiver makes all three look identical for the first 15 yards. If not, the defense won’t be fooled.
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Denzel Mims just needs time
Considering Denzel Mims’s situation, missed practice time and an underdeveloped route tree, it’s not surprising to hear that he’s still learning.
Mims is not a bad player and his stunted growth shouldn’t be a reason to cast him aside entirely. That said, if he doesn’t know the intricacies of the plays, it’s risky for the offense to have him on the field excessively. An incorrect read could lead to a busted play, or worse, a turnover.
The best thing for Mims and the offense as a whole is to ease him along slowly while he irons out the kinks.
It’s a long season, even longer than usual with the new 17th game. Do not start pushing the panic button on Mims. There is plenty of time for him to learn and start producing at the rate he is capable of.
Mims’s current status as “behind” should not fully be viewed as an indictment; it’s instead an understandable outcome based on his circumstances.
Trust the coaches, and more importantly, trust the system. The Shanahan offense has been proven time and time again across the NFL for decades. It may look basic on the surface, but that’s the point.
The devil is truly in the details.
Mims will grow in time and will start seeing the field more and more as he learns. Patience is a virtue, one many Jets fans understandably lack; but when it comes to Mims, patience truly is key.