All QBs have times where they seem to go "blind" and miss a wide open receiver, the question is: How often does that happen? I haven't seen enough of Fields to know if this is a big problem or not. Even with Lance, I did see more of his tape, and while he also missed some open receivers, I can't say whether this is big issue for him or if it's just an occasional "blind" spot. But I wonder if it's rooted in their desire to make a bigger play rather than taking the shorter, surer play. With both Fields and Lance I'm concerned that they often have more time and bigger windows to throw to that won't exist in the NFL. But both clearly have the physical tools to succeed. If they go to competent teams, with decent supporting talent, I can't imagine either will bust. I just don't know if the Jets would fit the definition of "competent" yet.
He wasn't top rated by the guys who told you Josh Rosen was better than Mahomes and Watson. True. This isn't a football court of law. So go back and watch his prior years yourself then.
I don't know to be honest. I know it's apparently a QB friendly offense but I don't know if that's because it requires the QB to process less of the field or something else.
He wasn't on the radar in general. But because you knew one guy who liked him means he was? C'mon now.
No, I just told you that's not the point. "On the radar" of who? You think NFL teams just discovered who Zach Wilson is?!
A offense style/system plays a huge role in a QBs stats and how good he looks. Take for example Mark Sanchez, in his Jet career his completion % was abt 55% and Yds per completion abt 6.5. He goes to the Eagles in 2014 and in 9 games throws for 2500 yards (278 yds per game avg) w 65% completion, and almost 8 yards per completion. So in a 16 game season Mark wouldve thrown for over 4k yards for the 1st time in his career Why was Mark able to become more accurate all of a sudden? After a shoulder surgery? Ofcourse his TD/Int ratio was still bad, but he was a much better QB in the Eagles. This was imo directly related to a poor Off Coordinator/Style of our recently dismissed Seahawks Off coordinator B. Shotty vs a good QB friendly offense in the Eagles So with the right system, guidance, and offensive mind Sam D can easily turn things around quickly. Off the topic... Its Hard to compare college #s vs pros. All these Pro QBs looked great in college, so its hard to compare College QBs vs Pros
I agree, I just don't really care what ESPN/media talking heads are covering one way or the other. I am not even sure they watched Zach this year until after the season was over or close to it. He had a pedestrian last year with injuries, playing for smaller school, and this year just didn't have the spotlight like Fields, Lawrence, and Mac Jones did, who were top 3 ranked, playing in play-offs. It could be that they looked at Zach late, so he gets more coverage now after not being talked about before at all since they didn't even look at him. I am just guessing here, but the bottom line is whether he was on a radar of these so called experts or not does not really matter.
No. But I doubt they were at BYU games scouting a guy who opened his freshman season as the backup and couldn't beat out the woeful Tanner Mangum to open the year. I don't think there are any NFL teams that just find out who a division one quarterback is. What they think of him is a different story. And why do you and your friend believe everyone knew he'd be an NFL player in 2018? You are the guy after all that hates when players high school rankings are referenced. He's obviously reversed course. But he wasn't highly regarded coming into the year. And you're just too stubborn to acknowledge that. The guy threw 23 touchdowns to 12 interceptions over 18 games and had major shoulder surgery. Do you think everyone felt as though Joe Burrow was going to be a first round pick after he couldn't get on the field at Ohio State and completed 57% of his passes at LSU in 2018?
I have no idea why you are so fixated on this. No, I understand that most fans don't watch obscure West Coast football games. No, I never said it was common knowledge. Wilson jumped out to him in a few games and I remember watching a few random games of his live because he told me to. What casual fans think and actual NFL teams think about the prospects are two different things. And Kiper, McShay change their boards as information leaks out during the run up to the draft. Take Mahomes. If you listened to NFL.com and ESPN he was "rising up the boards" in the months prior to the NFL draft. After the draft we learned Andy Reid was sold on Mahomes TWO years before the 2017 draft. He wasn't rising up boards. And neither will Wilson if he goes top 3. The boards the general public are referring to know are different than what actual NFL teams think. We only learn the juicy stuff post draft.
If you watch college film to study these guys, throw out about 90+% of it. Throw out all the film of the QB running around an open pocket, tossing the rock to a wide open receiver. Focus on the 5% of his snaps where he's under pass rush duress and hits a seemingly covered WR in stride. Those are the only snaps that have any similarity to the NFL. Don't ignore those bad passes under duress b/c he can hit wide open receivers 80% of the time.
Because while it may be true for some prospects, I do not believe Wilson was highly touted by teams OR public draft analysts given his lack of high production and his injury trouble. The reason he is so being so highly regarded by all as of now is because he had a great year. Not because he's been thought of as much for his entire college career as you seem to intimate. Mahomes threw for 311 yards/game and 52 touchdowns in his first two seasons in twenty games and had no shoulder concern. It's not strange for a team to really start to take notice because of that sort of production. If Wilson replicated his first two seasons he'd be a late round pick at best.
Fair enough. I do agree that the machine media wasn't on him. What the NFL teams think we can both guess at now.
Respect your opinion,nor am i attacking your post. But you touched on something ive read a time or 2,that has reasonated w my thoughts on Wilson. Poor man’s Mahomes as well as “Well he doesnt quite have Mahomes/Allen’s arm strength or athleticism BUT..” ( Not saying this was you just a prevailing thought) What makes those QB great IS their elite arm talent & athleticism. Why take a lesser talent not only at a higher spot than both went but more importantly go head to head AGAINST them? Again no disrespect intended but at #2,w the # of assets this team has over the foreseeable future We shouldnt want “poor man’s” anybody. If Wilson or any of these QBs are the guy at #2 they better be their own animal,have the tools or the ceiling to go head to head w the very best.
Here's a good breakdown of Fields from Tim Jenkins: Is Justin Fields QB1? - Full 2021 NFL Draft Breakdown - YouTube I actually upgraded my assessment of Fields based on some of the throws and reads he demonstrated against good teams, but he also showed that he seems to struggle with some reads and throws, so bottom line for me, I still have him behind Wilson. But he does have a ton of physical ability, and the fact that he showed he can make reads and tight window throws against Alabama, means he can be coached up if he's on the right team. I think if Douglas is taking a QB he wants one that can play sooner than I think Fields can be ready.
I get your point, but when I use that phrase ("Poor man's Mahomes") I don't really mean it as he's a lesser talent overall, more that he doesn't have Mahomes arm strength, but he could be competitive with Patrick. Frankly, I don't know of any QB who is really in Mahomes's class because as I've said before he's truly a generational talent. So what are the odds that you'll find - and acquire - someone equally as good or better than him? Slim and none. Therefore you take someone who might be close, and I think Wilson could be that guy. Honestly, if Lance went back to school and played another full season, maybe he'd be in that conversation, and potentially he could be even come out this year but he would have to land on the right team, with the right CS and weapons - maybe like on a Chiefs-like team with an Andy Reid and those weapons. So I DO think Wilson can go head to head with Mahomes, but he's going to be the underdog. Now, I could be wrong about Wilson (and everyone else) because I don't have the resources and time to analyze them the way Douglas does. But I think this is the year they need to take advantage of that #2 spot because I don't think they're going to be anywhere near that high for a while. And yes, I know you can find QBs later in the 1st round yada yada yada (not saying you're saying that, but some here have), the farther you drop, the worse the odds become. All that said, I could be convinced that they should roll with Darnold and trade back and grab some weapons, an IOL (or two), and a pass rusher and see what happens, but again it comes back to: where are they going to be picking next year, and if Darnold doesn't work out and they're picking lower than #6, where are they going to get their FQB?
Forgetting Fields to an extent for a second I think that video shows a bit of the difference between the power 5 and group of 5 conferences. Specifically the SEC/ACC/Big Ten and in the past two years the Pac-12. Forget the Big 12 - for the most part they all play the same coverages as G5. But they are all pro style defensive looks that vary their coverages. What you see a lot in the G5 is defenses stay with their base defenses which is usually that 3-3-5 rush 3 drop 8 with the very occasional blitz. Sometimes they'll play man out of that but it's mostly a zone that can be easy to dissect if it's figured out. The Big 12 plays it too but the difference is they usually have pretty good edge rushers, interior defensive lineman and enforcer style safeties that protect the middle of the field. So it's a bit harder to dissect because the rovers are much better and the pressure can be generated with the front three. That's one of the reasons I see a big talent gap in what Wilson faced versus Fields which is why I think Fields is way more pro ready than most of you think compared to Wilson.
You might be right, but given what we have to go off of, I don't see how we'll be able to really know conclusively. I do think Douglas has the resources and knowledge to know however. Not that it will make you change your mind - or even pause to consider - but Jenkins has done reviews of both Wilson and Fields and he thinks Wilson is the better prospect.
Found some interesting info, which can put Zach WIlson's easier schedule in a bit of a perspective. BYU offensive and defense pff ratings over last few years (data for 7 years was available): 2020 Off 98; Def 85.3 2019 Off 87.8 ; Def 84.7 2018 Off 84.5; Def 84.2 2017 Off 82.8; Def 82.2 2016 Off 86.2; Def 90.1 2015 Off 89, Def 85.9 2014 Off 88.8 Def 91.3 Why is this relevant? With the weaker schedule this year, I just wanted to see the difference between offense and defense historically, as compared to this year. Interestingly enough, before this season, in 6 years prior, offense averaged near identical ratings as defense, and the spread has always been less than 4 points. This year, this spread has been 13 points in favor of offense. Defensive numbers have been the best in 4 years, but not drastically better. Offensive numbers though went through the roof. This is consistent with the observation I made earlier: yes softer schedule accounted for some of the production, but this does not explain historically huge disparity between offense and defense against the same opponents. This is also supported by much better results against the same opponents from last few years. Bottom line: while softer schedule did contribute to BYU's success to some degree, much larger contribution was made by vastly improved offense and Zach Wilson.
I think the thing with Wilson is that there are decent reasons why his first two seasons weren't great (true freshman, injury recovery) and his last season was absolutely phenomenal. It wasn't a 2019 Joe Burrow season but his accuracy, Y/A and TD/INT ratios were all elite this year. He actually had better Y/A and TD/INT ratio than Burrow did in 2019.
Yeah it was good. But the context of the argument was that he wasn't highly regarded after his first two seasons for a myriad of reasons until he jumped on the scene as a top prospect this year.
