2020 OL Depth?

Other than LT, that would definitely be a solid OL. At Beacham's age, he can't be counted on to play 16 games. Shell has played better recently (the last few games), but I don't think he's a LT and I don't want to trust Sam's blindside to Shell. With this being such a great draft for OL, I'd rather draft our new OL than sign a bunch of older (28+) FAs, especially expensive ones like Scherff will be. We will have somewhat limited cap space, and need to sign a CB and maybe another 2nd tier edge rusher in FA as well, so I'm not sure that Scherff would be possible. If so, and we could still sign a quality CB, then I'd love to add him, but I don't think that's the way that Douglas will handle FA. I think he'll use it for depth competition, 2nd & 3rd tier players, and to sign good young potential starters that are cheaper, but I don't think he will look to make many big contract signings (splashes) in FA. It will be interesting if Matt Skura makes it to FA. Douglas could try to sign him or another C as a stopgap, which would allow us to focus on a WR, Edge Rusher or CB earlier in the draft (2nd round).

My preference for the OL would be like this:

LT - Rookie/Beacham or possibly Veldheer if he has anything left and signs with us
LG - Andrus Peat/Alex Lewis - if Peat is too expensive, then Xavier Su'a-Filo, Joe Thuney, Joe Haeg, or Quinton Spain
C - Rookie/Harrison
RG - Graham Glasgow/Compton/Edoga
RT - Rookie LT/Conklin/Edoga

I still hope that there will be a quality OT prospect available at our pick in the 1st round. If not, then I'd rather we take the best Center, Edge Rusher, or WR available. The only way I wouldn't want to draft our future LT is if all the best ones are gone by the time we pick.

1 - OT
2 - C
3 - Edge Rusher/WR/CB
3 - Edge Rusher/WR/CB
4 - Edge Rusher/WR/CB (whichever position we didn't pick in the 3rd round)
5 - Whatever

If all the 1st round OTs are gone by our pick and we've signed Skura or another quality C to start, then I would be quite happy to add a stud WR prospect like Lamb in the 1st round or a highly-rated edge rusher. If we haven't signed Skura or some other starting quality C, then I'd want our #1 pick to be a C rather than a WR or Edge Rusher. Hopefully, we could then add a good OT prospect in the 2nd round. I really think we're probably going to have to wait until next year to look for an edge rusher. Fixing the OL, adding another weapon for Sam, and upgrading our CB corps has to take precedence imo.

1 - WR, C, or Edge Rusher
2 - OT
3 - whichever position wasn't taken in the 1st round
3 - CB/OG
4 - OG/CB
5 - Whatever

 

OK, didn't know that. Hopefully, we've already put in a claim for him.

 

Offensive lineman are a lot more durable deeper into their careers than other positions. Not to say they aren't affected by it but they can play through lower body injuries more effectively than say a runningback would.

Beachum will be 31 at the start of the season. He has another couple seasons in the NFL in him. Maybe he dives off a cliff but I doubt it. He's not some great road grading run blocker anyways. He's just a good pass blocker and sturdy lineman.

For that reason, I'm more OK building the offensive line through free agency than other position groups. Their careers are longer and thus the money is usually more worth it as they age and enter their 31-34 age seasons. They're also more willing to restructure their contract into bonuses and such than the flashy playmaking corner or receiver is. Brick did it a couple of times to help the team out.

As much as I want Brick and Mangold part II, we also have to look at how great of a free agent market this is for offensive lineman. Forget the top end talent if you'd like; it's a deep pool. For that reason, we should be aggressive in free agency for lineman and continue to retool it in the draft. The right players have to be there though.

 

As far as Beacham, I'm not willing to gamble on Sam's health by gambling that Beacham has another couple of seasons in the NFL, and that's what it would be. The Jets could get lucky (and heaven knows they are due some luck), but imo you can't count on luck. If we can re-sign Beacham and draft our future LT then that's ideal imo. I don't want Shell,Qvale, Edoga or someone of that low ability protecting Sam's blindside. I also hope that we can get an LT that is a more effective blocker in the rushing attack and still as good or better than Beacham in pass blocking.

I understand that, but we don't teams should be built primarily through the draft to keep the cap under control and to keep units together longer. That's how stability is accomplished. We don't want to have to be overhauling the OL every 2-3 years. Yes, some players can play effectively into their 30s, but with others, their ability drops off a cliff overnight. In addition, they are more injury prone and usually more expensive, and not as good as when they were younger. I don't mind signing one or maybe 2 new OL starters in FA, but I want them 28 or younger. I hope that we will re-sign Beacham to an incentive-based contract where if he beats out the rookie or the rookie isn't ready, he gets paid more, but if he winds up a backup, he earns less, with also some formula for accounting for games/snaps played.

If this wasn't going to be a great draft for OL, I wouldn't flinch about signing 3-4 FA OL to start, but since it is, I think it would be unwise to go that route. While at this stage there are a LOT of potential FA OGs, Cs and RTs, many, if not most of the better players will probably never reach FA, especially with the lack of quality OL in the NFL. Almost every team needs help on the OL. Those that do make it to FA will get grossly overpaid because there will be lots of teams trying to sign them.

 

it’s not just you. OL is prob the biggest weakness on most teams, and thats for the starting 5, let alone depth. I’ve been saying this for years, it’s not so much the OL talent has gotten worse or thinned out, it’s a product of the DL position evolving so much. These guys are bigger, faster, and stronger than they were 10, 15, 20 years ago. They are ATHLETES. Where as the OL haven't evolved nearly as much.

 

Beachum is becoming a must resign, hopefully he can be resigned on a good deal before season ends. Even if LT is still a 1st rd draft priority we certainly can’t go into the draft having to draft a LT and can’t go into season relying on rookie to protect Sam’s blindside. Beachum has been very solid this year and has to be resigned, unless of course JD signs a better vet but those don’t usually become available in FA.

Would really like to see Scherff be a top priority in FA if he does become available. Conklin would be another priority. I’d be pretty content if these were the two big FA signings this year.

I would definitely look to be bringing back Lewis, Shell, Compton as well. They’ve each done a solid job and would provide at the very least solid depth on OL.

 

You are onto something here. Inside the NFL"s Phil Simis also said something to that effect, it is one of the weakest positions in the NFL.

 

I thought we have four pick in the first three rounds?

 

I agree with your original statement about a dearth of good lineman around the nfl. Sam is not the only QB under constant duress. As I watch ESPN highlights, QB's playing behind turnstiles seems to be the norm (see Giants, Bengals, and many more).

With the most athletic men on defense groomed for pass rushing, even interior pass rushers like Arron Darnold, the o-line hasn't evolved as fast at the pass rushing side. Maybe we'll see leaner, faster lineman to match up with leaner, faster pass rushers? A 340 pound road grader at RT might go the way of the FB in years to come.

But in the meantime, I think schemes (zone blocking vs man blocking, etc) and coaching/game planning (drawing up plays to have guards pulling, etc) will be just as important as talent up front. Very few (if any) teams have 5 studs up front with 3 more waiting to spell them. Dallas came the closest with all their #1 picks on the o-line, but they haven't done poop with it (coaching).

 

A lot of it is as you said; coaching and scheme fit. We married a bunch of odd ball pieces together this offseason and tried to make them fit. And that goes back to even Le'Veon Bell in a zone scheme.

There are man blocking schemes that work very well (Steelers for the past 20 years, the Seahawks with Shaun Alexander/Hutchinson/Walter Jones, Patriots, and traditionally the Ravens before this new era offense) and there are zone blocking schemes that work very well (Vikings, Cowboys with inside zone principals, Rams last year and obviously any Shanahan coached team).

They both require continuity and working together and that was as big of an issue with the line as any this year. They played what? 4 snaps together before opening day?

 

Here's another observation: Offenses 'look different' depending on down and distance. 4th and 1 looks different than 3rd and 15. FBs come in. Extra TEs come in. RB go out. Extra WRs come in. On and on.

But the one thing that (almost) never changes is the O-line. The lineman have to be road graders on 4th and 1, and then premium pass protectors the next play. While other positions come and go depending on the situation, the lineman have to be good at everything.

That's all!

 

You're right. 'scheme' is just as important for o-lineman as for the d-line. It's hard to get 3-4 d-lineman to play well in a 4-3 scheme. Same applies to the o-line and what the OC plans to run on offense.

 

Beachum is coming back. Gase loves him and he is a warrior. If we take an o lineman in the first they will probably start at guard for a year or 2 . Which is fine, I don’t care how high a rookie is drafted, I’d rather beachum than a rookie protecting Sam if we are looking to make a playoff run.

 

you're right--got that turned around--my bad

 

Yep, you're right. I meant 4 picks in the first three rounds--my bad

 

I think the 2nd is much better. I'd rather have the rookie tackle playing at RT than LG. Beacham isn't likely to play all 16 games next season even if he re-signs with us. We need to have a quality replacement ready to step in, as with a good offseason, we could be (and probably should be) in the playoff hunt next season. I also don't trust Shell. He has played better the last several games, but he was pretty bad earlier in the season, and has never been more than average or below average. If they want to keep Shell for depth at RT and RG, fine, but I don't want him starting if at all possible.

 

I agree about wanting Beacham back, but would rather the rookie OT start at RT rather than OG. So he adjusts to playing on the end, in more space in the NFL

 

I just hope that Joe Douglas can pick some top players in this upcoming draft.