OK. Sorry. A number of your Bills compatriots come on here and say wacky things just to troll. I thought you were doing the same. He may be able to still become a solid NFL QB, but I don't think that can happen here. I think he needs a complete change of scenery, needs to sit for a year, and have the ability to just focus on working on his flaws (footwork/accuracy, reading Ds, and decision making). That would necessitate a team believing in him, signing him to an extension, being patient with him, and telling him that he will have the opportunity to compete for the starting job in 2022. If a team intends to start him this year or if he tries to play this year, I don't hink he'll ever come close to reaching his potential. I think he will kill whatever value teams think he still has, and probably finish off what's left of his confidence.
Tom, sorry, but that is just NOT realistic imo. No NFL team seeks to build the roster first and then look for a QB. That's backwards. It would cost a LOT MORE to trade up in a year or two than what they would get this year in a trade down, and the QBs prospects may not be nearly as good as this year.
The thing is, sports is entertainment. The Jets have been the opposite of that for the past 5 years. They went (2-14) with Sam last year. They need a fresh start. If Douglas believes Wilson can be a star, he should be the pick. I think the team's roster after the 2021 draft will be good enough to not be an excuse for a QB's failure too. I personally am fine with Sam. I think you are too. The majority of fans are not though, so moving off of him makes sense. The Jets are in a great spot to do that with the #2 overall pick. I don't think you can hire a new Head Coach and coaching staff. Add key free agents. Draft high end players in the draft. And then continue to struggle with Sam. It would be brutal. Fresh start for all is necessary.
Agreed. People need to stop believing we are only 7or 8 good players away from being a playoff team. The number is closer to 20 and we aren't going to get there by magic. There is a difference between saying we want to build through the draft and actually making the moves to do it. We have a long ways to go and trading Adams was just the first step.
It would be awful and dumb because this is a great class of QB prospects. Next year's class is not going to be as good. You can book on that. With the improvements JD has already made to the team in FA and even with our normal draft picks, if Saleh and his staff are any good at all, we win 7-9 games this season with halfway decent QB play. That would put us drafting outside the top 10 next year, and maybe 15 or higher. If there are only 1-2 good QB prospects next year, then that leaves the Jets out in the cold, because whomever the bad teams are that finish in the top 5 will most likely be wanting a new QB. Even if one of them at #2 or # is willing to trade down, it would cost a LOT MORE to trade up from #15 to #2 than it would this year. In 2023 we could be drafting even lower, and the cost to trade up be even higher. No NFL team builds the roster first and then goes looking for a QB. If you've paid attention at all so far, you see how GMs and teams crave a topnotch QB. The Eagles tried to trade up. SF did trade up. They didn't trade up for a position player. Without a topnotch QB, no NFL team is going to win consistently, if at all. The only teams that have built their roster first, it is because they weren't in position to draft a QB, and either couldn't find a team to trade up with, or didn't want to trade away so much draft capital to try to get a QB. Then they're forced to go with older JAG FA QBs, because it's very rare that someone like Alex Smith or Phillip Rivers hits FA, or they're forced to try to win with a less-talented QB they get in a middle or lower round. The Jets already have 19 picks over the next two drafts. It's not necessary to add 5 more, especially at the cost of giving up a potential FQB. No amount of 1st round draft picks are worth passing up on a FQB. If you don't understand that, then you don't understand the NFL and how it works.,
Next year is going to be brutal anyways. Wilson isn't NFL ready so he wont be starting for at least the first half of the season, so I guess Fields is the answer? I don't know though, maybe your right. In my opinion we are rebuilding incorrectly. I've been studying this draft since week 14. The best course showed itself, we should have swapped down to 6 with Phily. JD declining that move, to me, is the worst move he has made.
There's no right way to rebuild. Trading down is one way, keeping the picks we have and using them to take players who fit what the CS wants is another. It's not like we have 5 picks to work with.
The truth is, winning is what matters. We all have our own ideas of what the best path for the Jets will be, but whichever Douglas chooses, as long as the team succeeds fans will not care. I feel like if they draft Wilson at #2, there will be more patience from fans. If they keep and roll with Sam, they will need instant success in 2021, and that may be asking too much. Douglas wanting to re-set the QB position seems like the right move to me, but time will tell.
How good really is this so-called "haul" people are suggesting? A swap of first round picks - with the Jets obviously dropping back in the order - a 3rd rounder this year, and then a first and a second next year, and a first two years from now. Sorry, but you're deferring much of the benefit - assuming that they all work out - over three years! Or, you could have your FQB this year and going forward. It would take more than that "haul" to trade out of the #2 pick.
That is your delusion. We aren't going to be a 7-9 win team next year, even if Mahomes played for us. We had a ton to spend in FA but we didn't up the talent much at all. Lawson could a big help, though its a question mark. The offense hasn't improved much at all. This is made up logic. You don't know where we are drafting or what good QBs are coming out next year. You didn't even know about Wilson last Halloween. With the opt outs ending there is going to be a burst of talent next draft. Certainly not interested in trading up to 2. I cant even name a great QB that was drafted at #2. Herbert was taken at 6 last season, and he has a higher ceiling then Wilson. Again, this is made up logic to justify your desire to overpay for a rookie prospect. Bringing a rookie QB into a sub par offense is a good way to ruin them. Is that how the NFL works?
We really gonna do the Darnold defender thing again? Even though we've constantly laid out the 5 million reasons it'd be bad over the last few months?
Its more like a "what is the maniacal rush to reach for a QB at 2 this season" thing. Maybe it should have its own topic?
To be honest, I think most Jets QB debates are a waste of time from now on. It is a near lock that Zach Wilson will be the Jets QB at #2 overall. Fans can defend Sam, or suggest drafting Fields, Lance, Jones, etc but it does not really matter anymore. Some fans just refuse to believe it, I guess.
I hope you're right, but have to disagree. It makes more sense to me that SF traded up to #3 because they know they can get Wilson. If true, that likely means that the Jets take Fields, or - god forbid! - they take Sewell - or god forbid and punish! - they trade back. These are all possibilities IMO.
I know we have seen a bunch of mocks and tweets linking Wilson to the Jets, but my #1 reason to believe that is Vegas. A buddy of mine who is all into that stuff, said there is no money to be made betting on the #1 and #2 picks. Vegas feels they are locked to Lawrence to Jacksonville and Wilson to New York. They are usually right and had Mayfield to Cleveland and Darnold to New York before others did. Again, I don't know how they know that and we will find out in 4 weeks, but it does seem highly likely.
I don't think it's a maniacal rush at all. Three years is plenty of time to make a judgement on a QB. Sam hasn't shown us enough. His contract situation is almost forcing our hand if anything. He's been the worst starting QB in the league the past 3 years. Not my opinion, just what the numbers say. By drafting a QB we have a high chance of both upgrading the position and making it cheaper for us at the same time. The savings from a rookie QB allow you to build the rest of the team more effectively. This notion that our choices are either rebuild the team OR draft a rookie QB is nonsense. We have enough draft capital to do both easily. The defense was improved significantly in FA as was our WR unit. We'll address QB and OL/WR with premium picks in the draft and then plug any remaining holes in next year's draft. All of that is easily done even without additional picks.
Good point. The odds on Jets picking Wilson at #2 were around -500 last I saw, pretty significant. Gambling odds incorporate all public and nonpublic info about a given topic. Combine that with all of the smoke about it being an open secret the Jets are taking Wilson and I think it's almost a sure thing.
Well, I continue to disagree on your assessment of Darnold because you're not factoring in the true impact of the circumstances he was put in. That said, if Douglas sticks with Sam, the clock runs faster on him. If he goes with a rookie, he's going to be given more slack. Not to mention the monetary savings. So, IDK for sure that he takes Wilson - I hope he does - or Fields, but I'm pretty certain he's taking a QB at #2. Now that I've jinxed us, watch him trade down, and take Mac Jones with a later pick!
I've always factored it in. I readily admit he was put in a bad situation. The problem with the situation argument for Sam is that I've known in my heart of hearts he sucks since midway through the 2019 season. Because of that, I've been watching him with the excuses in mind for 1.5 full seasons. I have specifically tried to separate things that are his fault with things that aren't during that time, to make sure my gut wasn't fooling me about him being horrible. A large portion of our fanbase only realized Sam was bad at all near the end of this season. I have known for a long time so the excuses fall on deaf ears for me. I've been considering all of them while watching him long before most of our fans would even admit he was not good. I can honestly say that most of him being bad is his fault. He either doesn't see open receivers or misses them with passes constantly. He plays hero ball all the time which leads to bad turnovers. These are things he did in college too, where his team had more talent than almost everyone they played. His footwork is an abomination which leads to serious accuracy problems, and he's shown no improvement there since college. He consistently makes poor decisions like running out of bounds behind the LOS for self-sacks. Those things cannot be happening consistently in your third full season. The truth is Sam has shown us zero reason to keep him. He's not even a high ceiling, low floor guy like Jameis. He's both low ceiling and low floor. He has game manager upside with Nathan Peterman downside. It would be one thing if Sam was giving us 300 yard, 3 TD games while also throwing 1-2 INT's per game but far more often he's given us the downside without the upside. Before I'm labeled a Sam hater know that I've followed him since his time at USC and truly wanted him to be great. He just isn't, though. He's not even remotely good.
