A Proposal Alternative for Onside kick

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by BudJet, May 22, 2020.

  1. BudJet

    BudJet Well-Known Member

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    Their rules change would provide an alternative to an onside kick and “allow the team that is trailing in the game a way to maintain possession after scoring by successfully converting a fourth-and-15 play from its own 25-yard line. That could be done a maximum of twice per game.”

    I think it would make the game interesting. The onside kick is becoming obsolete with the new line up rule....one yard from line of scrimmage.
     
  2. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I totally disagree. What's exciting about it? The offensive team has practically no chance to convert a 4th and 15 play that deep in their own territory. It's one more step of taking Special Teams out of the game, which is stupid. That third unit is what can make a big difference between teams and give some teams a chance to win that might not have a chance otherwise.

    I wish the damn NFL would quit fucking around with the rules. This shit makes me mad. They're ruining the game. The onside kick is exciting and a part of the game. How does it help a team to get a chance to convert a 4th and 15 from its 25 yard line? If they don't convert, their opponent is practically in the red zone and in scoring position, and that makes it worse, not better. At least on an onside kick, the ball is out around the 45-50 yard line. Change the stupid fucking rule that they have to line up one yard off of the LOS, and leave it the way it was.

    Those idiots are ruining the game. If the game is that unsafe with Special Teams play, just fold the damn league and call it quits.
     
  3. GasedAndConfused

    GasedAndConfused Well-Known Member

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    onside kicks have virtually 0 chance as well. at least this way there is less chance for injury and you get to watch a QB chuck it up so why not?
    could see more plays like this
     
  4. MaximusD163

    MaximusD163 Well-Known Member

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    I’m not sure about this one. It’s true that the onside kick is too unlikely to succeed. To me somehow slightly varying it to get about a 25% success rate would be better... I can’t say I have a suggestion of how to accomplish that though.

    This improves the chances, which is a positive, but I do prefer the most exciting special teams play (aside from a game winning FG) not be lost from the game. I understand the injury risk. It’s the only play where you have 22 men all sprinting at each other, most of whom are looking for the ball instead of where they are going.
     
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  5. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    Under the current rules onside has a 10% success rate. Even if they could double that it maybe worth it. 4th and 15 would seem like less if a success chance. I think you are right. Find a way to make inside kicks more successful rather than take them out completely.
     
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  6. Noam

    Noam Well-Known Member

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    I did a quick search out of curiosity to see if anyone had odds. Football outsiders said the odds of converting a 4th and 15 is 12.5 percent but a 4th and 12 is 33 percent. Both seem much higher than I would have thought.
     
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  7. azhar80

    azhar80 Active Member

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    This would make the Pass Int call even more important. We already know they're taking out the review for P.I, I wonder why?

    I think XFL has influenced the NFL to be more creative. I personally like the inside kick ‍but I'm sure the players would like to get rid of special teams due to the increase chance of injury.
     
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  8. NYJFOREVER

    NYJFOREVER Well-Known Member

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    I like this but I can totally see the Jets losing a game because of a bogus holding call on a 4th and 15.

    Maybe it’ll be during a win and in game. That’d be the most Jets thing ever.
     
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  9. ConcordeChops

    ConcordeChops 2018 International Poster Award Winner

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    Against the Giants.
     
  10. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    That might be due to how few times a 4th down and that long is attempted. If they implement this rule - which I'm totally opposed to BTW - the number of attempts would rise significantly, and I believe that precentage will drop as a result.
     
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  11. James Hasty

    James Hasty Well-Known Member

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    Don't like the change at all. The Saints surprise onside kick against the Colts on the SB is reason enough to keep it as it is.
     
  12. twown

    twown Well-Known Member

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    I was torn about this proposal for a while, but in the final analysis I think it's probably a good idea. Let's look at how teams are forced to try to come back when losing at the end of the game in the four major sports. Best to worst.

    1. MLB. No time limit. As long as you don't make the third out, your team can come back. This is 100% pure and ideal.

    2. NHL. Pull the goalie. This is exciting and also perfectly within the spirit of the game. Big risk, exciting finish.

    3. NFL. Onside kick. Now we're slipping. The problem is that it's not really in the spirit of the game. At least a Hail Mary is actual football. The onside kick is more like a roulette spin. It's also unduly dangerous. But at least it's fun! And while it's not really football, at least it's not a bizarro backward version of football. Which brings us to...

    4. NBA. Personal take fouls. UGH. This is a disgrace. Spend all game trying to play good defense, and then start intentionally fouling at the end so you can hope for misses and hoist wild threes. This is not just against the spirit of the game, it's a downright perversion of the game. Ugly, tedious, and no fun at all.

    So imo, I'd like to see the NFL try the new proposal. We all grew up with the onside kick so we consider it family, but when you really think about it, it's sort of a gimmick. The new rule would require an actual football play, and there's something to be said for that.

    (And the NBA needs to move to the Elam Ending ASAP. )

    (edit for James Hasty above: You could even put the new proposal in but leave the onside kick as an option except in the waning minutes of the game. That way you preserve the surprise onside kick but eliminate the injury risk and roulette spin nature of the end-of-game onside kick.)
     
    #12 twown, May 22, 2020
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
  13. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Why would it make the Pass Interference call more important? Sorry, but I don't follow you. Please elaborate.

    Don't forget that a number of players on every team are only there because they play STs. If they did away with STs altogether, the roster would probably come down to around 44-48 players and a lot more players would be unemployed.
     
  14. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. How is an onside kick not in the spirit of the game? Please explain a Hail Mary is actual football, but an onside kick is not. Maybe I'm too dumb to understand, but I see nothing rational or logical there.
     
  15. twown

    twown Well-Known Member

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    i hear you. But to me the Hail Mary is more like pulling the goalie while the onside kick is a gimmick. I don't hate the onside kick. It's fun. But it doesn't look like anything else in football. The kicker either squibs it right and it's a free-for-all, or he doesn't and it's a dud.

    Meanwhile the Hail Mary is a perfectly natural-looking football play. Your offense is on the field with the ball needing to score in the last seconds. Throw laterals or chuck it long. In other words, play football.

    Imagine for a moment that there was no onside kick, and there was also a rule that you couldn't pass the ball more than 30 yards downfield.

    Now imagine they suddenly create the onside kick and legalize long passes.

    I think public reaction to these rule changes would be very different. For long passes we'd be like, "This is awesome! What took them so long?" For the onside kick we'd be like, "WTF is this silliness?"
     
    #15 twown, May 22, 2020
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
  16. LeonNYJ

    LeonNYJ Well-Known Member

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    How about we just have kickers try a 65 yard field goal? If they make it, you get the ball back.
     
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  17. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    And 3 points?
     
  18. azhar80

    azhar80 Active Member

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    Pass interference penalty is important because on 4th & 15 you get a pass interference call, you get a first, and if the penalty was dubious you cant challenge anymore. All it takes is a ref to take a bad angle on a pass, and instead of a incomplete/game over, you get a 1st and 10 and a possible loss.
     
  19. azhar80

    azhar80 Active Member

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    How is onside kick not part of the spirit of the game, and fgs, and punts are. Because they are special teams?
     
  20. matt robinson 17

    matt robinson 17 Well-Known Member

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    I would steal the Xfl's kickoff, like the nba stole the aba's 3 pt shot, 96% of kickoffs were returned in the Xfl and safely
     

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