Cool..glad no hard feelings. I completly understand your point of view as far as wanting something huge for one of your best players. I just hope it gets done with whats fair to both teams.:finssuck: :deadskins: ats_suck: :eaglessuck:
Hey man I like the Jets and I like talking to other fans around the league. I think most of us that have come over here are rational good people. So are most of you guys.
Now that I am totally cool with. See, I think that's where the problem lies. It's a matter of perception on what "fair value" is. We know our guy, and we honestly believe he is worth more than even just the #15 pick. Honestly, my opinion is that Abe is worth your second rounder this year, plus your first rounder next year. I truly think that is the most even trade possible. Though it would be a bit of a fleece to us, it would be acceptable if our FO accepted your second round both this year and next. You get the better end of the deal, but we get the chance to trade up this year if we choose, and again next year if we choose to pursue Quinn. I would have been happy with Schaub and the second rounder this year as well, but I can totally understand the Falcons' position on not pulling that trigger. I know these sound like a lot, but trust me when I say you will not regret it when Abe makes a huge impact on your defense. He is truly that type of player. Not many guys can change a game on their own. Abe can.
Well dude to be totally honest I pull the trigger on Schaub for JA right away. I also pull the trigger on this years second and next years second in a heartbeat. Hes a impact player and that is expensive stuff.
I'm glad you see the value there. I don't think the Jets get full value with the two second rounders, but with the right moves, it could be better for the team than the 31, if that is all the Hawks are giving. The Schaub deal I would take in a heartbeat.
Nice post dude, never really took the time to read this thread until now. Excellent information you passed along.
Please disregard the "Atlanta" Fans who say they would gladly give up Schaub straight up for Abe. These aren't true Atlanta Fans, but Vick fans. They have a playstation mentality that excludes common sense. The Bottom line here is we are dealing in property values, just like real estate...The Jets want to move their house, as they are tired of the location. Once the Jets decided to move, there is no financial sense in going back to the property. Therefore the property has been devalued by the seller.The Jets and their fans may like to fool themselves into thinking that they could just retain the property, but that won't happen. Now that one of the two people in the bidding war has decided to invest in some other expensive property, the Jets are stuck. They will save face by accepting a throw-in pick (probably a 3 this year or next year, or a throw in player...TJ Duckett.)...all will be ok and the deal will be done by the middle of the week....
NEVER HAPPEN!!!I don't think Abraham has a snowballs chance in hell of playing in Atlanta if you don''t give up the 1st rounder.We will move on to to other suitors and Abe will settle for a lesser contract from another club the longer this drags out.You won't touch Abe for what you're currently offering and there will come a point in time when the Jets front office is going to pull Abe off the table with Atlanta,just watch and learn.Then Abe's sphincter will tighten and he will realize that he messed up and will eventually agree to go elsewhere.
Read hydro's post titled Jets News 3/21. In it, there is an article that explicitly states that the Jets would rather keep Abe another year, rather than give him up for ANYTHING LESS THAN A FIRST ROUNDER. You aren't dealing with Hermway here guys. This is the TANGINI!
Sorry sir thats not its going to work... 1st rounder or nothing just that simple. If ATL doesn't budge we'll keep our chips and walk away from the table. Better yet we'll be back next year asking for the same thing for what will a 28 yr old RE. We want and will only accept a first rounder. Oh and Abe can't be a TO when the coach won't let him
All this apocalytic talk about what happens if Abe stays with us next year is pretty funny. I'm a Abe fan so I actually would embrace that version of doomsday. Jet and Atlanta fans have gotta stop comparing Abe to TO because there is no comparison. If he was anything like TO we'd be takin' Atls 7th rounder and thanking god we got that much. Think about it, what did TO do to get deactivated? He threw everyone in sight under the bus. Now, when was the last time Abe said anything about anybody on his team? Never (and correct me if I'm wrong). Does he say anything about Ellis, a guy who plays the same position and is arguably the lesser player who the Jets took care of? No. They talk about each other like they're best friends. How about Dewayne? For whatever it's worth, Herm and Donnie very publically said they needed Abe back at the end of last season. Sound like TO? If Abe signs the tender and he comes back next year do you know what's gonna happen? same as last year. He's gonna be pissed and then he'll go and put up the numbers. If you gonna label every player unhappy with his contract or the city they're playing in another TO we might as well shut the league down now. As far as riding the bench, the only time I can remember a club maliciously benching a player like that was the Raiders and Marcus Allen, and that was because of that psycho Al Davis. Coaches kinda want to win, their livelihoods kinda depend on it. And as far as Abe not being a fit in a 3-4 defense, who cares? Watch the Patriots play. They'll play 3-4, 4-3, 8 dbs and 3 DLs, they'll throw everything but the kitchen sink. The genius of Belicheck and hopefully Mangini is they find roles for everybody on the roster. They utilize what they have and Abe is an asset. Who knows, maybe we'll use Abe in goaline next year on offense, catching touchdowns. If Mangini could find snaps for Dan Klecko last year than maybe, just maybe, he can draw up a play or two for Abe.
As I said elsewhere; I think our FO made a small tactical error by agreeing to principal terms with Seattle for the #31 pick. Having done that, ther is absolutely no way the Falcons are going to give us their #15 pick for Abe. We can completely remove it form the table. So now it comes down to the Flacons second round pick plus a possible player. I don;t think the Falcons will go a 2nd and their 3rd rounder - very doubtful. Their 2nd and their 4th, maybe. I personally want Abe off the books. He has become a royal pain in the ass. We have too many things to work on right now. We do not need any distractions. I think Abe will be gone for sure. I can not see us paying Abe 8.3 million to ride the bench - huge waste of money. If we hit him with a 4 game suspension for holding out of training camp we would save a couple of million there, but the guy would be a total jackass TO at that point and we should just say to him, "stay home; the check is in the mail."
If Abe doesnt sign the franchise tender then he makes nothing this year and doesnt play. At this level, players are addicted to those millions of dollars as well as the game. No way will he sit out this year. If the Jets cant get proper compensation for him, he will sign that tender and then report to the team the very last day possible as he did last year.
Hornet, I don't think there was any tactical error. The Jets have a baseline of compensation they are willing to receive. BUT, they are also trying to maximize their return. While agreeing to the #31 overall, (which we don't really know 100%, all we know is that #31 was part of the deal), this satisfies the 'minimum compensation' aspect, but not necessarily the 'maximizing compensation' aspect. I think that the Jets will be willing to receive a deal that offers value *in between* #15 overall and #31 overall, BUT, that deal will include a first rounder, either this year or next year. I'd still do Abe and our 3rd round pick for #15 overall as a last resort, or a 2nd rounder this year and a 1st next year. Those are both deals that I'd rather do than hold onto Abraham for 06. BUT, I'd rather hold onto Abraham than take ATL's 2nd and 3rd rd picks this year, let alone just their 2nd rounder. Also, ATL fans seem to think that the value at #31 is closer to the value at #47 (their 2nd round pick) than #15 overall (their 1st round pick). I think they are wrong. Jabba and others have discussed this a lot on other Abraham threads.
Agreeing to principal terms with Seattle for a #31 sets a datum. I can see why the Falcons are reluctant to cross that line. If Seattle's terms were for a #31 plus some other round pick or 2007 pick that is a different story. I haven't heard anything other than the #31. I think more would have come out by now if there was more to it other than that. I have read many other threads on Abraham valuation. I can't completely agree with all of it. The bar is set at the #31 pick- done. The Falcons will not cross that valuation line; just won't happen. I just don't want this to drag out much longer. I want us to move past Abraham. The Falcons have to throw something else on the table besides their 2nd round pick for this deal to get done; that's the bottom line.
If he's worth the #15 pick then why are the Jets settling for the #31 pick? Admitting that limited thier bargaining ability. Had they never agreed with Seattle then this may all be a moot point but if I'm Atlanta and the player I covet is worth a #31 pick then why would I come off of my #15?
