Decades old Jets fans, Millenials, and Gen Xers have every right to express their opinions good bad or in between...plus freak out or up or down heh..who cares?! Before the draft I was pretty optimistic (I still am)..just based on the FA Mac signed and together with the new CS my expectation is a modest 10 game win season...prob not good enough for playoffs but maybe Gase and Greg W make that happen. ANY Players he just drafted actually doing well will be a pleasant surprise and big help..but let's see Judging Mac OTOH means looking at his entire body of work over 5 years to build this Franchise properly ...he has done poorly imo and is an Average GM at best...one 10 win lucky season and no playoffs..Toilet Bowles was no help but Macs demand for Defense at the expense of offensive scorers and playmakers killed us His draft selections over the entire sample of 5 years has been for sh-t ...most posters here could a better job ...go look at the number of posts breaking down the players he could have gotten the past 48 hours ( see Contrails and NCjets for that) Instead it's year after year of Adarius Stewart's and Lorenzo Maudlins...or more recently players with character issues and or injuries ... other than Sam and maybe Adams we are "moving forward " on the lowest octane\ snails pace with his drafts...he won't address glaring weaknesses like center..will the OL hold up with present players and Osemele and Sams old sidekick at tackle ??..I sure hope so I've said this before..he IS on the hot seat and prob why FA was a homerun for him Then he reverts back to form in April ...never learning from previous drafts how to get better..It's just a frustrating ordeal for fans He needs to go ..finish his work here and go back to Scouting
In the NFL, it begins and ends with the offensive line. I don’t care how good you think our draft or free agent signings are, our offensive line sucks and continues to suck- I see no significant improvement. And if that doesn’t improve, everything else is moot Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Is there any indication, supported by anything of substance that Chris Johnson, or even his brother are having doubts about MacCagnan? Repeating unsupported gossip does not count.
Did you notice the little two letter word "if" in my statement? You must have because you bolded it. That means I'm not sure that the Johnson Boys feel this way, but IF they do, they should fire him now. I don't know where all the rumors are sprouting from, and it may just be media fanning the flames, so I can't provide you with any proof, nor do I need to because my statement is predicated on conjecture. If you don't buy into it, fine, but don't challenge me to "prove" it, there's nothing to prove beyond what I said. For the record, if I were the owner I would fire Macc now if I had someone who I thought was better because I don't think he's the answer.
Well, that was the essence of my question. People here are running with assumptions that appear to have no basis in fact. There's another thread with over 200 posts about MacCagnan being in the hot seat and there's not a whiff of substantiation for any of it even though a good percentage of the posters seem to believe he'll be canned this week.
I think most of that discussion was the pros and cons of him being canned, not necessarily everyone believing he WILL be canned. One can only hope.
I think you're being generous with the grade (B-) after reading your comments, and you omitted some moves. The all pro LG: I don't agree that he was terribly terrible last year, but didn't have a good year, but there are legitimate reasons for that. If I remember correctly, the year before he was awesome as was their LT, but last season his HC switched their blocking scheme to one for which he was not well suited, and he was injured. He is now healthy, in great shape, and back in the blocking system in which he excelled. The Jets got Osemele and the Raiders 6th round pick in exchange for the Jets' 5th round pick. I'd rate this move at least a B+ if not an A. There are some questions, but imo not serious ones Osemele should wind up being a steal and the move along with his play an A+, but until that happens can only give it a B+. The all pro ILB: While I love him as a player and person, think he will be great in helping change our culture and our D, and wished the Jets could have drafted him when he entered the draft several years ago, I would have given this move an A+. But because this was more of a luxury-type signing, and it took precious time and cap space away from pursuing some prime needs in FA, I have to give this move a C. The gaping hole at C: For the 3rd year in a row, this has been a gaping hole. The previous two cheap attempts to fill it were pretty much horrible. There were two very good/elite Cs available in FA. Mac made no attempt to sign either. With all the cap space we had and with two excellent Cs there for the signing, it is inexcusable that Mac didn't even make either one an offer. This in and of itself is a fireable offense imo. This put him in the position of basically having to trade down, acquire a 2nd round pick, getting very lucky and having one of the top C prospects fall to us at the #3a pick, or having to roll with Harrison or sign a camp cut. No good GM puts himself into this position where there is such a gaping hole and where it is so important in protecting the QB. While Mac could still sign a camp cut who could wind up being better than Harrison, we can't count on that as Mac is on record as saying he was fine with Harrison starting at Center. If I could give Mac a grade lower than F -, I would. The top RB in the NFL: While we apparently had no competition for Bell's services, Mac signed him to a very good deal. Bell gives our offense instant credibility, and assuming that the OL will be able to open some holes for him, should be a huge help to Sam and to our offense. A #2 CB: Mo Claiborne was good two years ago. This past season not so much, so the Jets didn't re-sign him. Last year's big FA signing, Trumaine Johnson was pretty bad. Jones, Clark, and Robinson, while having some potential, have done little to suggest that they are ready to contribute in a major way. Darryl Roberts was perhaps our best CB last year, but is thought of as only being a #3 or depth-type CB. It's good that he was re-signed, but not as the #2 CB. Ronald Darby, Steven Nelson, Darqueze Dennard or Bryce Callahan would have been better signings. Because he didn't sign one of those players, just as with C and Edge Rusher, Mac put himself into the position of having to draft a player at this position to try to upgrade the competition and depth. Mac waited until the 6th round to take a CB and took one who has only played 5 games over the last two seasons, had serious knee surgery on the same knee each of the last two seasons, and may not be that good anyway. F- Slot CB: Anthony Poole is not a bad signing, but he certainly wasn't the best slot CB available in FA. He is perhaps better vs the run and a better tackler and blitzer than he is pass defender. Bryce Callahan or Darqueze Dennard would have been better signings as slot CB. C- Edge Rusher: Anthony Barr would have been a good signing if he had stuck with the agreement. I find it hard to believe that there were no signs that he was unsure about this deal, no hesitation in answering, no change in voice inflection that would have shown that he wasn't totally sold. Even if there were no signs, he did back out. Because by the time he backed out, Zadarius Smith, Preston Smith and Shaq Barrett were wooed by other teams and signed elsewhere, and the Jets missed out on signing one of the top Edge Rushers available. Mac still could have signed Shane Ray even with the Mosley signing, but without the Mosley signing, there would have been the cap space and perhaps the inclination to go after Justin Houston As a result, the Jets were left with no upgrade at Edge Rusher, and were left waiting until the draft. Because this was considered a strong draft for Edge Rushers, this didn't seem awful, even though the best GMs hedge their bets and sign FAs at positions rather than going into the draft having to draft a player at a position of need. He drafted one with the #3a pick who could turn out to be a good pick, but there are character concerns, work ethic concerns, and he could wind up being a bust, and there were a couple of other Edge Rusher prospects who might have been better prospects and fits. Further, having to draft him to try to fill the Edge Rusher need resulted in the Jets missing out on the last viable C prospect to start this year in Connor McGovern. I'm going to give this an F initially, but if Polite is as good as advertised, is sincere in his apology/statements, works hard and overcomes his immaturity or character concerns, he could be an A, and raise the overall handling of the Edge Rusher position to a B. F The top slot WR: I do love the signing of Jamison Crowder. I have a feeling that Gase had a lot to do with this signing, as in his offense he wants WRs who excel in YAC, and that is Crowder's forte. He is coming off a serious injury, but hopefully should have no lasting effects. This signing should be huge for the Jets' offense and for Sam Darnold in sustaining drives, scoring points and giving the Jets better field position. A
The top player in the draft: Q. Williams might be the best player in the draft, but it remains to be seen if he winds up the best player from his draft class in the NFL or even the best player for the Jets' D. He certainly seems to be NFL ready and pretty much a finished product that should be able to make an immediate impact, whereas Josh Allen is nowhere near being a finished product, and it will probably be at least half a season or even a year or two before he really becomes an impactful, dominant edge rusher. For that reason, it's understandable why Mac would have taken Williams over Allen, as he needs his #1 pick to make an immediate impact. That said, Mac is known to have a philosophy or penchant for taking the BPA in the draft, especially in the 1st round, even when there is no need at that position. Thus, it's more of an obsession, rather than looking at things on a case-by-case basis. Further, Mac made a BIG deal about the Jets needing/wanting to trade down in this draft, and he either failed or simply chose not to accept another team's offer so that he could once again claim the BPA in the draft. As several posters have noticed, however, where has taken the BPA each time gotten the Jets? Have they made the playoffs recently? Have they had even one of the top 10 defenses? No. Getting back to Williams, there are some concerns as Williams only started for one season, is said to have disappeared in big games, and created 0 TOs. He is a high character, high motor-type player, studies film, and was a leader at Alabama his last season so there is room for excitement. In spite of the Jets needing an elite Edge Rusher for 13 seasons, in spite of the fact that most often in the 3-4 D alignment the Pass Rushing OLB is the most important position, and there was a great prospect sitting there at the Jets' pick with HOF potential, the Jets took yet another interior DL pretty much in an effort to pressure Tom Brady. If Williams plays anywhere near his draft ranking and potential, he could be a dynamic force for the Jets, and be another Aaron Donald-type DT success story. The problem is that very few reach that level. Because OL are stronger, have better technique and are smarter in the NFL, Williams may not have anywhere near the same success playing NT, and may play 3-4 DE a big chunk of the time, which would only result in taking one of Leonard Williams or Henry Anderson off the field. It's possible that the 3 of them can be together on the field a lot if they move to a 4-man front, but who will be the edge rusher in those situations? The grade for this move/decision could wind up anywhere from a C to an A++. For now, in spite of the fact that taking Allen would have taken one of the 3 best players in the draft in terms of talent and potential and filled a long-standing need for the Jets, I will give it an A, but if Allen winds up being one of, if not the best edge rushers in the NFL in a couple of years, and Williams is just yet another pretty good DT who isn't minding folks of Aaron Donald, this grade could dip to a C or lower. A Future LT: I doubt this is the case. It's certainly possible, as he has the size, long arms, is able to slide/move, and did very well at the Sr. Bowl, he is raw and has a lot of work to do. His ceiling could be RT or even OG. I will be happy if he just winds up being a quality backup OT for both the LT and RT positions as that would fill a big need, but I'm hoping that because of his run blocking prowess, that at a minimum, he will become our future RT. He may even be able to supplant Shell this season. We need him to be capable of filling in for Beacham, however, should the unthinkable happen, Beacham get injured and have to miss several games. Shell can adequately man the RT spot and Compton may be able to do the same if Shell has to miss some time. As our future LT, I would give him a C or C- grade at this point. As our future RT, I would give him at least a B+ if not an A. Overall, I'll give this pick a B for now. B Overall Grade for the Offseason: Even though the grades might average out to around a C or C-, because Mac has done nothing to address our biggest needs heading into the offseason: the gaping holes at C and #2 CB, and his move to address Edge Rusher is questionable, I'm giving Mac a D, which is really a failing grade. He must go.
I would grade this offseason pretty well. There are still positions that need help but it is unreasonable to expect everything to be in place by now. I've always chosen to take a wait and see attitude and will continue to do so but am more optimistic today than I have been following any draft I remember. Right now I have bigger questions about the coaching staff than I do about the guys they have to work with. I see no advantage in forcing a change at the GM spot while still hoping (against hope?) that the team would get a guy to run the entire football operation.
If I didn't have 55+ years of experiencing the Jets somehow always falling short, I might be inclined to some optimism. Good for you that you are, but note that I don't call you crazy or delusional or other names. You're entitled to your opinions, as am I and everyone here. Judging from your posts you seem okay with waiting some indeterminate amount of time - several more years? - to see a winner, but I am not. And I don't want just a one or two year run, I want to live to see the makings of a dynasty, preferably one that can make everyone forget the Cheatriots, so I'm not okay with the job Macc has done. He's at best a C- and that's giving him credit for trading up for Sam, and adding L. Williams, Adams and Q. Williams, all of whom I disagreed with him taking. He still has shown no plan or blueprint and that's the biggest failing of all. Because of that I don't think he'll build a winner, especially a sustainable winner. Maybe if they hired a strong, successful football guy to be Pres. of Football Ops who could design such a blueprint and ensure Macc followed it, then Macc might be worth keeping, but under the current set up, no. I've laid all of my reasoning out uncounted times in uncounted threads, but I can't predict the future any more than you can. As I said before - you see the cup half full, I see it as half empty.
You're setting the bar low, even by Mac standards. It was a disastrous draft outside of Williams which was a layup. Mac is an abject moron who has proven this for 5 years now. Should've taken Winovich or Ferguson over Polite every day. None of the baggage.
Not sure if Mac deserves as much heat as he is getting. I am highly disappointed that he didn’t add a center in the draft, but he didn’t ignore the entire OL unit. We added a probowl offensive playmaker, a probowl LG, an excellent slot WR, an absolute stud at MLB, and landed 2 players in the draft to help generate a pass rush. Don’t underestimate our defense. This unit looks like it has the makings of being very good. Leo and Q in the middle with Jenkins, Jachai, and Copeland on the outside is a nice inside outside core. The outside could obviously still use a major edge threat, but there is always next offseason or perhaps Jachai, Jenkins, and Copeland step up. You never know. People are also forgetting that this team was NOT one offseason away from contention. NEXT year is the year to have actual high expectations. The Jets filled several gaping holes this offseason. Let’s stop pretending like we didn’t. I give him a solid B Would have been an A if we drafted a Center and landed Barr.
I'm no kid either, having seen my first game in the Polo Grounds. I might also point out that while today my cup might be half full, I'm usually looking for a refill. I have always thought at draft time that there are no guarantees and actually believe the draft is overrated because of that; how many college superstars have we seen completely bomb out when facing the big boys? My biggest reservation now is about a bigger unknown than anybody in the draft - it's the coaching staff. I was not a fan of the Gase pick but have no choice but to keep an open mind going forward as I will, optimistically, with the draftees.
Well and there's that aspect too, which we're told Gase was Macc's choice, so again, does he really know what he's looking for? I totally agree that the CS is major question mark - they could be really good, but aside from Gase's losing record in Miami, I'm very concerned about the ability for him and Williams to work together without creating a massive rift in the team. This has all the makings for dysfunction. Of course both guys also have a lot of knowledge and experience so it might work out great, but it could also meltdown. If they don't come out of the gate really fast, there could be real trouble.
It takes 2 to 3 yrs to see how a draft ends up being. Ill see it live and make a decision then. Seems like we took some chances this yr if a few work out it will be a great draft we shall see
No one is pretending that we didn't fill holes this year, and no one is claiming that we could fill all our holes this year, so the strawman arguments need to be set aside. Mac does deserve the heat. Going into the offseason, we knew we had glaring holes at RB, C, CB #2, Slot Corner, LG, and Edge Rusher, as well as other needs, and upgrading overall team depth and speed. He had over $100 million in cap space to use. He could have signed Bell, Morse or Paradis, a #2 CB, a slot CB, and a WR. To his credit, Mac signed LeVeon Bell to a very favorable contract, Jamison Crowder a very good slot WR who is an excellent fit in Gase's offense, and traded for Osemele to fill the LG hole. Mac has done absolutely nothing to address the C position other than re-signing last year's backup C Harrison. At CB #2, there were 4-5 good CBs that Mac could have signed, and he passed on all of them. His idea was to re-sign our 3rd or 4th CB from last year Darryl Roberts. Roberts should have been re-signed, but as depth, not as the #2 CB. He drafted an oft-injured CB in the 6th round who probably won't make the team even if he can stay healthy. He signed the 3rd best slot CB. He did nothing in FA to address Edge Rusher other than re-sign our backups from last season. To his credit, Polite may be a great pick, but in taking him, Mac missed out on the last possible C prospect who could have started at some point this season in McGovern. Polite certainly has the talent, if he has the work ethic and character to develop. If he does, he probably will be a better player than McGovern, but that still does nothing to protect Sam by filling the glaring need at C. Instead of addressing our glaring holes at C, CB #2 and Edge, Mac chose to sign Mosley. Don't get me wrong, I love Mosley's play and his leadership, and he should help make our D a top 10 D, if not top 5, but he was a luxury signing, and should not have been signed over a C, CB#2 and Edge Rusher. ILB was not really a need. Yes Mac upgraded that position and the defense in signing Mosley, but the fact remains that he did nothing to address glaring needs, and that is inexcusable. He could have at least signed 2nd tier prospects to compete with Harrison and Roberts and help depth, and he didn't even do that.
Not that we don't need a C and some OL upgrades. And it's a bit of a bummer to not address them, for what it's worth we certainly can't overlook the safety valves we've added. Bell being the bigger name, but Crowder, Wesco has potential, Montgomery is versatile and can cause problems. If Darnold can take the next step as far as getting the ball away quicker to these guys, coupled with his ability to extend plays we may still see the OL play a little better this year. I still have my fingers crossed that we find a gem or 2 in UDFAs. Never heard of him till today but im rooting for Toa Lobadaun to develop into a solid center, and he has experience at every OL position at USC... I can hope can't I?
