The Price of a Sack

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by MaximusD163, Apr 3, 2020.

  1. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    The problem is if not good LT prospect is available at 11. The ones Douglas thinks can play LT are all gone. Then we get a wr. No prospects in round 2
    You are right. If we get a left tackle at 11. If the ones Douglas wants are gone then we may need that 1st rounder next year.
     
  2. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Buying other people's pass rushers isn't going to get us over the top.

    Finding a good one in the draft or as an UDFA is where we could do that.
     
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  3. CotcheryFan

    CotcheryFan 2018 ROTY Poster Award Winner

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    If we were a good pass rusher away from being a Super Bowl contender, I could understand doing it, but we aren't. The Chiefs were and it ended up paying off.
     
  4. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    We are in total agreement on this. If one of the top OTs isn't there this year, then don't make the trade following the draft.

    Question: I know that you're higher on Prince Tega Wanogho than I am at the moment. Would you make the trade following the draft if we got Lamb in the first and Wanogho in the 2nd? How about if Douglas trades
    down, take Josh Jones in the first and a WR in the 2nd?
     
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  5. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    I think everyone outside of the top 3 scare me. I will admit I would feel more comfortable with Jones. Maybe even Jackson. Maybe. But to trade away draft capital right now I just wouldn't do it. If we had a for sure LT then yes. But honestly outside of Thomas there is not for sure LT. I like Becton a lot. And if Douglas picked 9ne of them and thought they were the LT, even Jones, then yes. But we HAVE to secure the offense before worrying about sacks.but if he has doubt then no. And I still wouldn't include QW. I would do a 2020 3rd 2021 1st.
     
  6. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Well you misunderstand me. I completely agree with protecting Sam and giving him weapons. That's why the compensation I'd be okay with is out of next year's draft (or using QW as part of it instead of a draft pick next year). This is based on my assumption that they would indeed fix the OL and get him starting caliber WRs this year. And I wouldn't say "Well that's it for the offense next year" by that. I'm saying if we could get Ngakoue this year, we could still look for OL, WR, TE, RB next year too. And of course look for a CB and if QW is gone a DT.
     
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  7. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I totally agree that we have to secure the offense before worrying about sacks. In fact, I couldn't possibly agree with you more on that line of thinking. Under no circumstances would I include a 3rd round pick this year however. We owe it to Douglas to give him as many picks as possible this year. He didn't pick Q. Williams, doesn't owe him anything, and he (Williams) isn't a necessity. We could quite possibly find someone every bit as good in the 3rd or 4th round next year. That is where we differ widely. I didn't want Q. Williams this year, and don't want him next year. If I were GM, I'd be looking to trade him for whatever I could get.
     
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  8. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Buying other people's pass rushers that are in the verge of their career decline doesn't get you over the top, but getting someone like Ngakoue who is just entering his prime can address that hole for years.

    I agree that the BEST solution is to draft your own guy, but when was the last time the Jets were able to draft a legit pass rusher? A decade and ahalf ago! Sure, maybe Douglas will be much better at drafting and therefore be able to fill this long time gaping hole, but if you have a chance to add a guy like Ngakoue for essentially what you'd have to spend to get a chance to draft a potentially equivalent player next year (assuming they'll have to trade up to get a high enough pick to do this), then you do it.

    Now would Jacksonville accept next year's #1 and QW, or next year's #1 and #3? I don't think so, but IF they did, I'd jump on that deal.
     
  9. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    First off I don't think anyone in the 3rd or 4th will have that potential next year. We haven't seen what Williams can become. Also Ngakoue has benefited from the people inside. Calais, Malik. If you look at last year all the ones that got a lot of sack has a big name somewhere else applying pressure. No ok ne else we have is gonna do that. You don't get rid of an asset when you can find a way to keep it. Especially when they could develop into an absolute star.
     
  10. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

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    They did have Dee Ford prior, wasn't too shabby. Maybe the Jets draft Bradlee Anae or someone in the 3rd round or so.
     
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  11. Footballgod214

    Footballgod214 Well-Known Member

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    Good write up Max!

    Funny how when I asked (2 days ago) what you (not you Max) felt about trading up THIS draft for Chase Young (DL Ohio St), giving us that stud pass rusher we've been craving AND saving us almost $100M in valuable cap space over the next 5 yrs (see Jamal Adams and Sam Darnold), y'all said JoeD should be tarred and feathered and run out of town if he traded up for Young.

    What happened? Change of heart?
     
    #31 Footballgod214, Apr 3, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2020
  12. King Koopa

    King Koopa Well-Known Member

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    Just sign Clowney, Draft an OT, WRx2

    Why do we have to make it so hard? I’d take my chances with the team as is and those additions
     
  13. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Well, speaking only for myself, I WOULD NOT want to trade up this year especially, nor next year. That's why I prefer going after Ngakoue this year using next year's draft picks (or possibly QW instead of some of those). You might say, "Well giving up next year's draft picks is the same thing as trading up", but it isn't. For one, you want to use THIS YEAR's assets when they absolutely have to be used for OL/WR. Moreover, to trade up to get Young, it would likely cost more than next year's draft picks, thus depleting this year's and probably a pick or two next year. But the big difference is that even if you were successful and got to draft Young, there is no guarantee he'll be as good as Ngakoue is already.

    So no, I haven't changed my heart.
     
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  14. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    Because Clowney isn't a good pass rusher.he takes plays off. His motor is garbage. Yes he's a good athlete and sets the edge. But not a pass rusher.
     
  15. King Koopa

    King Koopa Well-Known Member

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    Totally disagree...he’s an all around menace

    If you go back and watch his games I doubt you’d disagree
     
  16. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Saying or inferring that Clowney is the same as Ngakloue is laughable. They don't even begin to be the same player.
     
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  17. J-Raw24

    J-Raw24 Well-Known Member

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    I have watched his game. He was in the same division as Indianapolis most of his career. I live in Indiana. He has a horrible motor. He takes plays off constantly. He had 1 decent year. And the other years he plays full speed maybe 3-5 games. He's injured another 5+ games. He isn't a good pass rusher.
     
  18. King Koopa

    King Koopa Well-Known Member

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    They’re closer than you think but one costs nothing in draft capital and one will cost a ton

    I’ll take Clowney and the picks, and look to draft a long term solution

    I would love Ngakoue if he was a free agent
     
  19. King Koopa

    King Koopa Well-Known Member

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    He is constantly beating blocks, does he take plays off? I’m not arguing that but it doesn’t make you a bad player if you make up for it with big plays which he does

    He’s a monster against the run and is a good-not great pass rusher who has the ability to be great at times

    He’s not as good a pure pass rusher as Ngakoue but he’s a player I would like to have
     
  20. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    First, the fact that he does take plays off, and has been injured, almost guarantees that Douglas wouldn't want him. He doesn't have a reputation of making his teams better, and that's the kind of players Douglas has said he wants. Second, he might not cost draft picks but he will cost cap space, and he will also establish a value that other players will shoot for - Adams will want AT LEAST as much and likely more, and Douglas won't be able to negotiate down from there.

    Overall, he would probably add some value, but not enough to overcome the points I raised above.
     

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