Vilma was never the problem in a 3-4. You're only as good as your 3-4 NT and Dewayne Robertson was one of the biggest Jet busts of All Time, we didn't call him D-Slob for nothing; it was never Vilma but instead Robertson was ass and Vilma took the blame because of it.
He definitely struggled that first year. I think he would've ended up being a great fit next to Harris though. Harris was a banger that could eat up blocks. Vilma also needed protection of a massive 3-4 nose tackle. He had Robertson in year one and Ellis transitioning into the 3-4 along with ready to retire Von Oelhoffen. No guarantees but I think if he would've played with Kris Jenkins and then Pouha in front of him he would've been a good 3-4 player. He got shoved around pretty good if those guards got up to him though.
that was me about the veiled tanking and relating it to how Polian did that at Indy...I totally believe that
Let me put it to you this way. Would you EXPECT to draft a guy like Q or better if you had say #22 pick in the draft? Because to make this trade, you would need to have a pretty high degree of confidence that the player will be better. Or ... just keep Q, who is good, starter, and is on the good contract.
Yes, I think getting someone around 22 as good, or better than Q, had proven to be likely at 22 — if you can identify talent. You can miss on that player at 3 just the same as at 22.
I look @ it like this. When JD decided to trade away Jamal Adams? He completely quit on the heart and soul of our ENTIRE DEFENSE. So why not trade away Q for another 1st round pick while saying FK OUR DEFENSE just like we fkd our defense by trading Jamal?!?!? Trade Q for a 1st and give us 5 first round picks over the next two drafts. In order to use all 5 1st round picks on OFFENSE! WHY NOT? OUR DEFENSE ABSOLUTELY SUCKS WITH Q TO BEGIN WITH. Use our 2nd and 3rd and 4th rounders along with FA $ on DEFENSE but all 5 1st rounders must be used on OFFENSE. 1.) Trevor. 2.) WR. 3.) Center. 4.) OG. 5.) WR or another OT. Fk our defense we already quit on it when we threw away #33.
How many of these guys would you say are a lot better than Q, about the same level, a lot worse than Q, completely useless? http://www.mynfldraft.com/NFL-Draft-Picks/22nd-overall/220309/ I see some decent guys, but also quite a few nobodies. Certainly I am not getting a high degree of confidence that the player will be better than Q.
Assuming we get a new coach next year if they decide to go to more 4 man fronts on defense Q could be a monster. Just like Richardson - his talents are being wasted lining up at the nose. If he were a 3T I have to believe that his production would become a little less "hidden" Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
The 22nd pick, specifically, is irrelevant. Go look at all the players that were available at 22 and after and tell me you don’t see players that are better than Q. Just because the team with the 22nd pick in those years didn’t pick them doesn’t mean they weren’t there. not to mention, zeroing in only on every player picked at 22, as if that is the totality of the discussion, is a very strange argument to be trying to make. that being said, I watched your movie last night and it’s still as good as I remembered.
22 was just an example. You will find similar results at every pick historically in mid first round - it's a hit or miss. We have a hit already, there is just no reason to mess around with it. If you liked my original moviefilm, check out the subsequent moviefilm next Friday. If no good, I will be execute.
He doesn't help rush the QB. He doesn't stuff the run. He doesn't make a difference. Trade his ass for a 1st round offensive player. Let's be honest here. Our Defense went from top 5-10 with #33 last year to one of the worst in every defensive statistical category. I absolutely loved what Adams did for both Gregg Williams and our entire Defense. Quinnen Williams? Not so much. I don't care for him at all, let alone love him. You can replace Q with a 2nd round DT and not miss a beat (because our D is putrid with or without him). Might as well trade his overrated Alabama ass for a 1st. And use that first on a real offensive difference maker on offense at WR/LG/Center or even an explosive pass catching TE. And then over the next two drafts we'll feature 5 1st round picks. 1.) Trevor Lawrence. 2.) #1 WR (opposite of Mims with Crowder in slot). 3.) Center (the return of Mawae/Mangold Pt. 3). 4.) LG (to feast alongside Becton). 5.) TE (giving Trevor Lawrence as many 1st round weapons as possible). Trade QW and over the next two drafts we can fully load Trevor with top notch home grown 1st round talents). Use our 2nd, 3rd, 4th rounders along with FA on fixing this awful defense currently in place but use 5 first round picks all on offense for the first time in forever.
This is SOP for GM's/HC's taking over a bad franchise that needs to rebuild. A young megastar might survive but all the guys the previous GM brought into the building need to be that if they want to stay in the building. Because Douglas hands were tied coming into the building after FA and the draft in 2019 the process is playing out slower here than it normally would. The biggest thing a new GM/HC wants to do coming in the door is to get the stench cleaned out of the locker room ASAP.
Hmm..sound s like an awful pattern I mean how lazy, inept, out to lunch can these Owners be ? They are too busy with their wives planning how to cater in Thanksgiving and Xmas with tables spaced 6 feet apart
WoW..DWC what a philosophical turnaround and well posted! Most game are won with 3 things: coaching, Play calling and POINTS For that you need a feared Offensive machine like KC or any other top tier team Then when 2 heavyweights collide its "defense wins championships"
Did someone hack your account? LOL Seriously, what a seeming change in philosophy. What brought this about? I was totally against taking Q. Williams. I wanted Josh Allen DE/OLB, but he's starting to play pretty well. I don't think the Jets need to trade him, but if they get an overwhelming offer to trade him, I'd have no problem with that. While I'd love to see all 4 or 5 (if they trade Q. Williams) 1st round picks used on offense, even I don't think that's an absolute necessity. I think one of those 1sts should be used on an edge rusher. I know that Rousseau is the best prospect in this draft class, but I'm not sure that he's all that good compared with the Bosas or Josh Allen coming out of college. With him sitting out this year, I don't think I'd take him. I'd plan on getting my edge rusher in 2022 even if I had to trade up and use multiple picks myself. Next year's FA class should be much better than this year's class, and could be better than the 2019 FA class. Douglas could easily sign both a topnotch WR and a quality IOL, and possibly a quality backup or two. Then in the draft, he could add another WR with our 1st round pick, then grab a TE, or CB, or OG, or C with Seattle's pick. Our pick at the top of the 2nd round could be used on a RB. With our two 3rd round picks, Douglas could take an ILB, another CB, or another OL. Edoga is not the answer as a swing OT. I'm not sure that McDermott is, either. Our 4th through 7th round picks (5) could be used on depth at STs. Hopefully, one of Javelin Guidry, Hall or Lamar Jackson develop into a quality CB and Bless Austin improves. In 2022, he could seek to get our edge rusher if there is a really good prospect or two. If not, then he could continue to build/improve other areas of the OL or the D. If Douglas is as good at the draft as I think he is, this team could be looking a lot different in 2022 following the offseason.
Here's the dilemma w/ Q and the 3-4 other pretty good players on the Jets minus Darnold...Q and the few other pretty good (not real good, certainly not great) players on the Jets are more valuable on their rookie contract because their talent exceeds their salary. JD is trying to build this team the right way, through a total tear down and build back up vs. trying to bandaid the problem like Mac did... Because that's his vision, he also knows the 3-4 pretty good players on this team like Q will become an albatross way before this team is ready to complete, as their salary will exceed their talent. To get ahead of this, the time to entertain (not necessarily push) trades for players that fall into the category that Q does is now, when they are seen as a valuable commodity by others due to the talent/salary ratio w/ enough time prior to that ratio shrinking. Our problem as Jets fans is that how much misery can we take? How many time does our season have to end prior to Columbus Day?? So we look at the handful of moderately talented players on this team and think 'damn, if we trade him we've got not chance'. The fact is, due to Idzik and Mac, the talent on this team is so terrible, that we'll always have no chance if we don't do this the right way. This means trading players like Q earlier than we may like, as long as the value we get back in trade exceeds his current value (i.e. we're maximizing value for the longterm).
I disagree. For one, I don't think it will take as long as you seemingly do for Douglas to build a team that is ready to compete. For another, Q. is only 21, he has 3 more years on his rookie deal, and by the time he is ready for a 2nd contract, Douglas should have the team ready to compete for a playoff spot, or very close to it.
He better not go the bullshit eagles and ravens route where they thought they could win without talent. Unfortunately i think thats what he's doing, hopefully he proves me wrong. Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
Understood and you may be totally right! My take was that regardless of age, that second contract will exceed his talent and thus decrease his value to the team and "winning" a trade now would allow us to gain more talent back for a longer time at a cheaper rate at a time down the road when we'll have a bigger window of winning...if any of that makes sense.