I second this--OP says "he's really great" when he's on? Anyone can look good on 1 play and I have to say, I don't think ZW even made 1 excellent play throwing the ball yet. I talking about a sideline throw where he drops it in or something. Total BS to say there's any time "he's really great". I have no idea what you watched but your conclusions are based on something other than reality IMO..
Outstanding evaluation, thank you for going back and watching all - that's a lot of pain to go through! For me things are simple too - Zach just feels a like a raw prospect, not ready for NFL. We cannot go back in time to change that #2 pick, what's done is done, so you need to forget where he was drafted and deal with 23 year old young guy, who is trying to figure things out. Quite a few QBs who will be drafted mid round or higher this year are actually same age or older than 23. That's why I think he will be on the roster next year, pending a collapse during training camp/preseason. Much like Mike White was at the same age. And when it is time next year to trim to 53 man roster, if the Jets don't think he is good enough to be 3d stringer, he may get cut or traded for peanuts at that time. Chances are he will likely be good enough to be a 3d stringer and will remain on the roster as the 3d guy. On Mike, I agree, the jury is still out. I was very impressed by his 3 games thus far though based on tape. And even stat wise, the big thing was that we outgained every team we played, including two 12 win teams (with 2 games to go) on the road. even the home game was in pretty bad conditions for a QB and he still played well. I know he could have scored more TDs in these road games, but the sample size is too small to account for special teams that gave him poor position, for brutal drops in the end zone and within 5 yard line, clear PIs not called, fumble in the red zone by a RB, etc... That should even out over time, but the eye test tells me there was a lot of good there. Total yardage is more indicative in a smaller sample size, because even over 3 games there is a relatively large number of possessions. And Mike was able to get yards. Looking forward to next few games to determine whether we should resign him long term to be our starting QB in 2023.
Yeah, I agree with all of that. What I mean is there are many examples where Zach does do the right thing. He looks at the right spots, he goes through each progression, he makes the right throw, etc. It makes me believe he knows what to do, his mind just can't do it consistent enough. I kept believing that was fixable, but now I am unsure. Great points. I am excited for the final 2 games and also what the Jets decide to do with the QB position this off-season. Very interesting situation.
The QB situation is only complicated because they don’t have it solved. One of the following will be the QB next year: Carr Garrapolo Minshew Rodgers I don’t see it being Minshew solely because I don’t think Douglas and Saleh will bet the rest of their Jets career on Minshew. Carr and Rodgers make the most sense, if Rodgers is made available. Garrapolo is interesting. I’d be content going into a QB room in 2023 with Garrapolo/White/Developmental QB pick
I haven't seen one reason that Mike White couldn't be the starter in '23. He's performed well on the field and seems to have the locker room behind him. These next two games (or more) will determine White's future with the NY Jets.
I think it’s more so having security for him. He hasn’t been able to stay healthy. I’d like for him to add more weight to his frame, he has the room for it and it will help keep him healthy. He operates pretty well in the Shanahan system the Jets have. No reason to think he can’t work.
Good points on Zach being thrown into the starting job too soon. Where we disagree is that I don't think the best is to part ways. I want to offer Malik Willis as an example. He was drafted in the 3d round, and some were saying could have easily gone second round depending on how the board feel. The point is, that's a second day valuable pick. Also played in Independent conference, not P5, not great competition in College. He just played 3 games games after learning for majority of the season and honestly compared to him Zach looks like Mahomes. So, what do the Titans do? They see he is not ready and they shut him down. Will Malik ever be good? Probably not, because most 3d round picks aren't, but I highly doubt Titans will be moving on already. And here is the kicker: Malik spent 5 years in College compared to 3 that Zach spent, and is older than Zach. We already spend the 2nd overall pick and the vast majority of the money, this is sunk cost. It's done, you can't get it back no matter what. Evaluate based on the current conditions. Zach is a Malik Willis now. So there is no need to move on or get some poor value in return. Continue developing the kid, as Titans would do Malik, and see what he has next year. Not as a starter, but as a 3d string guy, maybe a 2nd depending on what he shows in training camp and preseason.
Jimmy G seems redundant with Mike White at this point in their career. I’d rather go with White, maybe grab another vet and keep Zach around. The thing of trying to shoe horn him into the starting role may be his downfall here. He just may need more time then he will get in a Kets uniform. He seems more raw of a prospect then any of the previous QB’s that have come here.
I have no objection to him staying here and trying to achieve his potential, which I still believe is very high. I just don't know if he ca do that with all that's happened. And while I don't believe the majority of fans are against him, there is certainly a very vocal and sizable minority who are, and who won't cut him any slack. IMO Douglas will want to keep him and hope he turns into the player he drafted, but if he got a good offer for him I think he'd send him away. I don't think he will get a good offer for him though and so I think he stays as QB#3. In that case, ideally, I hope they can get a vet QB who is proven and who Zach and watch and learn from. Sure, he can learn some things from MW, but they're skill sets are different - MW is a pocket QB, Zach is more mobile. Doesn't mean Zach can't learn from Mike, but I think he would learn more from someone with more proven experience. One way or the other though, Douglas needs to solve this problem.
Do we really know that yet? I wont argue that his lack of mobility brings the potential for injury but He missed one game smashing his hand on a dudes helmet last season (correct me if I'm wrong on that one, dont really remember the MOI) and 2 games this year after being folded in half like a deer getting hit by a F-150. Zach missed 4 games due to injury both his seasons so far... obviously if they plan on making him "the guy" some longterm term building plans need to modify to "maxprotect" we'll see what happens these next 2 games; he's on audition....
One of the things that I think the Jets have screwed upon in development of Sanchez, Darnold, and Wilson is getting them to a point where they just think too much. I think Wilson second guesses everything, freezes and throws late or doesn’t throw, does throw but footwork Is wrong. These QBs need to be able to take chances and learn from it. They need to think presnap, then just react.
Zach has durability issues as well, but this guy just strikes me as fragile. Hopefully I'm wrong. I just don't want them locking into a contract and we end up watching him spend a year and a half on IR. Chad was enough of that ezperience.
Yeah, 2023 is a little more complicated. So many possiblities. I am just saying it is not complicated to sit Zach and start Mike now that he is healthy. You could argue making Zach the #2 QB, but it is a lose-lose situation with him or Flacco at the moment. As for 2023, I like those options you listed.
All the things in bold are saying the same thing (as the 1st thing) He can do the 4th and 19 better than he can do 1-10. I feel like the CS saw the flaws and strengths and found the best QB guru in the game to teach the easy stuff…. Fate said “fuck you jets”. If White plays well I wouldn’t be surprised if they get a 2 or 3 year reasonable contract with him, keep ZW to see if he can figure out the easy part, and draft a QB in the 3rd/4th, someone who they like but later rounds = non threatening. White goes into the season as assumed starter but there’s a competition. * Alternate reality, Woody steps in and get$$$ TB12 and S Payton to lead us to the promised land.
Yeah, that is definitely my worry with Mike White. He played great against the Bengals and Bears. Okay against the Vikings. Injured against the Colts and Bills. Terrible against the Bills last year. It is an odd resume and certainly not one to give a big multi-year contract to. However, if you add wins against the Seahawks and Dolphins to make the playoffs, I think we can talk.
Pour money and picks into the OLine to mitigate the risk. White has proven he can throw 300+ yds consistently.
I've never thought this about any other pro quarterback ever. But this guy I think might actually benefit from a year actually playing, not sitting, in the minor leagues. I think he needs "live combat" reps where the stakes aren't as high as an NFL game to make some correct decisions, gain confidence, and then make the correct decisions quicker. If you call that "seeing the field" or whatever the correct term is this kid needs it. I see that ugly combination of paralysis by analysis, waiting half a heartbeat too long and the guy isn't open anymore, deciding beyond the last minute to throw to the short guy and then just blowing the throw like a 4th grader, start backpedaling and mechanics fall apart. ALL of that shit comes from the fact that he isn't analyzing what is in front of him and making quick confident decisions. And you would think if anything is going to fix that at this point it would be the minor leagues. Whatever... grain of salt because I've never even played football personally but thats what it looks like to me.
