Adams isnt a high quality talent? He is so good, he has ended drives on his own, and is one of the best safeties in the league right now coming off his 2nd year. Did we get lucky? yes, but for this franchise Darnold and Adams is as good as it gets. Mahomes wouldn't be Mahomes here, and prior to the draft I thought he was a good prospect but had a lot of rough edges, he had to sit and learn.
I think Mac thought the Browns were taking Darnold, the Giants would take Barkley over Mayfield, and we would get Mayfield. Which would have also been a good outcome.
He's super high quality. I love him. Darnold too. And if I wasn't clear I think they'll be even better as we get more talent in front of them My point was when your team sucks you don't pick a safety. You get foundational pieces or trade back.
I agree with this. Do you have any view what the Giants would do if someone offered them three firsts for the #2 pick?
For that to have been the case, there must have been another team (not named Cleveland) that loved Mayfield enough to offer the Giants three firsts for Mayfield but not for Darnold. I don't think such a team existed.
A game changing safety is a foundational piece. Troy Polamalu, Ed Reed were foundational pieces. I understand your position, you do not value the position of safety as a foundational position, but if he's a game changer, all cards are on the table.
I agree that it wasn't completely lucky and that he deserves credit where credit is due. Also, there's the saying that luck is a result of preparation meeting opportunity, so to a large extent, Mac created his own luck by trading up into position to get one of the top 3 QBs, by making a great trade in not having to give up our 1st round pick in 2019, and I think you're right that he didn't think the Giants were going to take a QB and were going to take Barkley. I give him kudos for that. The thing is, as we saw in the draft this year, the latter point can bite you in the ass. There are never any guarantees as to who other teams will take. The Giants could have easily been thinking that Sam would go #1 to the Browns, that they had no interest in either Rosen or Mayfield, and therefore were going to go with Barkley. With the Browns taking Mayfield #1, a smart GM would have taken Sam there and not taken the RB. I don't think you were talking to me, but just to be certain, I'm not criticizing Mac for putting his team in position to take Sam and then taking him. That's one of the positives I credit him for. There's more than enough other things to criticize him about without having to try to blame him for things he did well.
I both agree and disagree with this post. I agree that not taking a QB in 2017 was Mac's most egregious error and that he probably planned to take a QB in 2018, and that's why he wasn't even thinking in 2017. Where I disagree is Mahomes and Watson. Mahomes clearly had a great arm that could make all the throws, and he was very accurate. He wasn't just some spread, system QB. He was mobile, could extend plays and create. Some people have scoffed at the notion, but I think having a professional athlete for his father helped him understand and prepare for the NFL and is a factor in his success. Whereas I love Watson's leadership, savvy, and mobility, his arm isn't nearly as accurate or strong as Mahomes' or Sams'. I knew that Watson's arm wasn't strong enough for NE winters and that he needed to go to a team in the south or that played in a dome.
I agree that Mac didn't know that he'd get one of the top 2 QBs. He hoped that he would, and I believe that he thought that the Giants were going to take Barkley and not trade down. Yes, you're right, that some team could have blown the Giants away with a trade offer and then taken Sam, but that didn't happen. What did happen is that because Mac had the foresight to trade up early, he was in position to take Sam when he fell, and he did. Thus, I disagree with you that you can't give Mac credit for putting us in position to take Darnold. IMO that's ridiculous. If he hadn't traded up to #2, we never would have gotten Darnold. If he hadn't traded up a month before the draft, he may not have been able to trade up at all, and with Mac's hesitance and unwillingness to pay a lot to move up, I'm going to say that he wouldn't have paid the price to move up. Either some other team would have or the Colts would have kept their pick. I also agree that a sucky team shouldn't be taking a safety at #6, and that they should be taking a FQB prospect, an LT or I'll add an elite edge-rushing prospect. In the Jets' case since it had been so long since they had a legitimate FQB prospect (Sanchez doesn't count), unquestionably, Mac should have taken Mahomes or at least Watson.
I think this was part of Mac's thought process, and if Hack didn't develop that he would take a QB in the 2018 draft. That's why I eventually forgot about the Jets' taking Mahomes or Watson. I didn't think that there was any way that Mac was going to take a QB in the 1st round after taking Hack in the 2nd round the year before and supposedly was in love with Hack.
Adams is definitely a high quality talent. I agree with what you've said about him, and we're fortunate to have him, but I agree with Chandler and westiedog that Mac should have taken a QB in 2017 and that he shouldn't have even seriously considered taking Adams. I love Adams, and loved him in that draft. Once I became convinced that Mac wasn't going to take a QB, then Adams was the player I wanted him to take, but Chandler is right, Mac should have been thinking QB, or at least LT or edge rusher over a S.
While I don't view S as a foundational piece, either, you have an excellent point. A safety as good as Adams, who is a game-changing safety and definitely has HOF potential does become a foundational piece. Still, you have to admit when one thinks about building a team, one normally thinks QB, edge rusher and LT in that order as the foundational pieces if one doesn't have one or all of those positions ably manned.
Your reading comprehension is lacking my friend. Again, this is not Mac claiming he didn't put the team in position to draft, Darnold. Was luck involved, yep, but he (..again) LITERALLY put us in a position to draft, Darnold. Hence, we LITERALLY drafted, Darnold. It happened. It doesnt matter if he was expecting it. If he hadn't been proactive to trade up to 3 to begin with. We never would've had that shot. The Giants trading out was EXTREMELY unlikely. I'm not going to go further with it, Google it if you want. Idc. Needless to say. Mac will forever get credit for, Darnold. It's a fact. Mac picked a pro bowl safety, he could've picked another Vernon Gholston. He didn't. I dont care what your priorities are with positions and all the other stuff you mentioned, it doesn't matter with the point I'm making. Mac will forever get credit for Adam's too. I think Mac needed to go for several reasons as well, and, he is gone. However, again, the guy did do good for this team in his tenure. People acting like he didn't just strike me as delusioned. My only point. Why is this so hard right now? I know I'm not wrong. I dont get it. ....
Mac's problem is he always tried to pull a rabbit out of the hat in rounds 2-7 ala Hackenburg, Shepherd, Nickerson, Cannon, Fatucasi etc. In stead of going with the more sure picks. And his #1 problem is his lack of respect for drafting the OL. Sometimes it's better to be lucky than smart, & that's how we ended up with Sam. I'll give Mac some credit, but his bad drafting certainly outweigh the good. Mac was a scout & he will always be a scout. He was in way over his head as a GM. Mac...RIP.
Agree, it was definitely more then he could handle. Some of those picks came off like he was trying to be the smartest guy in the room.
I wasnt as high on getting Mcshay as others.Ive frankly never been a fan of his eye for talent & thought it’d be more of a PR move than anything else. There are countless other personnel people w just as much passion & knowledge for draft/scouting who dont need camera time to sell themselves. I did think his wealth of contacts/sources would be an asset however.. Which leads to the talking head i wouldve liked Daniel Jeremiah.Hes a much more level headed evaluator,scouted for a solid organization & just like Mcshay hed bring the same level of sources when digging into college prospects
Not making any judgement as to which was better. There were a lot of differing opinions. I based what I said on what I recall the QB rankings to be at the time. Most rankings had Trubisky No. 1 and Watson No. 2. Some even had Watson No. 1, but I don't recall any rankings that had Mahomes ahead of those two.
