Brock Bowers - Olu Fashanu Discussion

AVT isn't a wasted resource in a vacuum, but trading up for him definitely was. The Vikings drafted a good OT with the first round pick we traded to them, and we could've drafted two more OL with the 3rd round picks we also traded away for AVT.

 

If your point is we should not have not traded up I agree, but to call them wasted resources is laughable. Furthermore, injuries happen across the board no matter what round you select. So forecasting that as a reason with after the fact unforeseen injuries is laughable even more. Go look across the league how many top OL are lost for the season every year. That has zero all to do with who you select.

 

AVT is also severely overhyped here as well. Injuries aside, he’s a quality guard and a good pass blocker. But first round guards need to be Zach Martin or Quentin Nelson and true game changing road graders in the ground game.

QB matters and all that jazz but he hasn’t exactly been a body mover in the ground even when he was on the field. Hopefully he makes me eat my words.

 

I'm confused here. What was wrong with drafting Tippman? The Jets used their own pick, so they didn't trade for him, and he was taken with the 43rd pick. Certainly not too high.

By this logic, wouldn't taking a TE at 13 be a huge waste of resources as well?

 

Ok so that makes sense. Draft a bad player = waste of resources. Draft a good player = Not a waste.

For the record, while I dont agree about Tippman or Fashanu, I definitely agree about AVT. Trading up for a slightly above average OG was definitely not the right call.

 

here's an article from last year laying out how Hall's stats improve when he has AVT out there:
https://jetsxfactor.com/2023/12/22/ny-jets-breece-hall-top-rb-2023/

AVT is clearly not on the level of Nelson or Martin but I wouldn't call him "overhyped"

 

The trade up can certainly be debated, but let's not go that far. Vikings ended up with 1 starter and two other picks washed out. So, it's definitely not 3 starters. That one starter is a damn good one though.

 

If you spend a 1st rounder and two 3rd rounders on OL, you are statistically likely to get 2 starters, with a decent chance of getting 3. No matter how we slice it, the trade up was a bad idea.

 

I think he’s a good player. Jets fans talk about him like he’s an All-Pro All-World guard. I just think it’s a mischaracterization regardless if he got hurt or not.

 

All I'll say is, "There's a REASON every coach that has ever coached a good football team talks about starting on the lines, both O and D, and working their way out." It all begins there. Period. No if's, and's or buts. Period. PERIOD!! There really is NO discussion nor philosophy that doesn't start with those two groups of people when it comes to an NFL football team. That's a fact.

 

Any good defense will expose the weakest link on an OLine.

You can not hide anyone at guard or center lol.

 

That’s not really true. The 49ers and Rams have been doing it for half a decade. The Seahawks to an extent as well haven’t had much in the way of good guard play for some time. Packers as well.

It’s a lot easier to hide a guard or center than it is a tackle.

 

Laken Tomlinson is an example we have seen firsthand. Dude sucked but they hid him for years on that 9ers line.

 

Didn't AVT fill in at tackle for a bit?

 

Yes and did quite well.

 

It really is, but I think down the line it will also feel like "hey we drafted this Hackenberg kid, we probably shouldn't take a chance on Mahomes in the first".