oh u mean the 1st 2. i thought u meant 2 and 4. i've seen people call 4 a filler episode too. IDK i mean looking at the 1st 2 not sure how you could cut out half of it to make 1 episode without losing a lot. if you want to argue they should have made a 2 hour episode out of them sure but same could be said of a lot of episodes then lol. how would you cut 30sih minuted between the 1st 2 episodes to make ti 1 long one?
By taking out that Aladdinesque scene where they are flying dragons before the big battle. Who did they think they are? Disney?
LMAO that's like 5 minutes but the scene did kind of need to exist for a few reasons it could have been shorter though but 3 mins isn't enough to justify them being 1 episode.
I dunno, I think after she obliterated the defenses and landed Drogon on the city wall, the populace was nice and terrified. And if she had flown over right away and destroyed the Red Keep to kill Cersei (and all the poor human shields she had surrounded herself with), that would've accomplished the same thing. Instead, she waited until after the city signaled its surrender to massacre the civilian population out of anger and hatred. I had trouble following the entire sequence of events, especially once the POV switched to Arya, but it looked like Dany burned the outer half of the city, flew over and wiped out the Red Keep...then went BACK to kill more civilians? That just doesn't look calculated to me, it looks like an enraged queen fulfilling her father's wish to 'burn them all'. Irony is, if she had just flown up and immediately taken KL last season like she wanted, it would've been even easier, with all her Dothraki and Unsullied, all three dragons (without the "let's prove the zombie threat to Cersei" BS, she might not have lost Viserion in the first place), no scorpions and no Golden Company (not that either accomplished anything last night), Missandei would still be alive, and thus she likely wouldn't have been angry enough to torch the city. Great work, Tyrion! Really avoided the casualties there. The last two seasons were basically his fault. But if he survives the finale, I guess Casterly Rock is all his now
One of the show producers said she didn't decided ahead of time she was going to do all of that. Also, that scene has icicles in it, so I'm gonna guess "ashcicles" is gonna start trending lol.
that scene felt like 10+ minutes, and I am sure there are other scenes as well. They should've made it 180 minutes like the other episodes. Make 1 and 2, 1 episode. Then episode 2 is the battle and then you can clean up some other plots.
i mean i agree they are rushing through the season but the reality is they needed more time not less. the dragon scene was important because it showed us (the viewers) that jon is a targaryean even though him and dany didn't know it. It also was the last of their relationship being the same so they needed a reminder for the "fall" after when jon found out who he really was and also set up as practice for the upcoming NK fight since the plan was him and dany on dragons taking on the whitewalker dragon so i mean it was an important scene to have even if it did look a bit cheesy
You could've fit this in 1 episode. Of course they needed more content which further solidifies my point. All that crap could've been done in 180 minutes with 1 episode. Writers got super lazy
i wouldn't call them lazy. there is a couple of things at play here. 1) (the biggest IMO) is that they are writing for a result then filling in the gaps. essentially working backwards. like we know we wanted this to happen so how do we make it happen. that's caused a lot of characters to act out of character and do stupid things they normally wouldn't so the writers can get their results and endings the way they want, instead of it naturally happening. this is compounded by the lack of time in episodes as well 2) HBO wanted more episodes but apparently nobody else did so now they are left trying to wrap up all the loose ends in a short time while also focusing on the epic battles that has been lead up to for the past 8 years. lots of shows and movies have epic battles what set game of thrones apart was the stuff outside the battles and the characters and all the little jockying for position and gain stuff. the last couple of seasons that stuff has gone away making it a more mas appeal flashy show with less substance then in earlier seasons 3) some things they did get right though, the mountain and the hound was a perfect fitting end of their tales. jaime and cersie as well dying together. they made all the early predictions in the series come true so we have come full circle even if the path to get there didn't always make much sense.
Great points, particularly #1. I think this is exactly what happened and it started towards the end of the last season with the trip north of the wall.
if u watch the post show breakdown they state things like that all the time and it makes it obvious to me that's why the characters are out of character. things like "we knew we wanted arya to kill to kill NK 3 years ago" and "we knew we wanted toe hound and mountain to kill each other and the hound had to die by fire" and "we knew we wanted jaime to die in the arms of the one he loves" the problem with that outside of the hound/mountain which was done great, is the events that take place to make this stuff happen doesn't make a lot of sense and is out of character for many.
1) Its lazy writing because characters suffered in terms of their progression / regression. Tyrion for example has taken a big time hit. How does he go from the smartest person in the show, to literally the most useless, dumb character in the show? Falling for Cersei's BS not once, but twice. Everything that made Tyrion a great character was lost in this season. So, like I said earlier they wasted unnecessary time and filming on the first 2 episodes. 2) All of the "prophecies" they hyped up for seasons, only 1 of them really came to fruition (The eyes comment to Arya - even still not a complete one), actually none of them mattered at the end of the day. 3) Daenerys' transformation was the worst as well. Sorry writing is lazy, working backwards? Lol, give me a break dude. They aren't filling in any gaps. We can agree to disagree. The show is now full of plot holes. Its a great show, but is it the best ever? Absolutely not.
1) LMAO yeah they really shit on tyrion for sure. old tyrion would have realized long ago that dany was batshit crazy and helped varys betray her. he also wouldn't have allowed the dothraki to march instantly to their deaths. He may have even hired braun to take out dany and/or cersei. his character this season is basically dumb and useless. they only used his character to kill off varys and to allow jaime to die in cerseis arms, and to allow cersei to behead missandei. he's been nothing more then a tool to get other characters where they want to be 2) nah way more then that. early on dany was told how she would burn the red keep, arya was told she would kill NK, jaime was told he would die in cerseis arms, it's a lot betetr then them forgetting they did that liek lots of other shows do. it just sucks how they all got to that point wasn't natural but forced 3) i mean seeing her change does suck and feels off, but again it fits the narrative of the irony of her removing 1 tyrant to be another. as they said everytime a targaryan is born god flips a coin. now we know (although we knew for quite some time) which side her and jon are on. I think you missed some key stuff and holding it against them. I didn't say the writing was good, but it's not lazy. Rushed and bad? sure at times, but people throw around lazy too much and it's not a fair adjective
true. but IF Martin had gotten off his fat ass and finished the books, it very well could've been the best show ever. Instead we are left with cheesy television writers trying to pick up where he left off and it just wasn't the same from there on out. -- I also think the actor's egos made the show suffer as well. The dragon girl doesn't get naked anymore, they only want to film in certain increments, fewer episodes/more money per episode, yada yada.. just some examples. they got so big and famous that they could make demands like that. The writers were handcuffed to some respect. That's why the Wire was the best show ever because of the nature of the show, they never had to deal much with that stuff
#2, I give you this, but if Arya doesn't kill Dany then the Melisandre's prophecy wasn't true completely. I don't know how I would feel seeing Arya kill 2 big time villains in 1 season. Then what was so great about Jon too? All he did was get his ass saved and look confused. 3#, I don't know, the change was far too drastic too quickly. I would have preferred some form of foreshadowing. Her personality up until this point didn't feel like she would become the Mad Queen based off 2 things (her closest ones dying and Jon being the true heir). Rushed, lazy, not a major difference IMO. But I blame this on the writers, not HBO. HBO wanted more episodes to flesh everything out, and the writers were like, "6 episodes were enough" They really went Hollywood this season.
I wish they finished the books first. I agree, it could've been the best show ever. Seasons 3 and 4, the best content you will see on TV. BTW, I also miss Emilia Clarke getting naked, shes gorgeous. Another BTW, I don't even want to talk about the Brienne of Tarth and Jaime sleeping with each other plot in the other episode. That bitch better be pregnant or there was literally no reason for that part to happen on the show.
2) for 2 it really depends. there are a couple of ways to look at it. she's killed many people already. there could have been someone with green eyes already. the other part is she went to kill cersei (green eyes) but the hound stopped her and said it's already done cersie is dead either way and no reason for her to risk it. i could take that as a "kill" personally. the 3rd option is she kills dany as u said and on their lore now arya is the best assassin so it makes sense. her story isn't done it seems. now there are 4th and 5th options out there too. 4th is she kills a random person with green eyes along the way. the 5th option boils down to the other big players in GoT with green eyes which includes tyrion (possible), jamie (already dead), and Illyn Payne who is on her kill list since he beheaded ned stark but unlikely since he hans't been on the show in a while and would be pretty random. so i think it's basically already fulfilled (cersei dead) or she kills tyrion or dany. either way i feel it's been fulfilled and the main point of the prophecy was the blue eyes meaning the NK and people just dug too deep into it as she already killed someone with green eyes likely at some point. as far as jon goes, he's there for suspense and the role he plays as 1 the true heir of the throne suddenly, 2 loved by people, 3 the king of the north, 4 danys love interest, 5 the guy who organized the army and broght them together to kill the NK. jon has done alot and i hope he gets a proper ending but he's also just a soldier who doens't want to rule 3) the change started happening a while back. last season when she slaughtered sams dad and brother was probably the earliest i can remember but might have been even earlier then that. her refusing to help john unless he bended the knee was a big foreshadow to her as a tyrant. it was obvious and building up for quite some time over the past 2 seasons if not sooner. things like u mentioned only help set her over the edge as well. I do agree though we needed more episodes or longer episodes to really give a good finish. no way in hell everything wraps up nicely in 1 more episode. simply not possible. and yeah HBO wanted it but the writers seemed like they were done but that also kind of happens when you ran out of source material years ago and yeah they totally went hollywood and explosions and battle over keeping with the story elements. as far as my count this is people who need endings still Large characters jon, dany, tyrion, arya, sansa small characters grey worm, sir brienne, Braun, sam, braun Lands red keep, winterfell that's a lot to wrap up in 1 episode and i may be forgetting some
yeah dany boobs were great but i mean u can go rewatch the old episodes. they were probably better 8 years ago then they are now lol and the scene of them made sense. it was pre-war, everyone was banging cause they may die the next die. him leaving her to go back to cersie was the dumb part, and him getting captured, and him getting saved by tyrion, and him getting almost killed by euron, and him dying the way he did. seriously they should have ended his story as a "new jamie" settling down with brianne in the north and the 2 of them leading the north army. i hated the way the ended jamie. way to forced. i seen it coming but still not a fan of that.
There has been a lot of disagreeing and complaining about Game of Thrones lately, but I think every fan would agree with that statement.
I feel like Episode 5 could have been one of the best in the whole series if they had built up to it properly. Standalone, and without any context, it's pretty stunning to watch.
